My first Springfield M1a: any advice appreciated

BB57 · Sep 9, 2022

growr said:
To find out just how accurate your M1A can be.....try some M852 or Federal Gold Medal Match.

These can be replicated with 42 gr. IMR-4895-168 Sierra Match King bullets and most seem to use Federal Large Rifle primers.

If your rifle won't shoot these well it is not going to shoot....

Randy

M852 is well suited to the M1A and is loaded to 2550 fps in the M14/M1A’s 22” barrel (and the powder charge is nominal, start a bit low and work up to the 2550 fps velocity). It’s also well suited to shooting out to 600 yards.

It goes subsonic at about 830 yards, and the boat tail on the 168 SMK doesn’t transition well so accuracy starts to fall apart past about 750 yards.

But it’s still my favorite .308 bullet in anything that I normally shoot at 600 yards or less, and it’s my benchmark load when looking at the accuracy potential of a .308”.

Where I deviate from the M852 recipe is in using IMR-4064, but loading to the same velocity. I think it’s a bit more accurate.

lrrifleman · Sep 9, 2022

Great information! When you start reloading (and you will), utilize IMR 4895, IMR4064, or AA2520, and try to replicate M80 Ball (147/150gr FMJ), M852 (168 gr HPBT) or M118/118LR (172gr FMJBT/175gr HPBT) for starters, then develop your loads!

Caution: don't try to replicate the HOT M118LR loads, try not to exceed 2700 fps.

jake1945 · Sep 9, 2022

As stated above, I recommend firing only military (U.S.) ammo. My Texas Divine M1A did not like reloads at all! Also.get a flash hider with the bayonet lug, it just looks better. Also, a company makes a clone selector switch that is just for looks, It does not turn your rifle into full auto! You may have to cut the stock to mount it tho. Never put oil/grease in the gas recoil system. It causes extreme carbonizing!

Hair Trigger · Sep 9, 2022

Grayfox said:
Buy a good butt stock cleaning kit and put it in as a JIC measure But be careful as some of them are cheap junk. Avoid the Madsen junk. However, use a good coated cleaning rod and quality cleaning supplies for normal cleaning. I like the G.I. style ratcheting chamber brushes.
Some handy tools to have are:

Gas Cylinder Wrench
A 3/8" combination wrench preferably with a 6 point box end.

These are Great Rifles! Enjoy!

Krogen said:
Here you go! The M1 Buddy is probably what you're referring to. It works very well. As noted elsewhere, it's wise to get a muzzled rod guide protect the crown. The flash hider does help somewhat, but a dedicated guide is better. He also has ratcheting chamber brushes and other goodies.

Home — The Original M1 Buddy

Grayfox, your DMR rifle looks great (wood stock at top) and similar to mine. The breech block gizmo I have is the white thing in the picture. The rest is a standard M1A cleaning kit, it will fit in the stock behind the butt plate.

BB57 said:
Accuracy wise, expect about 3-4 MOA with M80 ball ammo. With match ammo or hand loaded equivalent you should be able to get 2 MOA with a rack grade M1A and maybe 1.5 MOA with a load it likes. 1 MOA and sub MOA accuracy really requires a match barrel, the stock to be bedded and the gas system and barrel band be unitized to reduce the horizontal and vertical dispersion.
Springfield Armory makes a scope mount that replaces the stripper clip guide and in that case it’s not a bad idea to get the plastic receiver insert to keep the bolt open while cleaning.

BB57 said:
M852 is well suited to the M1A and is loaded to 2550 fps in the M14/M1A’s 22” barrel (and the powder charge is nominal, start a bit low and work up to the 2550 fps velocity). It’s also well suited to shooting out to 600 yards.

It goes subsonic at about 830 yards, and the boat tail on the 168 SMK doesn’t transition well so accuracy starts to fall apart past about 750 yards.

But it’s still my favorite .308 bullet in anything that I normally shoot at 600 yards or less, and it’s my benchmark load when looking at the accuracy potential of a .308”.

My rifle is a Loaded model has the National Match barrel, and I must have got a good one, because it shot 1-1/2 MOA at 200 yards with NATO Winchester 147 grain. I only shoot my reloads in it now, and after some dinking around with COL and powders and bullets and brass, I can get 1-1/2 MOA at 600 yards; my load is LC brass, Winchester Large Rifle primer, H4895 at 41.2 grains and a Sierra 168 Match King, loaded 0.003" off the lands. My stock is not bedded, I have done nothing to the rifle itself except to lightly stone the sears for a smoother trigger, but did not alter the pull weight. The book I have on the M1A is Kulek and McKee's "The Complete M14 Assembly Guide", and I highly recommend it.

The scope mount I have is a Fulton Armory Brookfield type DMR mount; it uses the stripper clip dovetail and a bolt on the receiver left side, and has a nylon tip button that snugs down on top of the breech. Once mounted it won't budge. I'd probably go with a slightly differnt scope today, but what I have works really well, it's just a bit heavy on an already heavy rifle. It's a 6-25x56 Millett, has a lighted mildot reticle and a 35mm tube, is 2nd FP. The turrets are calibrated in MOA. I made the cheek riser, which slips over the stock and laces in position, the rear sling swivel keeps it in place. I added a short piece of picatinny rail at the front swivel to use for mounting a bipod.

BB57 · Sep 9, 2022

RCL-09 said:
Not much to add as all have given sage and accurate advice.

The one thing I did to my M1A Loaded was change the flash hider to one with a bayonet lug and purchase the appropriate bayonet. Absolutely not needed but it tends to upset snowflakes...

jake1945 said:
As stated above, I recommend firing only military (U.S.) ammo. My Texas Divine M1A did not like reloads at all! Also.get a flash hider with the bayonet lug, it just looks better. Also, a company makes a clone selector switch that is just for looks, It does not turn your rifle into full auto! You may have to cut the stock to mount it tho. Never put oil/grease in the gas recoil system. It causes extreme carbonizing!

My M1A Supermatch was an early 80s vintage M1A with mostly TRW military parts and it of course had a flash hider with a bayonet lug. And I ended up buying an Eickhorn made M6 bayonet for it. Totally impractical but ‘Murica!” So why not.

When I got back into the M1A business a few years ago, I bought one that came with a muzzle brake rather than a bayonet lug equipped flash hider. I got a proper flash hider for it, but then took it back off.

The muzzle brake actually works pretty well, not in the same class as the tri compensator on the BM-59, but not bad and much better than the standard flash hider.

That matters for me eye wise, as as after tens of thousands of rounds fired in sling prone position, floaters started becoming an issue and softer recoil is important in keeping them at a minimum.

BB57 · Sep 9, 2022

Hair Trigger said:
My rifle is a Loaded model has the National Match barrel, and I must have got a good one, because it shot 1-1/2 MOA at 200 yards with NATO Winchester 147 grain. I only shoot my reloads in it now, and after some dinking around with COL and powders and bullets and brass, I can get 1-1/2 MOA at 600 yards; my load is LC brass, Winchester Large Rifle primer, H4895 at 41.2 grains and a Sierra 168 Match King, loaded 0.003" off the lands. My stock is not bedded, I have done nothing to the rifle itself except to lightly stone the sears for a smoother trigger, but did not alter the pull weight.

1.5 MOA is about right with a match barrel and no other work.

I used to accurize M1 Garands for DCM shooters in the late 1980s and 1990s. The metal work took care of most of the vertical dispersion and the bedding took care of most of the horizontal dispersion, but barrels were a big factor in over all group size. Even excellent condition WWII and Korean era barrels were a lot less accurate than the barrels used for rebuilds in the 1960s. Mass produced barrels improved a lot in that 20 year time span. But to really maximize accuracy it needed a decent match barrel from either Douglas or Krieger at the time.

A decent match barrel is important on the M1A as well.

I have a JAE-100 stock for mine, but I don’t use it as it really doesn’t improve the accuracy as the rack grade barrel is the limiting factor - and I like the GI look.

If I ever decide to set it up as a DMR type rifle I’ll re-barrel it, probably with a Criterion medium weight match barrel.

zeke · Sep 10, 2022

Haven't shot them for awhile but have 2 of SA M1A's. The standard one is early to mid ninetys SA with TRW chrome lined barrel and fiberglass stock. Very accurate with open sights. The second is a 16 in Socom with pistol grip adj stock and cheese grater removed.

The socom's sights are good for close up and fast, not so good for longer range precision. The socom' s accuracy improved with recut muzzle crown (very hard steel) and more loosely fitted standard handguard.

Imo, there be many advantages to reliable/accurate 30 caliber semi with excellent open sights mounted right over the bore. But very unlikely will ever be carrying one with a compliment of loaded mags very far.

Most of the mags owned are checkmates, but seem very hard to find now?

squidsix · Sep 10, 2022

We still have the M14 in the Navy

I deployed with the M14 as a young Sailor, and bought a couple of M1a rigles over the years. My favorite is a 16” SOCOM model that I “un-SOCOM-ed”.
You will find the oprod rattles around a little when the bolt is closed. This is normal.

Mike 139 · Sep 10, 2022

American1776 said:
Just got a nib Springfield M1a. I’ve wanted a ‘battle rifle’ for a long time and I chose this one.

I’m still learning about this rifle. It seems well made, wood furniture, full length barrel. I did notice that the operating rod (charging handle?) rattles when the bolt is closed. Lots of play there, but it seems to catch the bolt securely when working the action. Is this rattle normal for this model?

Also: what should I know about in terms of what to watch for, what ammo to use and not use, and how to maintain? Any info is much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Congratulations on a fine Rifle…..It has a lifetime warranty and should have come with a TM 9-1005-223-12 or later Manual outlining maintenance….

I would get a Dewey Delrin Muzzle guide and one piece coated Rod and you’ll be good to go….Stick with Mil-spec 147-168 gr. Ammo and use either lubriplate or a synthetic grease where the Manual shows….SA can be contacted @ 1-800-680-6866 and they can answer any questions you may have…

The last time I fired one was in 2014…I had mounted a Scope on my Best Friends Rifle, He was going to Tennessee to hunt on family property….A Guy a couple benches over came over and asked for help….He handed me a SA GI Collector model made in 1999 only ….I pulled back Bolt back and it had a TRW barrel….I said to my Buddy,” 8 clicks @ 100..right?”, He couldn’t remember….The ammo was either Winchester or Federal White box, 147 gr. I can’t remember…
Anyway, I came up 8 clicks from bottom and put 5 rounds into an inch and a half @ 100…. My Buddy smirked and said “ You can be on my Rifle team anytime” …I replied, “ You can be on mine Anytime”
It was the last trip to the Range for him, lost him 1-17…He did get his Tennessee Deer though….I snapped a pic of the target Shot that day with the M1A…it’s the second target on left, Center Diamond….

Krogen · Sep 10, 2022

What do you guys recommend for sights on an M1A? I'm not ready to go with optics, but my "older eyes" make the front sight blurry. I can see the sides pretty well, but it's tough to plant the bull on top of the post with precision. I'm OK at 100 and 200 yds, but 500 yds is a real problem.

I've tried a 0.75 flip down diopter and a Gehmann adjustable aperture. The owner of Shooting Sight suggested a 0.5 diopter, but he's out of stock at the moment. He also makes a rectangular aperture for the rear sight that seems intriguing. I haven't bought that yet either . . . .

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Old eyes and a stiff neck make prone shooting a challenge.

Hair Trigger · Sep 10, 2022

Krogen said:
What do you guys recommend for sights on an M1A? I'm not ready to go with optics, but my "older eyes" make the front sight blurry. I can see the sides pretty well, but it's tough to plant the bull on top of the post with precision. I'm OK at 100 and 200 yds, but 500 yds is a real problem.

That's when I gave up and put a scope on mine. At 68, I can still hit at 200 yards consistently with the iron sights; less so at 300, and forget anything past that. Scoping the rifle opened up 500+ for me. I've hit steel plates to 800 with my M1A, and have gone to 1125 with a custom AR 6.5 Grendel. It doesn't hurt to have a small version of the Hubble strapped to the top.

ISCS Yoda · Sep 10, 2022

We still have the M14 in the Navy

And a good thing, too. Force protection needs the ability to reach out and touch someone in a way that 5.56 NATO in M16s cannot replicate.

flintsghost · Sep 10, 2022

The best mount for optics of any kind on an M1A is the Bassett Tool and Machine mount, made and sold in Dripping Springs, Texas. I did the original R&D for Bassett on his picatinny rail mount when he was developing it. I still prefer the original low that he custom made for me way back when. But I have both. I used to go down to Dripping Springs and visit with him every now and then. His daughters manage the business now but they have somebody else making them. Bill Bassett, past away several years ago from cancer. His mount is the lightest weight and can be removed and reinstalled, going back to within a MOA or so of zero every time.

Baxter6551 · Sep 10, 2022

I only have one M14 - an early Armscorp Silver Spring address with all TRW parts. Sadlak scope mount. It is indeed an accurate rifle and creates smiles at the range.

jdlii · Sep 11, 2022

Krogen said:
What do you guys recommend for sights on an M1A? I'm not ready to go with optics, but my "older eyes" make the front sight blurry. I can see the sides pretty well, but it's tough to plant the bull on top of the post with precision. I'm OK at 100 and 200 yds, but 500 yds is a real problem.

If you have the standard aperture, you may want to try a National Match, hooded, aperture. There are a couple of different sizes and there are probably other options available from commercial manufacturers.

Some of my fellow shooters changed out their National Match front sights for standard front sights, as they aged. They maintained that the wider, standard front sight was easier to line up and provided better target acquisition.

My guess is that you are aware of "smoking" or "blacking" the front sight to avoid glare caused by sunlight. The iris type aperture, either on the lens of your shooting glasses or available in a separate pair of shooting glasses, is also a viable option.

I always wore Knobloch shooting glasses when I shot service rifles. The lens was "optical center" of my prescription and worked well with exception of the aperture leaving scratches on the lens.

Good luck and good shooting!

Gene L · Sep 11, 2022

Mine weighs 10 pounds and it's not a loaded one.

Nevada Ed · Sep 11, 2022

That rife is well made and easy to field strip, in order to maintain it.

When over seas, we had to check the butt plate for rust, check for carbon build up and the port hole, for proper gas transfer as well as making sure after
a lot of shooting, that the flash depressor, was still tight and not loose.

If it has a sling, it will help in accuracy, when you learn how to use it in all the shooting positions
if you get into that type of shooting.

Enjoy your new rifle.

Model5 · Sep 11, 2022

I’ve noticed with my loaded model it performs better with 168gr plus bullets. It will shoot 150gr reliably but groups will tighten tremendously with heavy bullets. Also my recommendation if you decided to purchase and install a scope. Mechanically zero the scope before taking it to the range. That way when you set all the hardware and Lock the mount into the receiver you can manipulate it to ensure your Mount is perfectly parallel to the axis of the bore. Then windage will be a matter of actual windage not correcting mechanical error in the set up. That’s all I have. I’ve enjoyed both the nm sights and shooting with a scope on mine. It does well enough that a 10” plate at 300 yards becomes boring because it will hit it every time.

BB57 · Sep 11, 2022

Krogen said:
What do you guys recommend for sights on an M1A? I'm not ready to go with optics, but my "older eyes" make the front sight blurry. I can see the sides pretty well, but it's tough to plant the bull on top of the post with precision. I'm OK at 100 and 200 yds, but 500 yds is a real problem.

I've tried a 0.75 flip down diopter and a Gehmann adjustable aperture. The owner of Shooting Sight suggested a 0.5 diopter, but he's out of stock at the moment. He also makes a rectangular aperture for the rear sight that seems intriguing. I haven't bought that yet either . . . .

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Old eyes and a stiff neck make prone shooting a challenge.

B Jones Sights used to sell a small diopter lens that fit in the NM sight aperture and you could get them in various powers like .3, .5 and .7. It worked well for guys with age related reading glass type issues, as long as they used just enough to let you bring the front sight into focus.

Unfortunately I think he passed away a few years ago.

——-

Jdlii isn’t wrong about a larger aperture possibly helping, but it depends on the condition you have.

If it’s age related issues with close focusing, then a smaller aperture actually helps as the smaller aperture increases your eye’s depth of field.

NM apertures come in two sizes. Most folks use the .0595” aperture size as it works well on bright as well as cloudy days.

The smaller .052” aperture increases your depth of field if you wear reading glasses so it’s a plus for old guys.

However, if it is some other eye condition that causes issues in low light conditions, then your best bet is the regular non NM aperture which is .070” in diameter.

——

BJones Sights used to sell a small diopter lens that fit in the NM sight aperture. It worked well for shooters who wore reading glasses provided they didn’t go crazy and use more than they needed to see the sight. IIRC it could be had in .3, .5 and .7 diopters. Unfortunately, I think he died a few years ago, and I am not sure if anyone is making anything similar.

dsf · Sep 11, 2022

RCL-09 said:
I had the ARMS18 and it was a disaster as it would not clean ejection and the empty case would get jammed under the mount.

I was really bummed out because it was IMO the best option as it related to size, durability, weight, etc.

Have you experienced such malfunctions?

I haven't had those issues, no. Just guessing, but when I bought the Scout the SA factory extractor didn't work from the 1st shot. I checked it and there was absolutely no edge to it. Struck me as a casting that skipped the final machining process. Having a few Garands and a Hahn Machine M14 I keep GI extractors around and swapped out. It may be that the better "bite" pulls them out at a lower angle and clears the mount?

My first Springfield M1a: any advice appreciated

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