"It does reduce case capacity which effects charge weights specifically for that bullet. DO NOT DEVIATE."
Direct from Hornady Manual, but what do they know?
Direct from Hornady Manual, but what do they know?
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Short .45-70 brass from Hornady
- Thread starter David Sinko
- Start date
Jim Watson
Member
Well, they don't know the difference between affect and effect.
I consider the difference trivial UNLESS you are loading at the utter maximum where a little less working volume would matter.
Trying to use the dadblasted short stuff for conventional loads is the great aggravation. Regular .45-70 is not overly long in the first place. A new Remington case here measures 2.094".
I consider the difference trivial UNLESS you are loading at the utter maximum where a little less working volume would matter.
Trying to use the dadblasted short stuff for conventional loads is the great aggravation. Regular .45-70 is not overly long in the first place. A new Remington case here measures 2.094".
Roadranger
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So far the point of the shorter brass has been missed. The brass is shorter so that the loaded round with the longer bullet will work through the action of the Marlin 1895 or an 1886 Winchester, just as the handgun rounds are shorter so that they will not stick out the front of the cylinder. I've been loading these since they appeared. First one must segregate the Hornady's from the WW's, R-P's, etc. If one desires to load the LeverEvolution 325 bullet in the 45-70 for use in a Marlin or Winchester lever gun, the Hornady cases are the way to go. You'll have to adjust the expander die, seater die, and crimp die accordingly(actually, if one loads all cases, two sets of dies might be better). Simply use the data provided by Hornady for the 325 bullet and go. For other bullets and/or rifles the traditional brass will work fine. The 325 bullet will work in single shots loaded in traditional brass. Send me the Hornady brass if you don't want it. Bob! PS. Hornady did the same thing with 450 & 444 Marlin brass for the same reasons.
Last edited:
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
"It does reduce case capacity which effects charge weights specifically for that bullet. DO NOT DEVIATE."
Direct from Hornady Manual, but what do they know?
Absolutely true. The reason is not because of the shorter brass but because the bullet is longer, MUCH LONGER, which causes the seating depth to increase, or case capacity decrease, however you want to look at it, making less room in the case for powder.
This is the main reason I do not shoot too heavy for caliber jacketed bullets.
They simply sit too deep in the case to make it worth while having them.
Case in point: Awhile back, folks were talking about a 400gr 44Mag load. I said: "Why?" With a 300gr bullet, even from a carbine, you are losing 300fps at least. Short distance, okay, got that. The whole idea of the carbine though is to take advantage of the longer barrel getting a flatter shooting round. More velocity and such. By using the heavier bullets, case capacity is reduced to the point that you lose all you could gain. Just me though.
FWIW
Effect can also be used as a verb.
As a verb, to effect means "to bring about, lead to a result"
DGNY
Member
Well, well - thanks for reading my post. I was trying to be polite. Please also note my concern, indirectly stated by me, that a blanket statement about deep seating can and will lead a novice to trouble, because such a reloader will tend to overlook any effect of a greater jump to rifling; and he will plow ahead with both deep seating AND short run through leade.
This is my last post on this subject.
Regards,
Dyson
This is my last post on this subject.
Regards,
Dyson
Maximumbob54
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I suppose this is a good reason for buying the latest up to date books. I had recently bought the #7 book just as I heard about a new one. My loss. 
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Don't need no stinkin' manuals! All you need is to listen to folks from upstate New York!
OP
David Sinko
Member
If I do decide to load normal heavy cast bullets into these short cases, will they function through the Marlin action when fed through the tube? I have shot some really weird stuff through my Guide Gun, like .457" round ball and 255 gr. RNFP sized .454" for the .45 Colt, and gotten very good results, but I treat the gun as a single shot when I use these loads. The owner of this brass wanted some plain base 405 gr. hard cast bullets at somewhat less than full throttle. I figure I can't go wrong if I leave just enough air space to hear a charge of IMR 4198 rattle around when I shake the cartridge. Is there specific loading data for these short cases and normal bullets? I load .45-70 single stage so I may as well re-adjust my two dies and stop complaining.
Dave Sinko
Dave Sinko
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Dave,
How much short are the cases from 2.105"?
How much short are the cases from 2.105"?
Maximumbob54
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Don't need no stinkin' manuals! All you need is to listen to folks from upstate New York!
Them's the very folks mama told me I should keep at arm's length for sure!!!
mkk41
US Veteran
Wow! Didn't know they was shorter! I got a box of Leverlution or whatever it's called from a co-worker who bought it before I told him not to fire it in his 1884 Trapdoor. I traded him for 20rd of my pet Trapdoor , cast bullet handload. Traded him because I also have a Marlin 1895 I figured I could shoot them in.
OP
David Sinko
Member
So I decided I'm going to reload this stuff with a hard cast 405 gr. bullet. This Hornady brass holds 4.0 grs. less IMR 4198 than does a normal case. I seat the bullets and try to crimp, but my RCBS die will not crimp the short case! The handle of the press comes to a dead stop somewhere on the down stroke and I can not apply any kind of crimp. Now I am thoroughly disgusted, as I have loaded all 20 and don't feel like pulling all 20 of them. In desperation I grab a .45 ACP taper crimp die and it at least removes the flair from the case mouth and will allow the cartridge to chamber. This is far more trouble than it's worth. Not only does Hornady get away with making a short case and still calling it ".45-70" but I can't even load it with .45-70 dies!
Dave Sinko
Dave Sinko
