coil spring vs leaf spring

hotrod150

hotrod150

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I'm kind of wondering why S&W switched from a leaf to a coil mainspring in the early 1950's when they introduced the j-frame and the improved i-frame? And if the coil mainspring is indeed an "improvement", why weren't the larger S&W revolvers (K,N,& later L) ever fitted with coil mainsprings?
I just have j-frames now, but back when I had larger S&W's I kinda liked be able to fine-tune the leaf spring via the set screw tension.
 
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I've always thought that it was easier and more economical to manufacture the smaller frame to acceptable tolerances with the coil spring, but at the same time have always thought the leaf spring gave a better "feel." I seem to be able to feel a "stacking effect" as the trigger is pulled against a coil spring. There's just no accounting for feelings and perceptions though, and lots of people prefer coil springs in these and other firearms. BTW, they switched from leaf to coil at that time... I don't think there was ever a production variant of the J-frame with a leaf spring, but it would be cool to have one! :D

Froggie
 
I have always liked the leaf spring "feel" better...The nicest snubbie I ever had was a 2" Model 10, which I foolishly sold years ago.
I don't even like Ruger SA's because I have shot a few flat spring SA revolvers, and to me, anyway, there is no comparison.
A really well used N frame Smith is about as good as it gets, IMO.

I remember about 40 years ago, some people ground or filed down the stain screw to "adjust" the trigger, but I would not recommend
doing that, either...If you should ever really need that gun, you need it to work.

mark
 
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When the coil spring was introduced in the early '50s, almost everything S&W did revolved around (pun intended) cost contaiment and speedier production. Need I say more? But they weren't about to sacrafice the amazing actions of the K & N frames which included many target guns in that period. Costs were contained in other ways on those, satin finishes, deleting of the pre war cyl hold open device, deleting of polished flush sight tangs in the top strap, less serial# stamped locations, deleting upper sideplate screw, trigger guard screw, less machining of the cyl release thumb piece, deleting of the front corner cyl flute beveling, yaddy, yaddy, ya.

Much of the old pre war panache was gone.
 
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Pan ache? Isn't that what you get when your wife beans you in the head with a skillet? I think they just have Klass (with a capital K!) When I get rich and famous I want a few of those pre-War K-frames. If they can be any better than my 1948 vintage K-22 & K-38, I don't know how (but I'm looking forward to finding out!)

And yes, I think there is something inherently uncool about a coil mainspring in a high quality revolver, like a pro baseball player using a aluminum bat or something. :rolleyes:

Froggie
 
Green Frog said:
.........BTW, they switched from leaf to coil at that time...
Click to expand...

Oops, my bad. A little typo/dyslexia going on there. Obviously from the rest of the post you could tell what I meant to say.
FWIW I don't see any problem with fine-tuning the leaf main spring with the set screw adjustment, any more than with replacing the leaf spring with a lighter one. As long as it's tested for reliability, and that the screw doesn't back out (either grind it shorter, or locktite the p*** out of it).
 
hotrod150 said:
FWIW I don't see any problem with fine-tuning the leaf main spring with the set screw adjustment, any more than with replacing the leaf spring with a lighter one. As long as it's tested for reliability, and that the screw doesn't back out (either grind it shorter, or locktite the p*** out of it).
Click to expand...

Lighter replacement springs are precisely set for X number of pounds of trigger pull. If I put an 8 pound spring (1/2 pound lighter than factory) in my carry gun, I know exactly what it is and it will stay as such. When you unscrew the strain screw you have no idea what the trigger pull is or if will stay that way unless you check repeatedly with a gauge. Also increases the possibility of an accidental discharge. It may be okay for a range time gun, but real a bad idea for a self defense gun. I know of no one on this forum that advocates screwing with strain screw. But, hey, it's your gun, just be careful out there.:(
 
I feel like it has more to do with the fit and polish of the parts in the action than it does the springs.
 
When Bill Ruger designed the blackhawk he replaced the leaf spring of the colt saa with coil springs due to the leafs being prone to failure.
 
Back a number of years ago, I bought a m-29-3 nickel, and it was a beautiful gun; came with some nice leather, and to me, it was an all around good deal. Went to the range, and it had a trigger so light that it was dangerous; no FTF's, but you had no feed back at all as to when it would fire! Finally, I saw some discussion on here re strain screws, and checked it; it was about 7 turns out! Tightened her up, and bingo, a good shooting accurate hog leg.
 
Titegroups said:
When Bill Ruger designed the blackhawk he replaced the leaf spring of the colt saa with coil springs due to the leafs being prone to failure.
Click to expand...

Just as a matter of curiosity, how many S&W leaf springs have you seen that broke in use? Of all the S&W leaf springs of all sizes I've seen, seen pictured or even read about, I know of precisely one and I'm not 100% sure that even that one broke in service as I found it in a gunsmith's junk box. They are pretty stout, in my experience, just not as easily made, fitted or initially tuned. Just my experience, YMMV.

Froggie
 
Supposedly, yes the leaf springs were "prone to break".

But...I have a lot of S&W and several Colt D/As and S/As and Uberti S/As.

I have only had one broken mainspring in 39 years. It was a Colt S/A mainspring.

I like S&W and Colt or Uberti S/A mainsprings. Colt D/A mainsprings are a pain in the rear. They are difficult to lighten and still "stack-up" in D/A pull.
 
diamonback68 said:
.... When you unscrew the strain screw you have no idea what the trigger pull is or if will stay that way unless you check repeatedly with a gauge. Also increases the possibility of an accidental discharge.....
Click to expand...

If the strain screw stays put, as in lock-titing it or shortening it so that you can seat it all the way in, why would the "trigger pull" (aka spring strength) change? Also, I don't see why backing off the strain screw would increase the chances of an AD more than a lighter replacement spring would.
In any event, this is all a moot point as all the revolvers I own are j-frames.
 
hotrod150 said:
If the strain screw stays put, as in lock-titing it or shortening it so that you can seat it all the way in, why would the "trigger pull" (aka spring strength) change? Also, I don't see why backing off the strain screw would increase the chances of an AD more than a lighter replacement spring would.
In any event, this is all a moot point as all the revolvers I own are j-frames.
Click to expand...

No, what I said was you don't know what the trigger pull is unless you test it. What if it is down to 7#, 6#, 5# or it could be down to near AD and you wouldn't know it unless you have a pull guage. Then if you loctite it, you have to make sure it holds over the course of a lot if firing. It may open you up to litigation from a smart lawyer if it is ever involved in a shooting.
With a replacement spring such as Wolff the lowest they have is 8# and it will stay that way until it wears out. But, it has other properties that make it smoother that merely loosening the strain screw doesn't.
You all can do as you wish, I will stick with a known mainspring and leave the strain screws tight. I try not to risk my life on too many variables. :cool:
 
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Back when I had k-frames, I was young & dumb and I did adjust the strain screw in the course of looking for a better trigger pull. Of course, replacment springs weren't as readily available as nowadays. If I do acquire a k & want to improve the DA pull, I would probably do just like I do with my j-frames -- stick with the stock unaltered mainspring & improve things by installing a lighter rebound spring & polishing the rebound slide.
 
I don't know about the practice being used for S&Ws, but I do know for certain that some Colt revolver users would lighten trigger pulls by bending the leaf hammer spring.
 
hotrod150 said:
back when I had larger S&W's I kinda liked be able to fine-tune the leaf spring via the set screw tension.
Click to expand...

I see that others have chimed in on this, but the strain screw is not to be loosened. There is some evidence that doing so reduces group sizes. (Read the original literature with the "357" Magnum in 1935 where there are pictures shown of different groups fired with the strain screw backed out. Each one had a noticeably larger group that fully screwed down.)

In addition, loosening the strain screw can cause misfires as the primer is not hit hard enough. If loosened, it can back out under recoil.

Bad idea.
 
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