Jon651
Member
Tell that to Herbert Hoover...
Are you going to purchase at 25% price hike
- Thread starter dben002
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Tell that to Herbert Hoover...
Under expenses you forgot S&Ws.
Jon651
Member
Here's the thing about US manufacturing that people always seem to forget - we were at the pinnacle for approx. 100 years, from the Civil War to roughly 1970 and we thrived. But have we suddenly become poor in the last 50+ years since then? American industrialists large and small have already figured out that we don't need to make every little thing to continue to have a great economy, because we don't make silverware, DVD players or plastic Easter eggs and yet we still thrive. We have less than 5% of the world's population yet we also have the largest, most robust economy on the planet - so I think we were doing pretty good without having to start a global trade war.
The tariffs imposed by the administration are not reciprocal in the sense of being equal to tariffs imposed by other countries on our goods. They are, rather, tariffs on other countries in percentages that our administration calculates are needed to eliminate trade deficits.
Reciprocal Tariff Calculations | United States Trade Representative
wsj.com
There are a lot of reasons for trade imbalances. The world economy is complicated.
My view is that the administration's blanket imposition of tariffs on the rest of the world will harm the world economy, and will harm the US economy. I think this will soon be clear. I think, looking back at this moment, there will be a consensus that it was a foolish thing to do.
(And I don't understand the logic at all of placing 10% tariffs on countries with whom we have a trade surplus.)
Well, let's hope the tariffs work on other countries the way they've worked on you. Your scared. And that is the point of all this. These tariffs will impact other countries far more than they will impact us. That my friend brings people to the table. The rest of the world wants their goods in America. So they'll make it here or cut the tariffs they impose on us. Nobody seems eager to acknowledge the trillions of dollars already committed to investing in USA manufacturing and infrastructure by foreign entities. I wish people would catch their breath and step back to look at big picture. I'm not trying to convince anyone I'm simply trying to alleviate some anxiety here. Some of you guys are really rattled over this.
S&W's are investments and insurance.
These tariffs will help negate the advantage gained with sweat shops, child labor, ecological destruction, and a myriad of other practices that are not allowed and acceptable here...I'm OK with that.
DWalt
Member
I have enough guns. It would have to be a giveaway situation to get me to buy anything more. I have not bought anything for about three years, and should be selling off what I now have.
LVSteve
Member
Not a chance. Look at the way the US Trade Representative document is written. It essentially treats ANY factor that reduces the sale of US goods as a tariff. Thing is, many of those factors are not about to change, EVER. Couple of examples.
Ruger and S&W sell very little in the UK because firearm ownership is extremely restricted and handgun ownership is outright banned. Do you think US tariffs are going to change that? No, neither do I.
The French buy very few cars from the US. Have you seen the rural roads in France? Most US cars and SUVs are too big. Oh, and then there is the price of gas across the whole of Europe. Add to that US cars require extensive changes to the lighting systems to meet European standards...just as European cars do to meet USDoT standards here. Do you think that overnight French roads are magically going to get bigger to accommodate Escalade XLs and the price of gas be halved? Nope, not happening.
That we have a large trade deficit with the rest of the world is not in doubt. I'll let others present evidence on how much of that falls on US corporate greed and how much on the US consumer.
I am amazed at how many people think we have to wait to see what happens. We've been through this before. In 2017, at the beginning of his first term, Trump imposed wide-ranging tariffs on a bunch of countries. Admittedly, not as comprehensive as those announced yesterday, but still a lot.
Of course, at the time, all of the doomsayers claimed that it would start a trade war, ruin the economy, and impoverish Americans. What actually happened? A slight increase in inflation, and a slight economic downturn, that lasted about a year. And then the economy came back like gangbusters and was flying high until COVID hit.
Learn from history. It's a pretty good teacher.
Of course, at the time, all of the doomsayers claimed that it would start a trade war, ruin the economy, and impoverish Americans. What actually happened? A slight increase in inflation, and a slight economic downturn, that lasted about a year. And then the economy came back like gangbusters and was flying high until COVID hit.
Learn from history. It's a pretty good teacher.
Apparently you're unaware of how many really large corporations that used to be American no longer are - they are global multinational corporations. Those corporations will do actual math to figure out opportunity costs and/or cost-benefit analysis. If the cost of doing business in the US means no or limited profitability over the medium term, they'll simply stop marketing here and reduce existing production to meet demand in remaining markets - the EU market is bigger than ours, as are populations of rapidly growing economies all over SE Asia (half the world's population) where consumer demand has grown exponentially.
At the same time, one of our most profitable exports is ag product; there are a number of growing economies in South America and Europe that will be all to pleased to sell far more ag products at lower cost than tariffed US products.
It happened that I was part of Country Team at the US Embassy in Manila the last time we picked a tariff fight, then with China. The Agricultural Officer and his counterparts suddenly had to try to find other markets for (previously) shiploads (yes, shiploads) of China-bound sorghum, soybeans, and wheat already on the water. Several eventually found regional markets for the products, but at substantial losses. That's one tiny example of immediate impact of sudden, unilateral tariffs.
Simple approaches to complex matters lead only to complex problems.
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That's a Bingo! Limited just how big the .gov could grow, as was intended by the "Original 18th Century Dead White Guys." Joe
Like the Articles of Confederation? Those didn't work either and were replaced by the Constitution along with a way to amend the Constitution as things change.
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GypsmJim
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I'm all in, anxious to wait, and hoping for the best.
I'm also an old fart. I have NEVER bought a foreign car. I guess I'm stuck with all the Chinacrap and Japanese electronics, but if I could buy an AMERICAN TV at double the price I would.
My Dad spent time in the South Pacific. His ship was hit by a Kamikaze. When my sister came home with a %^$#@ Toyota I thought he would cry. THAT helped cement my ideals, but that's another story.
There is more to all this than meets the eye. It's the CEOs and the stock market. Remember when the Dow hit 4,000 and it was joyfully celebrated? How did it get to 40,000?
Our business leaders ripped us all off by sending our jobs overseas to get cheap labor. They didn't care about American jobs or American people - just the stockholders and their golden parachutes. The North American Free Trade Agreement is another debacle. We citizens are not to blame for that.
Personally I own no stock. My investments are all guaranteed percentages. Sure, I didn't make as much as I could have, but I look at it like the Tortoise and the Hare. I have no worries and a surplus every month.
We all need to stop worrying. It will all work out in the end. The USA is resilient. If we could live thru the pandemic years, we can live thru anything.
I'm also an old fart. I have NEVER bought a foreign car. I guess I'm stuck with all the Chinacrap and Japanese electronics, but if I could buy an AMERICAN TV at double the price I would.
My Dad spent time in the South Pacific. His ship was hit by a Kamikaze. When my sister came home with a %^$#@ Toyota I thought he would cry. THAT helped cement my ideals, but that's another story.
There is more to all this than meets the eye. It's the CEOs and the stock market. Remember when the Dow hit 4,000 and it was joyfully celebrated? How did it get to 40,000?
Our business leaders ripped us all off by sending our jobs overseas to get cheap labor. They didn't care about American jobs or American people - just the stockholders and their golden parachutes. The North American Free Trade Agreement is another debacle. We citizens are not to blame for that.
Personally I own no stock. My investments are all guaranteed percentages. Sure, I didn't make as much as I could have, but I look at it like the Tortoise and the Hare. I have no worries and a surplus every month.
We all need to stop worrying. It will all work out in the end. The USA is resilient. If we could live thru the pandemic years, we can live thru anything.
Tariff wars lead to unintended consequences. Many people have for years wanted to buy a Toyota Hilux. You know the truck, the one Top Gear tried to kil and couldn't. Well, they can't. At least not here. Why? Because Germany put tariffs on American chickens. I'm not kidding.
There's a YouTuber who does a great video on this. I can't link because of adult language. Go to YouTube and search for The Fat Files. Watch the video titled: The chicken conspiracy robbing Americans of the Toyota Hilux. Interesting stuff. Also he touches on why American trucks have gotten so big. Hint: It ain't because we have more stuff to haul these days.
There's a YouTuber who does a great video on this. I can't link because of adult language. Go to YouTube and search for The Fat Files. Watch the video titled: The chicken conspiracy robbing Americans of the Toyota Hilux. Interesting stuff. Also he touches on why American trucks have gotten so big. Hint: It ain't because we have more stuff to haul these days.
Pop warned me about the debt when it was 1 trillion. We need to change the "trajectory" of the debt. Step 1 kill the graft. Step two get the gov't under control. If Newt and Bill could balance the budget then it should still be possible and then instead of trying to spend the "windfall" actually pay down the principle a little. I got an amortization schedule and showed my wife that if we paid the $45 in principal, we eliminated the $545 payment altogether. $56k in principal was $180k if paid off on time (at 10.586%). We paid 11 payments a month by doubling the payment. Paid it off in 2.5 years. The retirement fund today was the debt we paid off over 30 years ago. This country needs to do the same.
Not pay the impossible sum of $104,000 for every citizen, but reverse the avalanche of interest that will become insurmountable very quickly. Was it Einstein who said the only amazing thing he ever saw was compounding interest. It's now 37 times the amount it was when he warned me. Born in 1921 it was 28 billion in 1928.
After WW2 it was 250 billion and the top tax rate was 93% federal . We actually tried to pay down the debt. Then we started buying votes with debt. In my mind that is treason.
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I'll stand on my statement that a tarrif is a tax without representation...Media has nothing to due with the facts.
Markets not fair? Don't buy their product.
BTW - A fair is in the fall and they sell cotton candy...
Markets not fair? Don't buy their product.
BTW - A fair is in the fall and they sell cotton candy...
Not really sure what the point is with the guns and cars analogy?
There are lots of things other countries won't/don't import from us. I'm guessing China doesn't import American tea ( that was a joke). There are also many things the US doesn't need to import from others. My point is this is the start of a negotiation. The president today said every country on the list contacted his office today. He's playing hardball.
Well , I can assure you I'm aware of way more than you give me credit for. Or that you give anyone credit for. It must be difficult to be the smartest guy in any room you enter. Left leaning people such as you will chirp about everything that is wrong with everything a conservative politician does. I can assure you there is not a corporation in the world that doesn't want their products in the most dynamic economy in the history of the world. But that doesn't fit your narrative.
LVSteve
Member
Just watched that video. It is absolutely hysterical.
According to this, Toyota had no problem circumventing the tariff you call a chicken tax, and the trucks were available. How did they do it? By adding an AMERICAN MADE pickup box. Imagine that, the unintended consequence was using product made in the USA.
Toyota Hilux - Wikipedia
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