1911 problem

[growr]

Hey Fellow 1911 Shooters!



Any of you keen eyed 1911 gurus tell me what is wrong with my Springfield Armory Standard 1911 from this casing? The gun has been ultra reliable until Sunday....this is only one of several casings....Shot extractor? Ejector or both? Last year I did replace the recoil spring with a Wolff 18lb. I am shooting 230 RNL with 6 gr. of Unique and have used that for many years.

This gun has fired many thousands of rounds without a hitch. This casing was basically like a half stovepipe half double feed and the magazine would not drop free....a real bearcat to get out.

Thanks to all!

Randy

 

[Dvus]

My thoughts when I saw the pics was to check your powder measure. I have had this happen and found out that my powder measure had slipped calibration and was throwing light charges. The slide would come back but not quite far enough to clear the round in the mag, shoving the half ejected case into the side of the barrel (thus the two dents in the case mouth) and as it rides back over the top round in the mag it drags it into the feed ramp, giving you the look of a double feed and a mag that is a bear to remove. A dry slide can also give this effect. These are the two things I have experienced with the symptoms you describe.

 

[stansdds]

Ejected cases are not fully ejecting before the slide picks up the next round and the slide is crushing the partially ejected case mouth against the barrel hood. I've seen and experienced this.

6 grains of Unique under a 230 grain cast lead bullet should be getting you somewhere close to 850 fps, so that load should be a good duplicate of hardball ammo. The 1911-A1, with hardball ammo, only requires a 16 pound recoil spring. You said you just installed an 18 pound spring, so I would first try a 16 pound spring and see if ejection returns to normal.

Another thing that can induce failures is a shock buffer. These can be ok for range use, but they decrease the distance the slide can travel and also decrease the space for the recoil spring, so some springs can even coil bind when a buffer is used.

If a 16 pound recoil spring does not solve the problem and no buffer is being used, then the extractor is the next suspect. It could be chipped, has lost tension, or is rotating slightly, which can cause the hook to loose the case rim during extraction.

 

[M29since14]

It’s easy enough to inspect your extractor for chips. You’ll need a gage to check tension, which you can buy from several different sources, like Brownells or Midway.

I have no use for 18+ pound springs in a .45. I’d install a good-quality 16, or maximum 17, pound spring. I prefer those from Wilson Combat.

When you pull the old spring out you might check its length, by comparing it to a brand new one. I used to buy Commander springs that would quickly compress and lose some of their length, which seemed to cause various problems. I don’t recall the brand. When I tried Wilson’s springs I had better luck with them. Springs are funny things. I am no expert but I think the quality of them can vary wildly - like everything else, I guess.

 

[505Gibbs]

My $0.02 would also be with the recoil spring weight.

 

[cndrdk]

OK, while you're checking everything, check the ejector. Had a Kimber Ultra Raptor begin giving me problems after being trouble free. While cleaning, noticed the ejector "arm" was broken off. Called Kimber to order another and guy on phone asked if I had been using a full sized magazine. I then remembered loading up all my compact mags.....and 1 full sized mag before going to the range. Apparently using the full sized mag caused the ejector "arm" to crack and next I went shooting it broke off. Still ejected, but jammed a few times and was unlike this pistol.

 

[armorer951]

Looks like the casing is hitting the edge of the bottom of the ejection port on it's way out. (when it makes it out) If you haven't cleaned the gun yet, you should be able to see a deposit of brass on the bottom edge of the port from the casing as it attempts to exit the opening, and strkes the bottom edge.
I would agree with the others who mentioned looking at the recoil spring and/ or confirming your actual hand-loading was accurate.

 

[growr]

powder measure

My thoughts when I saw the pics was to check your powder measure. I have had this happen and found out that my powder measure had slipped calibration and was throwing light charges. The slide would come back but not quite far enough to clear the round in the mag, shoving the half ejected case into the side of the barrel (thus the two dents in the case mouth) and as it rides back over the top round in the mag it drags it into the feed ramp, giving you the look of a double feed and a mag that is a bear to remove. A dry slide can also give this effect. These are the two things I have experienced with the symptoms you describe.

This same ammo runs flawlessly in 3 other Springfields, a Colt Officer, a Dan Wesson Pointman Major and my S&W 1911Sc.
However I will check it to be sure.
The slide is and was well lubed.

Randy

 

[Alk8944]

The first rule of diagnosing problems that occur just after you have made any change is un-do the change and see if the problem goes away! Put the 16# spring back in the gun and test fire.

 

[growr]

Will change it back and report.

Randy

 

[OFT II]

I agree with the folks above. It's likely either too much recoil spring or not enough powder.

 

[CA Escapee]

I agree with what's been said above with regard to the 18# recoil spring. Either change back to the 16# and try it or heat up those rounds with a little more powder.

Bill

 

[gman51]

I had a Ruger LC9s do that and I even sent it back to Ruger. They replaced the barrel and ejector. I got it back and I still had the same problem. The jam only happened after I had shot a lot { 50 to 175} with it. I was asked if I thought I had limp wristed it and I said I didn't think so.
When I got it back and it jammed I noticed my hand was rather tired out and I could feel discomfort as well. Not bad but I still noticed it. I determined I had probably limp wristed after a lot of rounds fired off made my hand take a rather weakened grip on the gun. I found as long as I made sure I had a strong grip then the gun had no more problems.
It's hard to admit sometimes I can be a wimp.

 

[growr]

Update:
I was incorrect on the recoil spring weight....I installed a Wilson Combat 16lb last fall. So I can reasonably assume it to be good....

Still need to check the extractor and ejector.

The 6 gr. of Unique and the 230 RNL is not a wimpy load by any means and chronos out over 800 fps.

The limp wristing was mentioned and it doesn't matter if I shoot it with both hands or single.....(have done this for quite some time in USPSA Single Stack, IDPA, and SASS Wild Bunch.)

Until last Sundays match the gun has been trouble free....

Will keep you all posted when I find the REAL culprit....

Thanks Everyone!

Randy

 

[oink]

I'm thinking ejector.

 

[gwpercle]

Could be ejector but check the extractor while you're at it .
Good luck
Gary

 

[BigBill]

The ejector is loose or worn.

 

[oink]

What happens if you go back to a 16lb spring or up the powder charge?

 

[stansdds]

The OP has already stated that the new spring was 16 pounds and 6.0 grains of Unique under a cast lead round nose bullet is going to produce something in the neighborhood of 850 fps. It's a good cast bullet recipe for duplicating hardball ammo.


Given the further information provided, I'd wager it's an extractor issue. Could be a damaged/worn hook, loss of tension, or it is rotating within its tunnel.

 

[johngalt]

That happened to me after installing a longer ejector. I went back to the original.

 

[2152hq]

Were you using a magazine in the pistol that you had never used before when you were getting the problems?
Or one that possibly had been dropped.

If the feed lips on the magazine are open a bit more than needed especially at the front, the next to chamber/feed round can tip up during the ejection phase and tilt the empty off the breech face a small amt.
The ejector can't quite reach it in time to cleanly eject the case and it ends up half ejected/stovepiped and the new rd left partially fed out of the magazine underneath it.

Happens most on a full magazine when the spring tension is the highest under the loaded rounds.


About the only thing I can think of outside of the other points already mentioned.

One of those 'It worked OK up till now' situations.

 

[growr]

magazines

Were you using a magazine in the pistol that you had never used before when you were getting the problems?
Or one that possibly had been dropped.

If the feed lips on the magazine are open a bit more than needed especially at the front, the next to chamber/feed round can tip up during the ejection phase and tilt the empty off the breech face a small amt.
The ejector can't quite reach it in time to cleanly eject the case and it ends up half ejected/stovepiped and the new rd left partially fed out of the magazine underneath it.

Happens most on a full magazine when the spring tension is the highest under the loaded rounds.


About the only thing I can think of outside of the other points already mentioned.

One of those 'It worked OK up till now' situations.

The magazines are Chip McCormick Shooting Stars.......all new. I will post all findings as soon as a dear friend of mine that is a great 1911 'smith is able to do a range trip.

Randy

 

[growr]

OK fellow members and 1911 diagnosticians:

Extractor was badly chipped, new Wilson Combat extractor installed....runs everything no more problem.

Thanks to ALL who helped out on this!!!

Randy

 

[oink]

I would have bet on the ejector. I guess it was letting go before it made it to the ejector.