The pinnacle of the PC, a .45 Target Champion

Erocksmash

Erocksmash

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Howdy,

I present a beautiful .45 Target Champion or 845 or the most beautiful thing the S&W Performance center ever produced... whichever you prefer.

For the longest time I've fantasized about an import gun. Why you ask? I like the idea of a story, in a country unknown, you know buy the gun not the story!?!? Doesn't mean a guy can imagine one right ?

I imagine it sitting in a German hill side house with snow capped mountains in the back ground and this is the only gun they had haha. And yes I know this went to Germany because of 2 things, the feller I picked this up from(importer)was in fact German and said his good owned it and never shot, well whoever his friend was his name is etched into the top of the slide, looks and sound rather German to me.

I wish there was an accurate accounting of the guns that went over seas...

Dare I say to worls most accurate. 45acp? Who knows?
She arrived with S&W branded houges (right back in the box thoes went) so I slapped a new set of nylons on her.

I'll walk out to the range this weekend and see what I can do.

I'll add a picture of the German name on the slide tomorrow

Any gentleman here shoot one of these across the pond?

Thanks for looking
Erik
 

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Congratulations on a fine addition to the Family

I don't know about "across the pond" unless we look at Lake Okeechobee :)

Quite a few of your fellow Florida Forum members own and shoot 845s. 3 of us, at least on the East Coast. They are superb pistols, I am certain your walk will bring a smile to your face

Mine 845 also came with the S&W logoed Hogues. I grabbed a set of the KSD wood grips for it about 6 or 7 years ago. They feel good to me and I like the way they look.

845-1998rs.jpg
 
colt_saa said:
Congratulations on a fine addition to the Family

I don't know about "across the pond" unless we look at Lake Okeechobee :)

Quite a few of your fellow Florida Forum members own and shoot 845s. 3 of us, at least on the East Coast. They are superb pistols, I am certain your walk will bring a smile to your face

Mine 845 also came with the S&W logoed Hogues. I grabbed a set of the KSD wood grips for it about 6 or 7 years ago. They feel good to me and I like the way they look.

845-1998rs.jpg
Click to expand...


Wow, those KSD wood grips look amazing, I suppose they are Hens Teeth to find nowadays...
 
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moosedog said:
That is a really nice-looking pistol, Erik. I was thinking of getting a 45-target pistol again and I think you have given me an idea which one to go with.
Click to expand...

Thanks Moose,

It's nicely balanced feels great in the hand, the trigger is just feels amazing...

Really any performance center 45 target I would recommend.
 
Erocksmash said:
Wow, those KSD wood grips look amazing, I suppose they are Hens Teeth to find nowadays...
Click to expand...
KSD still sells on eBay I think. They had to pull all their ads showing logos. It turns out they never got permission

These are the same grips that would go on a 4506 or a 1006 so folks still make them.

I think KSD has a website, contact them directly It is probably not too much trouble to get a grip made in this CNC world that we live in. Just tell them what you want
 
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ultratec00 said:
What's the difference between the 745 and 845?
Click to expand...

I have two 745’s so right off the rip I’ll say that I love them and they are terrific pistols. However the difference between the 745 and 845 is extreme.

The 745 is a very good lookin’ time capsule from the 80’s, they were made over 4-5 years and three variations. All in all, some 15,000 are estimated in circulation. It was a production gun and as said, single action. Very short pull trigger, not necessarily a light pull but a short one. Like the old Model 52, the trigger was two-way adjustable for pre-travel and over-travel. Neat relic and lots and lots of fun to shoot, but again, a production gun, and fit as such. Accuracy was as expected, similar to what you should expect from a 645 or 4506.

The 845 however was a true Performance Center Limited gun. First built in 1995, they trickled out until 1998. These are very finely hand-fitted target pistols. The ones slated for North America were built to only 585 units. I have never heard a count for the WISHCO bound guns as the subject of this discussion. My guess would be less than 500 of them, so maybe a thousand total ever built — if even that many.

The slide to frame fit, the barrel to slide fit, the trigger pull weight, feel and reset and the Bomar rear sight all come together to make these pistols fantastically accurate.

I’ve been fortunate to have the chance to wring out most of the best that S&W has ever produced in a semiauto pistol. The 845 sits on a plane along with the 945 that I believe is the most capable that they have ever built. That includes the Model 52, of which I’ve got three. And while the PC kicked out some top-tier 9mm guns and a few .40cal, the 845 and 945 will eat them for lunch if the game is bullseye accuracy.

745’s used to hang close around the $500-$600 mark but have climbed to $700-$900 these days. The 845 of either series or a WISCHO such as the subject pistol realistically trade at 2-3 times that price range.

You could say that I am a fan! :D
 
While the 845 and such are fine guns and shoot great. I have to debate the " eat the PC 9mms for lunch" comment. In 30+ years of PPC competitions I never saw anyone go to the line in the open event with one. I have seen a few in the service gun match, no winners that I know of. But thats another issue.
A lot of guys hand load so they could be made more comfortable to shoot than a 9mm and you get a lot larger hole.
We experimented with the 945 and couldnt get them to hold a group near as well as the 5" PPC9 at 50 yards. Believe me if they shot as well or any better than the PPC9s guys would have been shooting them. They were alot cheaper then, than a PPC 1911 in 45 and there were lots of those being used.
The PPC 9s were purpose built to shoot 50 yard competitions, if they were not really accurate at 50 they wouldnt have sold very many. I think the 845s were an offshoot of the first Action pistol type guns built for Team SW. Im not sure what the accuracy requirements would have been for that type of shooting. Im sure they are good, my old 4506 will hold right at 4" at 50, with Ranger SXT.
Im not saying they are not accurate, I have never shot one (845) at 50 yards. But I have shot many a PPC 9, my 3 all hold under 2"at 50 and one 5" gun 6 shot groups are under 1.5", WW 147 JHP.
I would imagine someone might get accuracy equal to the 9mm PPC, I have just never seen it done. But I certainly dont think they (845) would be any better than the PPC 9 pistols. At 25 yards I would imagine all the PC semi autos shoot about the same. It can only be so good. My ancient compact still shoots 1 inch at 25 if Im having a good day.
I have to add that you have a beauty there and I would love to have one, even though I dont shoot that much any more. Eroc you find them somehow and I like the import touch...
 
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If you tear down the PC Limited guns, any except the 945, they are basically built exactly the same way. The slide to frame, the barrel to the slide, the trigger/hammer/sear arrangement, there’s really no difference, so if we are discussing only mechanical accuracy (potential?) then I believe it comes down to 9mm versus .45.

I don’t think that’s a close race and in the annals of Bullseye, it’s not even a race.

Admittedly, the only 50-yard shooting I do with my PC semiautomatics is on steel, where it’s just pass or fail.

At 15 yards where I typically shoot for groups on paper (or at 25 yards at the odd occasion), my .45’s do, always, eat up my PC 9mm guns.

In my experience, it certainly seems possible to search, tinker and experiment with 9mm handloads in search of the magical recipe that will make a particular gun absolutely shine. With my 845’s and 945’s, it basically does not matter what the recipe is. 185 JHP, 200gr H&G86 or 230 grain Hardball, the .45cal PC guns are ringers with whatever I feed them.

I don’t know if anyone that’s serious or successful shoots S&W Performance Center guns in Bullseye, but very few across the sport are competing with 9mm chambered pistols. They’re shooting .45’s. They aren’t chasing power factor, they aren’t clearing bowling pins and they don’t need hi-caps, they just want the X-ring and for that, the .45 has no serious contemporary.

I only wish I could shoot like they do. :D
 
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