2nd Model Schofield + a small Cavalry display

[SportySpiceFan]

Hello all from the Piedmont,

thanx to some members' kindness and knowledge about one month ago, I've been able in making sure the nice Schofield I went after is original in every piece, even though it certainly had been refinished - a professionally made job. S/n in very early 50xx range, and the adding of a second patent date. Thus, a 2nd sub-variation of the 2nd Model itself.
Members' suggestions and infos were precious indeed. Thanx again.

Got it just yesterday, so I thought could be good sharing here the gun together with some original US Cavalry items from the late '800.
Blouse is a 1890 Pattern, 1st subvariation - not more than 2,000 have been made, all in springtime 1890. It sports Corporal's chevrons machine-sewn back then, with both ends hidden deep under the seams (the later 2nd variation was authorized in August of the same 1890).
Blouse is very close to a new one. Riding gloves are the 1886 Pattern, or 2nd Pattern (the 1884 gloves are the 1st Pattern) still in good shape and, luckily, far from being too much dirty. Hat is a transitional design of late 1890s.

Much likely, the closest I could ever go to an original US-contracted handgun for the Cavalry.
Thanx for watching.

 

[29aholic]

Very nice gun!!!!

 

[gmborkovic]

very nice gun and display. congrats.

 

[JSR III]

Welcome to the forum.

Very nice gun and very cool display. With your obvious love of firearms and the memorabilia that goes with them you should definitely consider joining the S&WCA.

 

[model3sw]

Very, VERY, nice !!! Congratulations !

 

[SportySpiceFan]

Thanx to the kind members for their appreciation.

Sal especially, a GREAT thanx for your suggestions and help. Important details I still didn't know about some of S&W products.
Best regards - Franco.

 

[model3sw]

Thanx to the kind members for their appreciation.

Sal especially, a GREAT thanx for your suggestions and help.

" Important details I still didn't know about some of S&W products."

Best regards - Franco.

Franco, you went about this purchase with proper research and great passion (that is what "our" people are famous for, our passion). Keep reading, keep researching, keep asking questions.

We here in the forum are happy to help. If there is anything you need from me, personally, you have but to ask.

Remember, Charlie Pate asked for some additional data when you had the gun, in hand. Please follow through with me on that subject, off the forum.

Remember, all the surplus sold Schofield (late 1890s to early 1900s) were all reconditioned before resold. If yours is later discovered to be one of the surplus sold Schofield (good chance it is) it is still worth extremely more than you purchase price. I once authored a thread here in the forum (somewhere) about this subject. The surplus sold Schofields were refinished to such exacting standards it is near impossible to detect a refinish. In fact, the only way to verify a Schofield has not been surplus refinished is to have irrefutable documentation that the Schofield was taken out of service in its years of Cavalry usage, which is near impossible to prove.

Congratulations, again. It sure looks like a sweetheart, in a condition scarcely seen. Best Regards, from your paisano in U.S.A. Sal

 

[JSR III]

(that is what "our" people are famous for, our passion)

Sal, do you mean members of the S&WCA???????

 

[shouldazagged]

Beautiful revolver and a splendid display.

I hope you'll stick around and share some of your knowledge with us.

 

[model3sw]

Sal, do you mean members of the S&WCA???????

James, in retrospect ... of COURSE, I meant the members of the S&WCA. LOL !! Thanks, James.

 

[SportySpiceFan]

Beautiful revolver and a splendid display.

I hope you'll stick around and share some of your knowledge with us.

Thanx so much for the appreciation - actually, I still have much more things to learn than those I could tell around.
My interest on the firearms of the American Western era is what made me getting a firearms license, here still mandatory even for the Antiques cathegory (US pre-1898, Italy pre-1890).

Of course you cannot do such a step - maybe nothing special elsewhere, but something noteworthy and 'alarming' within my family - without subsequently purchasing a modern gun and starting to shoot. A couple Italian-made repros of Colt's SAA (.45 LC and 44-40), a well-used repro of Winchester '76, the Model 29, but an original Schofield I absolutely wanted owning sooner or later, too much an incredible handgun with its sophisticated technology.

After some time the Italian copies became original Colt SAA in 45LC and 44-40, the Uberti-made '76 became a true Winchester '76 in 'Express' 50-95 (assembled in October 1887, used by an English officer in India), the planned repro Schofield never happened but better this way. I'm glad with this original one, even though refinished but it's OK and mechanically perfect.
Next step COULD be an 'American' model 3. The gunshop owner who sold me the Schofield does own one American that, calling it Super-FANTASTIC is very diminutive.
Do not even think about how much he could ask, or maybe not - a somehow 'strange' (especially in positive sense) guy, perhaps he could pretty well keep some surprises in his sleeve.

Franco.

 

[SportySpiceFan]

 

[opoefc]

Sal, You mentioned above that " all Schofields sold surplus were refinished to exacting standards that made them difficult to tell from originals. " I've never run across that information before, so I'm curious as to the source. Do you recall where you came upon that ? Surplus sales of Schofields happened at different times by different vendors, of course, spread over many locations, as most of these surplus sales were by government entities such as State National Guard units, the US War Dep't (Army Ordnance ) and were sales to firearm dealers. Some dealers may have refinished their purchases before retailing the guns, but I'm not aware of any evidence that all surplus Schofields were refinished. I currently have many of them in my Schofield collection, none of which show any refinishing, and they came from mostly State Guard origin sales to dealers, circa turn of the century. Pls. advise . Ed.

 

[model3sw]

Hi, Dad, I forgot you WERE one of the surplus purchasers at the US warehouse back then.

I should have prefaced that line "in my opinion", at least until I sift through about a half ton (not joking) of books catalogs, advertisements and other paper to find it in print. I think I have it narrowed down to one or more of several advertisements in NYC and surrounding area wholesale / retail companies.

I'll start sifting through about a half ton (not joking, likely more) of books catalogs and other paper to find it in print, somewhere near Carters Liver Pills and Dr. Freud's magic Feel-good elixer. IIRC I picked up that pearl from an old Bannermans, SH&G or other wholesale / retail store in or near NYC, advertisement touting that it had been thoroughly reconditioned (i think that was the word) not exact words here but implied as to fit and function to be as new.

I noticed, years back when I first started collecting paper, it seems the surplus Schofields did not sell out quickly. They were kept on catalog into the 1920s and perhaps further, IIRC, seeing advertisements in other publications of that time, years later.

The OP's Schofield is in outstanding condition, however, a physical examination is necessary to affirm original or not and THAT is the dilemma I refer to. It is truly difficult to determine on the well preserved Schofields. Remeber we're talking turn of the century craftsmanship.

Think of Charles Duffy. His impeccable craftsmanship and experience was second to no one. His "standard" refinish would but most "restoration experts" to view in awe, like rest of us. SO outstanding was Charles' work that I recall one old member (RIP) who first told me about Charles Duffy, that member stating that Charles' work was SO perfect, he had a hard time convincing a knowledgeable perspective buyer that something Charles refinished, had ... in fact ... been refinished.

Dave Chicoine was another true talented craftsman who took pride in his work, some of the earlier work much better than toward the final years he was in business. Sal

 

[S&WsRsweet]

Man when you joined the forum you really joined nicely . Great gun great collection of western items any one would be proud to own . Thanks for shareing .

 

[SportySpiceFan]

Too kind, 'Sweet.
Thanx very much.

 

[SportySpiceFan]

Again some pics from the collection.

The only 'issue', here no photos of the Schofield or other S&W antique guns, so perhaps we're bordering an O.T. Please forgive me you true S&W fans... they're the very last shots though.
Thinking of how much efforts and overtime works to devote exclusively for these things through 7-8 years, I'm fond on them even though it isn't any exceptional stuff (taking aside, maybe, one of the two pairs gauntlets).
Franco.

Left: Pattern 1886 riding gauntlets. Right: the hyper-rare Pattern 1884, horrendously difficult to find out.

 

[S&WsRsweet]

My goodness ! You surely have a fine collection . Firearms and Calvery items . Super congratulations, the riding gauntlets are in the perfect condition for someone who likes the history behind a piece ,for me at least with any antique firearm or other item it's as much about the story they tell *** the piece itself. You could see a soldier pulling on those 1884 gauntlets getting ready to ride out . Much better than a pristine pair that only sat in storage someplace .

 

[JSR III]

Sal, one must be careful when taking distributors "ad puffery" for S&W fact. Not sure that is the case here as you have yet to locate the source however, I know that there is a Bekeart ad out there that mentions a second 1,000 .22/32's being made exclusively for Bekeart. We know that he only received 294 of the first 1,000 so the ad is definitely self serving and far from reality.

 

[Shark Bait]

Very nice indeed! I love all of it. But that Schofield is something else. That is what I call a grail gun, for sure. Thanks for sharing your collection with us.