model 41 - how to replace mainspring?

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CEra

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Does anyone know of instructions to change the mainspring (main spring, hammer spring) of a S&W model 41 (m41)? It seems straightforward but was wondering if the spring is compressed in the hammer-forward position and if so, any tips to deal with it.

Also, how do you know the mainspring is good or bad?

Thanks.
 
Easy.
Grips off.
Spring saddle (bottom of spring) simply lifts up (1/8") and then out of the frame. (there is a pin thru the frame that the saddle "latches" onto, but it really does not need to be removed.
Use a suitably sized rod to seat into the hole in the bottom of the spring saddle.
Push it up and out. Careful, if you slip it will, hurt !
The hammer and guide rod will stay in place.
The spring and saddle will slide off the rod.

The spring has some tension on it in the forward position.

The next obvious question is WHY do you think the spring needs replacing?
 

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What is the gun doing to make you think it needs a new spring? Its not always the culprit. There is a diagram on the net showing how to strip a M41 down. Look at it 1st is my suggestion to you.
 
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Of all the parts on a M41, I've never seen, heard or witnessed one of those going bad. I suppose it could break - but again, I believe that would be very rare. If it is not physically broken, I would assume it is good - unless someone shortened it in an effort to lighten up the action. You can count the coils on it and compare to a new one. Off the top of my head I can't
recall how many coils a stock one has, but if you do a search I'm sure you could find out.
 
It is an interesting question.
I've seen M41s run sluggish and unreliably even with the lightest of the Wolff reduced power recoil springs.
It made me wonder if the mainspring was heavier than it needed to be.
The argument to "just use CCI SV" isn't really an acceptable solution, if we learned anything from the 22lr drought.

If anyone is using a reduced (modified?) mainspring in conjunction with a reduced power recoil spring (other other tricks) to improve function, it would be good to know.

Jim
 
leinster lad said:
Easy.
Grips off.
Spring saddle (bottom of spring) simply lifts up (1/8") and then out of the frame. (there is a pin thru the frame that the saddle "latches" onto, but it really does not need to be removed.
Use a suitably sized rod to seat into the hole in the bottom of the spring saddle.
Push it up and out. Careful, if you slip it will, hurt !
The hammer and guide rod will stay in place.
The spring and saddle will slide off the rod.

The spring has some tension on it in the forward position.

The next obvious question is WHY do you think the spring needs replacing?
Click to expand...

By the way, thanks for the info. I haven't removed one, but figured drifting out the pin would be required. Glad to know it's even easier.

Jim
 
6string said:
...

If anyone is using a reduced (modified?) mainspring in conjunction with a reduced power recoil spring (other other tricks) to improve function, it would be good to know.

Jim
Click to expand...

A USMC armorer reduced the mainspring on my M41. Finding the mainspring/recoil spring balance for the case(s) of ammunition you are using for competition is common in 1911 22 conversion set-ups for Bullseye competition shooters. Mine can shoot CCI SV and Eley Club all day long.

Some Lapua/SK/RWS/Norma/Wolf is still too soft for it.
 
leinster lad said:
Easy.
Grips off.
Spring saddle (bottom of spring) simply lifts up (1/8") and then out of the frame. (there is a pin thru the frame that the saddle "latches" onto, but it really does not need to be removed.
Use a suitably sized rod to seat into the hole in the bottom of the spring saddle.
Push it up and out. Careful, if you slip it will, hurt !
The hammer and guide rod will stay in place.
The spring and saddle will slide off the rod.

The spring has some tension on it in the forward position.

The next obvious question is WHY do you think the spring needs replacing?
Click to expand...

Is the saddle the same as the mainspring retainer in the image? I can't see how to remove the retainer without removing the retainer pin. On mine it looks like the stirrup (that the spring encircles) goes through the vertical length of the retainer.

Barrie said:
What is the gun doing to make you think it needs a new spring? Its not always the culprit. There is a diagram on the net showing how to strip a M41 down. Look at it 1st is my suggestion to you.
Click to expand...

I've used the "Model 41 maintenance" page but can't find the diagram you reference. Is it OK for you to point me to it?
 
the why

People asked (quite reasonably, IMO :)) why change the mainspring ...

I'm frequently getting strikes that almost are not visible on the primer. The last time was twice in 140 rounds. I'm using exclusively CCI SV (#35).

S&W CS said an old mainspring could cause a low power firing pin strike. If that's not true then I'd certainly like to hear the real solution.

History is in thread http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...nt-fully-chamber-cartridge.html#post140396006. Entry #33 has the latest.

Thanks.
 
CEra said:
Is the saddle the same as the mainspring retainer in the image? I can't see how to remove the retainer without removing the retainer pin. On mine it looks like the stirrup (that the spring encircles) goes through the vertical length of the retainer.
Click to expand...

356300.jpg

From Numrich Smith & Wesson Model 41 Parts | Numrich

Push up on the Mainspring Retainer and over the pin to remove.
 
I too feel that M41 mainsprings are stronger than they need to be . Many of us old BE shooters have trimmed ours so that pistol would reliably function with standard velocity target ammo . CCI SV has always been a little " hotter " than most SV , especially the Euro stuff . Pistol is an antiquated design & suffers from poor extractor design , is oversprung & chamber / bore dimensions are not what's considered " match " . I also think the older pre A guns were much better made . Not popular point of view around here . If one looks at it from a competitive shooters prospective a gun exists to shoot best scores period . If the 41 met this criteria the Military teams would still use them . Cut 2 coils off mainspring , go with a 6.5lb recoil spring , Volquartsen extractor & if barrel will not shoot a 10 round X ring group get it relined . Both Lothar Walther & Lilja make excellent liners with true match land / groove dimensions .
 
Boatbum101, you touched on a salient point with regards to our (often nearly) blind love for our favorite models and how that often clouds our view of them. The models 52 and 41 do this to many of us, myself certainly included.

I find the views and experiences of Bullseye shooters to be extremely valuable in gun forums and discussions of specific models.
 
Spring Service Packs available for most S&W semi autos from Wolff that include all springs... But not for the 41..:confused:

Springs wear out with use..
 
boatbum101 said:
I too feel that M41 mainsprings are stronger than they need to be . Many of us old BE shooters have trimmed ours so that pistol would reliably function with standard velocity target ammo . CCI SV has always been a little " hotter " than most SV , especially the Euro stuff . Pistol is an antiquated design & suffers from poor extractor design , is oversprung & chamber / bore dimensions are not what's considered " match " . I also think the older pre A guns were much better made . Not popular point of view around here . If one looks at it from a competitive shooters prospective a gun exists to shoot best scores period . If the 41 met this criteria the Military teams would still use them . Cut 2 coils off mainspring , go with a 6.5lb recoil spring , Volquartsen extractor & if barrel will not shoot a 10 round X ring group get it relined . Both Lothar Walther & Lilja make excellent liners with true match land / groove dimensions .
Click to expand...

AMEN!!

Finally, someone else is saying this! I have my Dad's old 41, made in 1958, with the original barrel weight set. I love it.
But, for a match I will use my Pardini without a second thought on the matter.

I think it's important that on a forum like this, that knowledgeable people call it like it is, rather than just repeat printed bunk from the old gun magazines.

Jim
 
boatbum101 said:
I too feel that M41 mainsprings are stronger than they need to be . Many of us old BE shooters have trimmed ours so that pistol would reliably function with standard velocity target ammo . CCI SV has always been a little " hotter " than most SV , especially the Euro stuff . Pistol is an antiquated design & suffers from poor extractor design , is oversprung & chamber / bore dimensions are not what's considered " match " . I also think the older pre A guns were much better made . Not popular point of view around here . If one looks at it from a competitive shooters prospective a gun exists to shoot best scores period . If the 41 met this criteria the Military teams would still use them . Cut 2 coils off mainspring , go with a 6.5lb recoil spring , Volquartsen extractor & if barrel will not shoot a 10 round X ring group get it relined . Both Lothar Walther & Lilja make excellent liners with true match land / groove dimensions .
Click to expand...

Relined 1978 M41 5.5" barrel (Ten Ring Precision) and a Clark 50 yards Ransom Rest testing to see worst performance with CCI SV. Rest was clamped to a rifle bench and not a proper support. Factory 5.5" barrels around that time did not make military team standards for performance.

I shoot a 1911 conversion, a Hammerli or a Feinwerkbau in outdoor competition events. My M41 has a Clark barrel with an Aimpoint red dot for indoor competitions with poor lighting. I am considering narrowing the trigger and lengthening it for a more consistent finger position.
 

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We have to remember the Paradini Pistols cost a lot more then the M41 even when new. I have members at my club that shoot them in the Bullseye League. We have used Paridini's on our Bulletin Board in great shape for $1250.00. which is what I would want for my M41 or M46. They are both in mint shape. 1958 and 1963 year models.
 
Have you priced a new 45 wadgun lately ? Many of the Euro pistols are very fine guns . Most have extreme grip angles & are muzzle heavy , but are extremely adjutable to fit a shooter . Int'l shooting is a world thing , Bullseye is pretty much an American one . One can take a Ruger MK 1 or 2 , a little trigger work & down the road some better sights & make Master .
 
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