Ford Top Loader Idea

Ghost Magnum

Ghost Magnum

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I originally wanted a 5 or 6 speed transmission for my Torino and 427 FE. Considering the transmission tunnel has already been butchered. Forcing it to fit wouldn't be that big of a deal. But the top loader has a legendary reputation. The after market 5 speed transmission has a lot of criticism. Now I'm not taking internet reviews as gospel. The 6 speed will be much harder to fit. And I never measured for a custom driveshaft. So I'm leaning towards old school 4 speed top loader transmissions. My car originally came from the factory with one. And ford offered the Torino with big block FE engine. So all I have to do buy replacement parts. 390 or 428 mounts will work for my 427. The 427 and top loader transmission will go into my car like my car was made for it. Lol because it was! No real custom made parts needed. I am going with hydraulic clutch though.

The problem is if someone ordered their car with a 427 and a top loader. That top loader would have been a close ratio. Factory spec close ratio transmissions can cost more than 2000. Vanilla top loaders don't cost that much.
I had a idea to buy a basic 4 speed top loader and rebuild it myself. I found close ratio gears I can buy. What do y'all think?
 
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GA 1911 said:
I have raced toploader transmissions in my old 1965 Mustang (19 years). I guess that I have rebuilt six of them.

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The main difference in a big-block toploader and a small-block 4-speed is the shaft from the transmission to the clutch. The big block has a thicker input shaft.

The interior gears and shafts are mostly the same. I doubt the big block cars had a close-ratio since it was mostly for high Rpm engines.

I think a wide-ratio toploader will be good for your car. The toploader is built for a Boss 429 and will last a long time.

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That is a nice car. It great to see a mustang coup get some respect. Most goes for fastback cars.

Well, if I go for top loader. I'm going to rebuild it myself. I just don't really know what to do exactly.
 
A close ratio is hard on clutches and you would need low gears to take advantage of because you stated in earlier posts you wonted to leave hard. A wide ratio is better on the street with a lower low gear. A close ratio is for road racing. Shelby had a ranch about 35 miles east of me in Red River county.I did a carburetor overhaul and tune up on a Ford Bronco 302 for him. Around late 1964 GM went on strike and used Ford top loaders in some Buick Grand Sports. The bell housings had 2 different bole patterns. All you had to do was use a Ford clutch disc. Some hp 421 Pontiac's used them also.
 
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Yeah, wide ratio transmissions are pretty common. I might go that route.
 
4barrel said:
A close ratio is hard on clutches and you would need low gears to take advantage of because you stated in earlier posts you wonted to leave leave hard. A wide ratio is better on the street with a lower low gear. A close ratio is for road racing. Shelby had a ranch about 35 miles east of me in Red River county. Around late 1964 GM went on strike and used Ford top loaders in some Buick Grand Sports. The bell housings had 2 different bole patterns. All you had to do was use a Ford clutch disc. Some hp 421 Pontiacs used them also.
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Yeah, I want my car to be a good performer. But I don't want to fry a clutch and pop a wheely at every stop light.
 
I always feel like a downer on your threads and am sorry if I am.

The transmission ratio usually depends on the final drive ratio.

This is tire size and gear ratio, usually, a low ratio rear (numerically bigger) gets a close ratio. The reason would be first gear has enough reduction to get you going.

The close-ratio helps keep the engine in the power band of the power curve. Where the wide needs a big power range.

If you want the nostalgia of a four speed that's ok, if you want to go fast and consistent I'd go C-6. Using a proper (to fit the engine build) looser converter and shift kit no manual will match it.
 
Second the C6 recommendation. Most top loaders are small imput spline/shaft and if you put any kind of sticky tire on your car behind a serious torque monster..you will break it. (Been there..and done that) Thats why Ford went to the larger imput spline/shaft for the BBFs. (Big Block Fords)
Don't get me wrong..I love a manual shift, and all of my road race cars are sticks...but if you are mainly using your Torino for street cruising and an occasional rip...a good C6 will be a better choice. You can still "manually" shift it if you like..:)
 
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4barrel said:
A close ratio is hard on clutches and you would need low gears to take advantage of because you stated in earlier posts you wonted to leave leave hard. A wide ratio is better on the street with a lower low gear. A close ratio is for road racing. Shelby had a ranch about 35 miles east of me in Red River county. Around late 1964 GM went on strike and used Ford top loaders in some Buick Grand Sports. The bell housings had 2 different bole patterns. All you had to do was use a Ford clutch disc. Some hp 421 Pontiacs used them also.
Click to expand...

It is incredibly rare to find someone who knows you could get a Buick GS with a toploader 3 speed. The torque from a Buick would shred a 3 speed Saginaw. VERY rare as it would have been a bare bones GS to be ordered with a 3 speed stick. The key is to use a later 4 or 5 speed with overdrive. I have a Super Turbine 400 in mine. Dual stall speed torque converter. 1,300 and about 2,700 on high. And a special 3.0 first gear set, and a 1.75 2nd gear. The 550 lb/ft and 6,500 rpm shift points make it work. 3 grand at 80 mph. Tops out above 160. Does 140 at 5 grand. Thats with a 3.08 rear end. I have always wanted to swap in a 2.56 and go to Bonneville and try and break 200 with my front spoiler put back on.

So it wasn't the strike, it was the torque that they had to work around. Buick rear ends also had bigger carrier bearings, and larger ring gear bolts to handle the torque.

Can you build it as a wide ratio, and 4th is overdrive? Then 3.55 gears or so? 27-28" tall tires?

And SCJ automatics came with Quadra Jets, so they could idle.
 
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My Dad had a top loader out of a small block mustang in his '66 F-100. FE 390. The truck was originally a 352 with 3 speed and column shift.

Never an issue and I ran the hell out of that truck. (he "borrowed" the trans from me)

The truck followed me up the coast and now resides at a body shop down the street from here. I might could get you the bellhousing and internals but the trans is long gone. Shipping would get expensive though.
 
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I'm taking into consideration everything y'all are saying. Even the C6 ideas. Every vehicle I ever owned has been a stick shift. It second nature to me at this point.
 
I seem to recall reading somewhere that a C6 transmission sucked up about 60 horsepower to run it. I'd look into a bulletproof built C4. Lots of the Buick racers run built up TH350s or TH200R4 so save the power losses of the TH400.
 
Racer X said:
I seem to recall reading somewhere that a C6 transmission sucked up about 60 horsepower to run it. I'd look into a bulletproof built C4. Lots of the Buick racers run built up TH350s or TH200R4 so save the power losses of the TH400.
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The torque multiplication and speed of shifts make the auto the king of the drag track.

A built C4 could be a good choice I think it has some advantages.

I'm not a Ford person, not a hater just don't have lots of experience.

Now Chevys and some Buicks were talking my language.

I had a mild 350 chevy that would kill turbo 350 transmissions. The first to second shift would always give a bit of rubber...

The 400 was much harder to kill and with some aftermarket parts could handle a stout big block even with nitrous.

Lots of rails were running the Powerglide and I think they were used on 1/8th mile tracks too

Buicks, had a friend into them big, lots of 455 cars and parts. Even had stage 2 factory heads making crazy torque.

Today it's easier to make power than ever before. The chassis set up is better today.

We were quarter-mile base and my (rich)friends were running low 8 seconds or better in the late 1980s...
 
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