Converting 1911 to .38 Special?

AveragEd · Jun 26, 2015

Perhaps this should have been posted in the Gunsmithing section but I'm wondering if anyone here has had that done, how well it works, how much it cost and who performed the work. I've read about one or two such guns but since the articles were not about those exact guns, the information was sketchy.

My reason for wanting such a gun is goofy but I have arthritis in my hands (and everywhere else, too) which makes cleaning a revolver painful. I should mention that to me, "cleaning" means restoring the gun to new condition, cylinder face and all. 1911s are much easier for me to clean.

I also have oodles of .38 Special components - thousands of pieces of new brass, primers, hollow-base wadcutter bullets and more powder (the discontinued SR4756) that I probably will ever use in my lifetime. So to my perverted sense of what's right, a 1911 in .38 Special just makes sense.

I've looked into buying an S&W Model 52 but nice ones are tough to find, expensive when you do and S&W no longer has parts for them. Take-down wrenches alone bring big bucks these days and a lot of used 52s don't come with one for some reason.

Thanks for any help!

Ed

47knuckle · Jun 26, 2015

I have a Colt 38 super that Jim Clark converted to 38 special, probably 35 years ago. Jim didn't spend a lot of time making them look pretty, but the mechanical work he performed on these guns is truly amazing. Keep an eye out at Gunbroker, these guns do come up for sale sometimes.

reddog81 · Jun 26, 2015

I would guess that a model 52 is going to be cheaper and more reliable than a conversion.
If you happen to find a better solution please keep us updated because I like the concept.

handgunner356 · Jun 26, 2015

As said the Clark conversions are the most common, but they ain't cheap. Probably easier less expensive way to go would be with a 9mm or .38super conversion. Both could be loaded down and most likely more reliable than the Special conversion.

AveragEd · Jun 26, 2015

I have a Kimber Stainless Target II in .38 Super (sure wish S&W would make a similar gun!) but wanted to use my .38 Special components up in something other than a Model 66 or 686.

Ed

Double-O-Dave · Jun 26, 2015

Hi Ed:

Sorry to hear of your problems due to arthritis of your hands - I've got the same problem, and I am working hard to avoid surgery to my right thumb (the left one was done about 9 years ago). I have a few ideas I hope might be helpful for you:

1. if you haven't already done so, you should consult a hand surgeon. There are braces and other medical devices that help support your fingers and hand and could decrease the amount of pain you are experiencing.

2. Try loading and using only one charge hole in your cylinder, thus reducing the cleaning of all of your charge holes. I'd suggest "marking" the charge hole you are using (maybe with a "Sharpie") and rotating your way around the cylinder so you'll get even wear and use.

3. Maybe look for a single shot, break open firearm in .38/.357 like a Thompson Contender, or a single shot, break open rifle?

4. Consider a sonic type cleaner for your revolver? I have no experience with these, but perhaps someone who does could advise if this would be worthwhile.

Best of luck,

Dave

shottist · Jun 26, 2015

This can and has been done but requires a Jim Clark or the Colt factory to make it work reliably. Colt made conversions for I believe army AMU units show up occasionally but usually bring big bucks. Making a rimmed cartridge work reliably in a semi auto is a challenge. Even the Colt produced gun was I believe limited to 5 rounds and was not known for reliable feeding. Those and the Clark guns were for mid range wad cutters. Wish I could be more optimistic but silk purse and pigs ears is active here.

S&WIowegan · Jun 26, 2015

I suggest you give Clark Custom a call and discuss your needs with him. He can build you one if he wants to but you may have a long wait. The Colt factory built some of these guns to compete with Clark but they don't run worth a dam(ask how I know). He may tell you to buy one off the internet.

Good luck.

WR Moore · Jun 26, 2015

Since Jim Clark died in 2000, I'd expect it to be a really rare gun if you get him to build one. That said, the business is still active and in the family. There may be a Jim Clark Jr. You might check with them to see if they're still doing that sort of thing.

The Army Match Unit tried to solve the reliability problem by machining the rim off and creating an extractor groove. The round was known as the .38 AMU.

While you have a lot of .38 stuff, the cheapest way to go would be buying/building a 9mm 1911. The recoil is about .22rf level.

824tsv · Jun 26, 2015

"There may be a Jim Clark Jr".
Indeed there is and he is just as capable as his father was.

Looking for a Colt Clark conversion or a Colt .38 Mid Range pistol or any one of the other Master Gunsmith conversions of the past is the more expensive route. The best course of action is to look for a S&W Model 52-2. If the Model 52 you get doesn't come with a bushing wrench (they are not needed anyway-the bushing doesn't need to be cranked on tight, only hand tight) I'll send you one.

4barrel · Jun 26, 2015

A 1911 cleans up in less than 15 minutes. A new Clark 38 special is around $4ooo. They are made from 9mm & 38 supers. If you can find a used Clark they will make it new for about $300. PM me if you need info. A factory Colt & a 52 shoot the same bullet flush. A Clark needs the bullet to stick out 1/8 inch.

AveragEd · Jun 28, 2015

Thanks for all the responses and concerns as well as suggestions.

I have a Kimber Stainless Target in .38 Super, so I do have a suitable 1911 to shoot (or convert?) but just would like to be able to use some of the .38 Special stuff I have on hand. Oddly, I can shoot harder-recoiling handguns without pain so I can also use my S&W 1911PC in .45ACP. And rifle-type handguns sure are easy to clean - I have a T/C Contender with 14" barrels in 7mm T/C-U and 7-30 Waters as well as a Remington XP-100R in .223REM so I have plenty of alternatives.

Maybe I'll just start shooting my 686-3 National Match again and try not to look at the cylinder face when I clean it!

Ed

44wheelman · Jun 28, 2015

I've got a LAR Grizzly in .357 that I shoot .38 spl with... Got tired of losing all my 357 brass at the range. Essentially a 1911, as are the Coonans. You may want to check them out. The grip frame is a little bigger,but not as big as my Grizzly. At least with a Coonan you won't be limited to flush seated wad cutters.

AveragEd · Jun 28, 2015

A full wadcutter requirement is actually attractive to me as I have thousands of 148-grain hollow-base bullets on hand. And chasing brass is not something I have to do thanks to my brass-catching net that either sits on the bench beside my gun or on a tripod beside me if I'm standing.

Ed

Troystat · Jun 28, 2015

There is a pistol smith (Stan Huey) here in the S.F bay area that learned his trade from the late Bob Chow who was one of the top 1911 target gun smiths of all time. This guy does a conversion of a 1911 to 38 special, he does nice work and his guns are accurate but I think they are also pretty pricey. I would echo what the other people have said and a model 52 would be less expensive. I have shot a friends 52 and it is a really nice pistol. Good luck with your search.

colt_saa · Jun 28, 2015

Since the major issue here is that you do not want to spend time cleaning your revolver

Do you have any children or nephews that share your interest in the shooting sports? Is there a gun club or well staffed range near you?

Have one of these people clean the firearms after each shooting session.

When old Uncle Hal had his gunshop and range here in South Florida, cleaning customers guns was one of my tasks.

Engine49guy · Jun 29, 2015

Another vote for buying a clean used Model 52 as it is purpose built for .38 "Mid range" wadcutter and will cost less than a conversion and is a great gun.

Probably best to look for a 52-2 as it will have the newer style extractor .

A mechanically solid gun in fair cosmetic condition without box , docs or tools should be fairly easy to locate in the $700 range....
btw as stated previously the muzzle wrench is not a necessary item.

millerj7 · Jun 29, 2015

There are at least 5 Colt NM Mk III's on GB right now. Might be the most economical way to go, even if it needed to be tuned up a little (not likely) Last one I had cost me $600 (no magazine) $300 more for two magazines (!) and it ran like a top. Traded it for a Gold Cup even up (that was not as accurate!)
Hope this helps.
Jim

flagman1776 · Jun 29, 2015

I picked up a pre-shoot trick from a gun mag years ago... I wet a patch with BreakFree CLP before shooting & run it through the barrel & chambers, cylinder face... everything but the grips... before shooting. Then wipe again with a dry patch, which would leave just a film. This was the era of Police training with low bid (soft swaged) bullets that leaded badly. My M66 could practically be cleaned with a paper towel after.
It worked so well... At the next qualification, the Dept Armorer had a pump sprayer & a gallon jug of the stuff.

emillika · Feb 8, 2016

Anyone still looking for Colt 1960's Mid Range National Match guns and wadcutter ammo (5000+ rounds). I have a 1961 and a 1965 MRNM for sale .

Converting 1911 to .38 Special?

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