The Beretta 21A (Bobcat) Inox — my new BUG.

[Echo40]

I've had one for years. Very reliable and amazingly accurate. Eats hi velocity ammo well, and seems to love the modern uppercut and punch stuff. Neat little backup. I carry mine often.

Really? I've heard that both Punch and Uppercut don't feed reliably due to the longer cases. In fact, I saw some videos of both rounds being tested in a Beretta 21A, and they wouldn't feed at all. They always got stuck in either the chamber or the breach.

 

[bufco]

Punch and Stingers have long cases and will stick in the chamber sooner than typical cases like mini mags. When I say sooner, that means after the chamber has been well cleaned, such as it is when carried. Mine will run several mags of either, then the chamber gets dirty enough than I start to expect ejection failures. With mini mags it will go over 100 rounds before it acts up. Either way it doesn't matter since with a clean chamber it is 100%. And that's how I carry it.

 

[Echo40]

Hmmm... I'll have to buy a box of Punch and see how it runs then, thanks!

 

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Congrats on the beretta nice gun I have it in a 32 acp I totally agree with you on the thick grip I like it fits my hand well View attachment 786993

These are nice but rated for ONLY certain ammo cause of frame cracks. The primary ammo restriction for the Beretta 3032 Tomcat is a muzzle energy limit of 130 ft⋅lbf (176 J). You must use only new, factory-loaded ammunition in the proper caliber (.32 ACP) manufactured to industry standards (SAAMI or CIP), and avoid reloaded or remanufactured ammunition. Exceeding the 130 ft⋅lbf limit can cause expensive, irreparable damage to the firearm, such as a cracked frame. I don't have that issue with my ALL Steel CZ 70's and Walther Manurhin PP in 7.65 Browning or my Browning 1910/71 with both 7.65 and .380 uppers. I can shoot 71, 73, 85 and even go as high as 100 gr bullets in the .32/7.65 Browning. One other thing. European guns and ammo is made for .308 bullets Over here ours is loaded with .312 diameter bullets.My CZ's wouldn't even fully function with reloads loaded to .32 acp specs. FTE and some FTF's.

 

[johnnywitt]

I had a 21a in .22lr. It was a good gun but it would occasionally jam no matter what brand of ammo I tried. Ironically it jammed, as in failure to feed far more often than getting a dud round. You can see it here compared to my LWS32. I ended up using it as trade fodder.

However, being enamored with the little Beretta guns, I ended up getting a 950bs in .25acp. While it is still ever so slightly larger than my LWS32, it has been 100% reliable. It's loaded with Buffalo Bore which gives me the same muzzle energy as the .32.

I had a 21a in .22lr. It was a good gun but it would occasionally jam no matter what brand of ammo I tried. Ironically it jammed, as in failure to feed far more often than getting a dud round. You can see it here compared to my LWS32. I ended up using it as trade fodder.

However, being enamored with the little Beretta guns, I ended up getting a 950bs in .25acp. While it is still ever so slightly larger than my LWS32, it has been 100% reliable. It's loaded with Buffalo Bore which gives me the same muzzle energy as the .32.

Is the Seecamp reliable? I used to have one in the '80's and it was 100% with Silvertips.

 

[johnnywitt]

Hmmm... I'll have to buy a box of Punch and see how it runs then, thanks!

Punch is excellent in revolvers, but oftentimes it will cause Malfunctions in Semi Autos. A USUALLY better choice is CCI Velocitors because they are 40gr and feed like a RN even though they are HP ammo.
The Punch is a flat nose at like 29 grains. Don't get me wrong, I use punch in almost all my 22RF Revolvers. It's excellent ammo and if it runs in your Semi Auto- great!

 

[johnnywitt]

I would suggest the 25 ACP as a first choice but nothing wrong with the 22 LR either.

Paul Harrell (RIP) would agree. Me too. It's good to carry a 21a in .25 and practice with another 21a in 22LR. The S&B 50gr FMJ is IMO the best 25acp round along with the Remington UMC FMJ coming in second ( I know this is hard to believe with Remington)

 

[Echo40]

Punch is excellent in revolvers, but oftentimes it will cause Malfunctions in Semi Autos. A USUALLY better choice is CCI Velocitors because they are 40gr and feed like a RN even though they are HP ammo.
The Punch is a flat nose at like 29 grains. Don't get me wrong, I use punch in almost all my 22RF Revolvers. It's excellent ammo and if it runs in your Semi Auto- great!

Upon looking into the matter more carefully, Federal Punch appears to function flawlessly in a Beretta 21A, provided that it is clean. Every ammo test I've seen on YouTube in which someone tests Federal Punch out of a clean 21A, it functions flawlessly. It's only went someone does a video in which multiple types of .22LR ammo are tested with the Federal Punch coming up last and thusly fired from a dirty gun do malfunctions seem to occur.

I ordered a box a few days ago so that I can test it out in order to ascertain that my 21A is no exception to the observed rule, but I'm pretty confident that it's going to feed/function just fine.

Paul Harrell (RIP) would agree. Me too. It's good to carry a 21a in .25 and practice with another 21a in 22LR. The S&B 50gr FMJ is IMO the best 25acp round along with the Remington UMC FMJ coming in second ( I know this is hard to believe with Remington)

Meh, .25 ACP is weaker than .22LR and significantly more expensive. Keep im mind that one of the attractions of .22LR was the low price. Otherwise, I would have just stuck with .380 ACP.

 

[johnnywitt]

Upon looking into the matter more carefully, Federal Punch appears to function flawlessly in a Beretta 21A, provided that it is clean. Every ammo test I've seen on YouTube in which someone tests Federal Punch out of a clean 21A, it functions flawlessly. It's only went someone does a video in which multiple types of .22LR ammo are tested with the Federal Punch coming up last and thusly fired from a dirty gun do malfunctions seem to occur.

I ordered a box a few days ago so that I can test it out in order to ascertain that my 21A is no exception to the observed rule, but I'm pretty confident that it's going to feed/function just fine.



Meh, .25 ACP is weaker than .22LR and significantly more expensive. Keep im mind that one of the attractions of .22LR was the low price. Otherwise, I would have just stuck with .380 ACP.

.25 is not weaker than .22LR out of a short barrel. Ask John Browning. People look at the velocity on the 22LR Box and think they are getting the listed rifle test barrel velocity. 25 is centerfire and has a thicker more consistent brass case which gives significantly greater reliability than an 19th Century RF Round with a heeled bullet.
I love 22RF, but it is what it is.

 

[YeshuaIsa53]

The .22 and .32 Beretta "cats" are easy to pack and I like both.

 

[Echo40]

.25 is not weaker than .22LR out of a short barrel. Ask John Browning. People look at the velocity on the 22LR Box and think they are getting the listed rifle test barrel velocity. 25 is centerfire and has a thicker more consistent brass case which gives significantly greater reliability than an 19th Century RF Round with a heeled bullet.
I love 22RF, but it is what it is.

I'm not going by the printed velocities, I'm going by online ammo tests with Chronograph Readouts. Even out of a handgun, the lighter weight .22LR predictably tends to travel at a higher velocity and penetrate deeper than the equivalent .25 ACP load.

Case in point, if you look up ammo tests of the Federal Punch .22LR vs .25 ACP, the .22LR tends to chronograph over 1000fps out of a Pocket Pistol while the .25 ACP tends to chronograph closer to 900fps.
Furthermore, the .22LR typically gets 10+" of penetration in gel where the .25 ACP struggles to get 9".

 

[wxl]

Have carried mine a few times, reliable with MiniMags

 

[johnnywitt]

I'm not going by the printed velocities, I'm going by online ammo tests with Chronograph Readouts. Even out of a handgun, the lighter weight .22LR predictably tends to travel at a higher velocity and penetrate deeper than the equivalent .25 ACP load.

Case in point, if you look up ammo tests of the Federal Punch .22LR vs .25 ACP, the .22LR tends to chronograph over 1000fps out of a Pocket Pistol while the .25 ACP tends to chronograph closer to 900fps.
Furthermore, the .22LR typically gets 10+" of penetration in gel where the .25 ACP struggles to get 9".

50gr Harder True Jacketed Bullet with S&B gets 11" avg
22LR 29gr Soft Lead Bullet with Fed Punch
Reliability with 22LR isn't even close to a vetted 21a or Model 20 with S&B or Remington 25acp.
The whole reason that John Browning developed the 25 was he wanted a Centerfire Cartridge equivalent to or slightly better than the 22LR.
The only reason there's a debate here is cost and availability of ammo. So, I'm a guy that carries a 43c, 317's & an LCR with Punch or Velocitors. When I carry a small auto it's usually 32acp or 25. I don't carry small autos in RF, but you do you. Johnny Witt out.

 

[bph9]

Is the Seecamp reliable? I used to have one in the '80's and it was 100% with Silvertips.

My Seecamp .32 is only reliable if you pull the trigger very quickly. This allows the hammer to snap all the way back. Milking the trigger slowly will cause it to misfire every time. In all honesty (and I seldom make excuses for poor designs which this is) but the pistol was never meant to be a slow fire target pistol. Use it as a close range off the muzzle blaster (it has no sights) and pull the trigger quickly and it does work.

 

[rug357]

Back in my college days when I didn't have any money and there was no legal way for civilians to carry I saved up and purchased a new Jennings J22 and a box of CCI Mini mag solid. I carried that pistol in my back pocket in a home made pocket holster. It was carried with full mag (6 rounds) and safety off but not chambered. I carried that pistol for about 6 years.

 

[681ismyfavorite]

Is the Seecamp reliable? I used to have one in the '80's and it was 100% with Silvertips.

100% with sthp, hydra-shoks, gold dots, and wwb. Haven't tried anything else.
*** the only "malfunction" I've had was years ago when the last fired round would stovepipe after it was empty. This happened 2 or 3 times over years of shooting. I don't consider it an issue as the gun is empty and you have to rack the slide with a new magazine anyway.