Short throw vs long throw?

In my readings here I keep seeing references to a change in the hammer design of M&P/model 10s.
A few newbie questions = What is the practical difference between the short vs long throw design??
Is one "better"/more desirable than the other from a shooter's perspective?
When did this change take place & how can one tell the difference?

Thanks, Bill

C&R Bill said:

In my readings here I keep seeing references to a change in the hammer design of M&P/model 10s.
A few newbie questions = What is the practical difference between the short vs long throw design??
Is one "better"/more desirable than the other from a shooter's perspective?
When did this change take place & how can one tell the difference?

Thanks, Bill

Click to expand...

Um. It took place over time, long ago. It all started back before WWII in 1940 when S&W came out with a replacement for the K22 Outdoorsman. They called it the K22 Masterpiece, we call it K22 2nd model or K22/40. We also call it hens teeth or unobtainable.

What it did was change the internal geometry of the lockwork to generate a shorter hammer stroke that took less time to fire. It means you don't have to be as steady for as long. It also means the action won't be quite as smooth or as slick. There are notable exceptions.

After WWII, S&W set about changing all their guns to the new and supposedly better short actions. The only gun to come out of WWII with the speed or short action was the K22, this time the postwar Masterpiece, aka 3rd model. All the other guns were in transition to that, but it took time. They still needed to feed their kids, so they kept making short action guns of all makes. Soon they had the K32 and K38 in production, guessing 1947. And they built a ton of M&Ps, which soon were converted. The big move and then production resulted in the N frames being converted. We tend to call them Model of 1950 and such. By about that time, all were short action.

Ways to tell goose from gander. Generally all the prewar guns except as noted were long action. The easiest way is to look at the hammer. Most of those with a single thickness are long action. Picture taking the hammer out of the gun and stacking 2 or 3 on top of each other. If they're flat enough to do that, its probably a long action hammer. If the hammer spur is wide and won't stack flat, its a short or modern action.

One isn't really better than the other. Well, except in the case of some guns that are worth a bundle more from the early years after the war. They're pretty scarce, maybe even rare. We like them.

I've read that the new short actions were very controversial in the late 1940's. Some, like Bob Nichols, who preceeded Warren Page as Gun Editor at, Field & Stream, disliked the new action. Others preferred it. I like both, and the newer style can be made so smooth that it doesn't matter a lot.

Hammer profile is the easiest way to distinguish the two actions. Hammers on the short throw guns have a deeper scoop on top of the hammer spurs, giving the impression that the spur springs from a little lower on the hammer body. The long throw actions have hammers with a shallower scoop. Compare the following two hammer profiles.

This is a long throw M&P from early 1947.



This is a short-action K-38 Masterpiece from early 1948:



The deeper scoop in the hammer of the short action gun is characteristic of the so-falled "speed" hammers seen in the short-action postwar Masterpiece revolvers. S&W actually mentioned the new "high-speed" hammer on the gold picture boxes in which they shipped the new short action guns.

The company made the argument that the shorter hammer throw made for a faster lock time and, in consequence, better accuracy because there was less opportunity for barrel wobble while the hammer was falling.

Ignoring the scant production of barely 1000 short-action K-22s in 1940, all short action production postdates WWII. The modern K-22 Masterpiece (K-22 Third Model) was the first postwar gun that featured the short action, and those began to be produced in 1947. The fixed sight K-frame .38 M&P models continued to be made after WWII until serial number S990000 (round number), at which point the last 10,000 M&Ps were produced with the short action. All C-prefix M&Ps are short action revolvers. That change came in April of 1948, which is also close to the time the adjustable sight K-38 Masterpiece began to be produced in volume. The K-32 Masterpiece began to ship in volume in early 1949, and those were all short action revolvers as well.

In the N-frames, the long-throw actions continued to be produced through 1949 and into early 1950, and then the new Model of 1950 N-frames introduced the short action. All Model of 1950 N-frames incorporate a short action.

I'm a big fan of the long action guns because, as a class, the actions just feel smoother to me. But that doesn't mean short actions can be condemned as stiff or rough. Some of my short-action revolvers have enviably smooth actions, though others of them are not as smooth as most of the long action guns that I like. You'll hear assertions that one action is better than the other for a variety of reasons, but I'm not sure I think the generalizations mean much. The question is whether the action in a single gun is satisfactory by itself, and both long action and short action guns can be tuned to silky precision.

ADDENDUM: Hmm, slow to the party, I see. While I was writing this War and Peace-length response, good answers were provided by others. I'll leave this post here because I think the photos show a quick way to make the distinction.

Here ya go

http://smith-wessonforum.com/blogs/pace40/10-what-s-difference.html

Thanks a bunch Guys!!!

C&R Bill, thanks for the question. I was wondering that myself. And thanks to everyone for the answers.