357 in BEAR COUNTRY??

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Rocky Mountains

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I take a fly fishing trip in the Rockies each summer and need a carry revolver. Black bears and moose are usually in the areas I fish. What iyo would be a good all around revolver for this situation?
Thanks for your input!!!
 
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I'm certainly no expert, but I think Moose should be of greater concern than the black bear. I've heard many suggest the .44 mag should be a minimum for bear, not sure about moose.

With that said, I'd rather have a 357, than nothing, and if I were going with a 357, I'd sure load it with the heaviest load I could find. Maybe Buffalo Bore or Corbon ammo.
 
Um...look don't take this the wrong way, but I grew up out west and have backpacked all over the west for years. I have seen innumerable black bears in the wild, I have seen a real life grizzly bear while backpacking, I have seen moose in the Sawtooths. Every single bear I have ever seen including the grizzly ran away. I once jumped a mother and her cub. They immediately ran up a tree. The point: the risk of being attacked by a bear or moose is exceedingly remote.

The second point. You ever kill a deer? I have killed a few deer, and antelope...with high powered rifles. They almost never die immediately. Deer weigh 150 pounds.

So the basic idea is --- a bear is going to attack you and you are going to stop it with a handgun. Any handgun. Let me tell you what is actually going to happen. To whatever extent that bear was angry enough to attack you, it is going to be that much more angry after you wound it with your handgun. It may actually enjoy ripping you limb from limb and swallowing your handgun whole. When I saw that grizzly I was carrying my 45 and I remember being in awe at the sheer power of the animal. As it walked (it didn't see me at first) I saw the muscles ripple under the skin. Awesome. I remember having the distinct thought that shooting that thing with my pistol would be about the dumbest thing I could possibly do in that situation.

I knew a hunting guide from Alaska who actually was attacked by a grizzly and who successfully defended himself with a firearm. That firearm was a 375 H&H rifle and he shot the bear in the head. The context of this conversation - we were talking about how dumb it is to think you are going to stop an attacking bear with a deer hunting rifle.

I like guns and I like to carry them when I am outdoors. Handguns are great protection against 2 legged animals that recognize them on sight and are deterred.

The best protection against bears is a clean campsite with your food tied up 20+ feet in the trees and all food and animal waste moved way, way out of the campsite.

If you like 357s (I do) then bring one with you. Just don't delude yourself into thinking that it or any other handgun is going to do jack if a bear attacks you.

My 2 cents...
 
I do not believe that handguns are useless in such encounters. There have been many cases in which a handgun has made the difference between life and death. Of course, there have also been many cases where they simply did not work. But to say that they are worthless is a bit misleading. I can almost guarantee you that those that say that would still carry a handgun, if given the choice, in such areas. Why then would they go to the trouble if they thought they were useless? Back to your question, carry a 357 if you have one, but a 44 mag, among others, would be superior if you can handle and shoot them o.k. I have a Ruger Alaskan in 44 mag that is quite packable that I like. wyatte
 
I'd typed about a 4 page response to this.... But decided to edit it a bit.
First: DO NOT trust a moose!!! They will kill you in a heart beat if surprised - They "usually" DO NOT run from people!!! You can probably do a search on ADN.com and find MANY instances of folks killed by moose in Anchorage. RESPECT THE MOOSE -- if one is near keep an eye on it while you're moving on.
Here's some great info on bears and bear country.

A 5 year old girl in Talkeetna once told me - "The moose look friendly and cuddly, but NEVER try to pet one." Words to live by...
 
Another bear thread..?

Sweet! :D lol

-Jim
 
If you are fishing you could expect to see mountain lion tracks. I do. The other track you will see is human.

Bear, not so much. Moose maybe. Right to be afraid of the moose. Bullwinkle J. Moose was a cartoon.

It really depends on the area where you are fishing.

I assume that you are planning for a trip next year as summer is over here in the Rockies.

When I go out I have a 44Mag with 305gr Cor-Bons. The other option is a nice 240gr LRN. My wife carries a .357 as she is comfortable shooting that gun.


Ah, the real answer...

Carry what you are comfortable with.
 
It's the damned chickadees that have me worried. They're everywhere. And they look right through you with their god-awful souless eyes. Their constant threat of Chick-A-Dee-Dee-Dee is enough to get the hair standing up on your back....Lord help me, I've never been so scared of any wild animal.

What handgun would you recommend for dealing with these nefarious ruffians. There so damned fast and small ~ I can never seem to draw a bead fast enough and fire my 500 Magnum on them.


giz
 
davidj said:
Um...look don't take this the wrong way, but I grew up out west and have backpacked all over the west for years. I have seen innumerable black bears in the wild, I have seen a real life grizzly bear while backpacking, I have seen moose in the Sawtooths. Every single bear I have ever seen including the grizzly ran away. I once jumped a mother and her cub. They immediately ran up a tree. The point: the risk of being attacked by a bear or moose is exceedingly remote.

The second point. You ever kill a deer? I have killed a few deer, and antelope...with high powered rifles. They almost never die immediately. Deer weigh 150 pounds.

So the basic idea is --- a bear is going to attack you and you are going to stop it with a handgun. Any handgun. Let me tell you what is actually going to happen. To whatever extent that bear was angry enough to attack you, it is going to be that much more angry after you wound it with your handgun. It may actually enjoy ripping you limb from limb and swallowing your handgun whole. When I saw that grizzly I was carrying my 45 and I remember being in awe at the sheer power of the animal. As it walked (it didn't see me at first) I saw the muscles ripple under the skin. Awesome. I remember having the distinct thought that shooting that thing with my pistol would be about the dumbest thing I could possibly do in that situation.

I knew a hunting guide from Alaska who actually was attacked by a grizzly and who successfully defended himself with a firearm. That firearm was a 375 H&H rifle and he shot the bear in the head. The context of this conversation - we were talking about how dumb it is to think you are going to stop an attacking bear with a deer hunting rifle.

I like guns and I like to carry them when I am outdoors. Handguns are great protection against 2 legged animals that recognize them on sight and are deterred.

The best protection against bears is a clean campsite with your food tied up 20+ feet in the trees and all food and animal waste moved way, way out of the campsite.

If you like 357s (I do) then bring one with you. Just don't delude yourself into thinking that it or any other handgun is going to do jack if a bear attacks you.

My 2 cents...
Click to expand...

First, let me say that I defer to you in all matters relating to this topic because I did not grow up out west and have not backpacked in bear country.

Second, although the risk of being attacked is remote, that doesn't excuse not being prepared in case an attack does happen.
I just listened to the interview that Tom Gresham did with Greg Brush regarding his being charged by a brown (grizzly?) bear and defense of said attack with a Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull.
This happened basically in Mr. Brush's backyard. I know that if I were to fish, hike, hunt, travel in bear and/or moose country, I would want something on my side.
Obviously a long gun is preferred, but a handgun is better than a sharp stick or a rock.
 
Having done much hunting in the Rockies, I do not recommend a .357 mag for bear/moose carry. HOWEVER...

If you are set on a .357, I would get a 4" S&W 686. Strong enough for lots of heavy loads; cylinder long enough to use longer, heavier bullets.

I've encountered moose once, which I'd not care to repeat. My dad bumped face to face into a cow and a calf moose while elk hunting- he had to play hide-and-seek around a boulder before she finally gave up and took off.
 
carry a 500 magnum...loaded stoutly...it most certainly will take bear...like any other round,shot placement is key...this round has downed bear and many animals much larger
 
Having tramped around much of the Rockies including Moose, Black Bear and Grizzly country I agree that the chances of being attacked are remote, that carrying a firearm is a very good and prudent idea, that handguns are ill suited to slamming large animals to the earth instantaneously, that a handgun is easiest to carry therefore more likely to be carried than a long gun, that shot placement is critical, confidence in your gun important and that these little "what if" scenarios are much more fun than they are realistic.
I sometimes carry a .38 special. I sometimes carry a .357 magnum. I Used to carry a .45 Colt. IMO the .357 is ideal. My reasoning is that a .357 is likely to get shot and become familiar. With heavy bullets it has ample penetrating ability. It is extremely loud (which MIGHT discourage an attacking animal in and of itself). The "instant stopper shots are spine and brain. The .357 has the oomph to bust skulls and spines and the shootability to make the head a viable target but if you miss(probable) it has sufficient penetrative capacity to do serious damage with body hits and perhaps the animal will die before it kills you.
 
The most dangerous animal in the woods walks on 2 legs, that being said an angry bear/moose/elk is nothing to take lightly. A 357 is decent protection but is NO stopper on big critters, I'd load Buffalo Bore 180 gr. JSP's or CorBon 200 gr. cast, a 4" 686 is great advice.Common sense and good woods habits will get you along way in avoiding unwanted contact of the ferocious kind. A 44 or bigger is better protection but much harder to shoot well, remember only hits count...
 
I was born and have lived all of my 71 years here in Maine except for the 3 years I spent with Uncle Sam. We have black bears and moose. I would always be cautions around any wild animal but I think I can comment on the moose question. The moose is the dumbest animal in the forest. A game warden once told me that their brain is about the size of a pea. When I was a trooper I had one run off a hundred foot cliff on to the rocks below because a car spooked him. In broad daylight. Another time, I came upon a straight section of road in a very remote part of the state with several cars backed up. Pulled around them to find mama moose and two yearlings down on their front knees licking salt off of the road. In the ditch next to them was dad, a large bull, also after the salt - he was drinking the runoff water in the ditch. Altho he kept an eye on us he never stopped drinking, even when we finally had to get out of the cruiser and actually push on the cow's forequarters to get her to move to the side of the road. Then the two yearlings and the bull followed her into a small stand of alders about as thick as your finger. As soon as they got inside the trees they stopped and turned around to watch us. I'm sure that they thought they were hiding. We have a moose season each year where they may be hunted with a permit obtained thru a lottery system. I've always felt that it's a misuse of the term "hunting." You could just about lead them up into the back of your pickup and shoot them there if it wasn't illegal, and save all of the effort of dragging them out of the woods. Call it getting meat for the table, I've got no problem with that. But hunting, it "ain't".

As far as the black bears go, they may not be as bad as the grizzly, but I've watched one come over a small hill and stand on his hind legs as he swung his head back and forth sniffing the breeze, I'm over 6 feet tall and this guy was taller than I am. I was a good distance away from him and stayed that way. A good thing to stay away from.
 
Well, I'll tell ya. . .

davidj said:
Um...look don't take this the wrong way, but I grew up out west and have backpacked all over the west for years. I have seen innumerable black bears in the wild, I have seen a real life grizzly bear while backpacking, I have seen moose in the Sawtooths. Every single bear I have ever seen including the grizzly ran away. I once jumped a mother and her cub. They immediately ran up a tree. The point: the risk of being attacked by a bear or moose is exceedingly remote.

The second point. You ever kill a deer? I have killed a few deer, and antelope...with high powered rifles. They almost never die immediately. Deer weigh 150 pounds.

So the basic idea is --- a bear is going to attack you and you are going to stop it with a handgun. Any handgun. Let me tell you what is actually going to happen. To whatever extent that bear was angry enough to attack you, it is going to be that much more angry after you wound it with your handgun. It may actually enjoy ripping you limb from limb and swallowing your handgun whole. When I saw that grizzly I was carrying my 45 and I remember being in awe at the sheer power of the animal. As it walked (it didn't see me at first) I saw the muscles ripple under the skin. Awesome. I remember having the distinct thought that shooting that thing with my pistol would be about the dumbest thing I could possibly do in that situation.

I knew a hunting guide from Alaska who actually was attacked by a grizzly and who successfully defended himself with a firearm. That firearm was a 375 H&H rifle and he shot the bear in the head. The context of this conversation - we were talking about how dumb it is to think you are going to stop an attacking bear with a deer hunting rifle.

I like guns and I like to carry them when I am outdoors. Handguns are great protection against 2 legged animals that recognize them on sight and are deterred.

The best protection against bears is a clean campsite with your food tied up 20+ feet in the trees and all food and animal waste moved way, way out of the campsite.

If you like 357s (I do) then bring one with you. Just don't delude yourself into thinking that it or any other handgun is going to do jack if a bear attacks you.

My 2 cents...
Click to expand...

There's a gentleman this summer up north of Cody, WY near Clark, WY. that might just differ with you. He was out in the sagebrush when attacked from behind, he was able to get back up after the glancing blow, an though wounded, was able to cooly fire three times with his .41 Mag and end the fight right there. Don't have more particulars such as Double Action/Single Action, bullet weight/powder charge nor shot placement. . . but score the fight Rancher 1 : Grizzly 0

Now, the 'How to Deal With Grizzly' exhibit in the Buffalo Bill Museum advocates the use of capsicum seasoning. . . even have a fine video of a trained bear being repelled on a calm day, at a walking advance by said seasoning...

As for me and my family, I'm packing my 4" 629 with 220 to 250 gn FPJ with stout loads of 296. I'll wait on the other seasoning until after it calms down a touch and stops wigglin', perhaps while residing in a nice chile concoction....
 
gizamo said:
It's the damned chickadees that have me worried. They're everywhere. And they look right through you with their god-awful souless eyes. Their constant threat of Chick-A-Dee-Dee-Dee is enough to get the hair standing up on your back....Lord help me, I've never been so scared of any wild animal.

What handgun would you recommend for dealing with these nefarious ruffians. There so damned fast and small ~ I can never seem to draw a bead fast enough and fire my 500 Magnum on them.


giz
Click to expand...


Reminds me of the South Park episode!
 
At the very least a .44 Magnum (for me anyway)

371676827.jpg
 
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