357Mag First Time Loader - Advice Needed...

[Osprey_2012]

If you want light to medium loads (recoil wise), start with .38 SPL, cast bullets and a fast powder like Bullseye, Unique or W231. Do not put light loads under jacketed bullets!

2400 is a slower powder which gives excellent performance for mid to hot .357 magnum performance. It will not give consistent results in a light load.

The first time with any load, start low and work up no more than 0.5 grains at a time, and watch for signs of pressure. Do no use less than the minimum load on your chart, and do not exceed the maximum.

Don't EVER load .38 SPL cases to magnum levels! The pressure is unpredictable (usually high) compared to a larger case, and may blow up in a revolver designed for .38 SPL.

My advice - settle on a powder/bullet combination and a useful load and stick with it. If you see signs of excessive pressure, stop and pull the bullets or otherwise destroy those (and higher) loads. If you want the hottest loads for hunting or self defense, buy them from a reputable company with quality control and deep pockets.

While at Bass Pro Shop yesterday, I was deciding between Bullseye, 2400, and Unique (they have others but I knew nothing of them) but picked 2400 and seems like it was not a very wise choice for my situation. I plan to go back to BPS today and pickup 1lb of either Unique, or Bullseye or W231 (not sure they have this on the shelf). This is an hour drive one way so still debating about going today or not.

 

[Krogen]

While you're there, buy at least one good loading book! Lyman 49 is a good general purpose book. If you want light loads, buy a pound of 231. It will work well in most all pistol loads - provided you're not looking for screaming hot "magnumb" loads. A pound of 231 will last a long time. I suggest you forgo getting more than a pound of anything until you get more experience. For example: I shoot 4 gr of 231 in 38 Sp loads. That's good for 1750 loads per pound!

 

[ruger-p94]

I have been playing around with a few loads for my model 13 and settled with 6.5 gr unique with a 158 gr swc. I got a lot of good info on this forum and tried it and it is my round for sure now. It is peppy but not a barn buster and burns clean and saves me from cleaning out the ring in the cylinder every time I shoot. I was loading some 38 as well but decided to stick with just the 357 cases for safety reasons.

 

[Osprey_2012]

While you're there, buy at least one good loading book! Lyman 49 is a good general purpose book. If you want light loads, buy a pound of 231. It will work well in most all pistol loads - provided you're not looking for screaming hot "magnumb" loads. A pound of 231 will last a long time. I suggest you forgo getting more than a pound of anything until you get more experience. For example: I shoot 4 gr of 231 in 38 Sp loads. That's good for 1750 loads per pound!

Thanks. My two manuals I ordered from Midway just arrived (Hornady 8th Edition and Lyman 49th Edition).
Will pick up a pound of W231.

Will be using 357 mag brass for 38 special loads (trying to keep my revolver chambers clean).

With the Hornady .38 Cal 125 Gr XTP, W231 powder, I should be good to go then? Overall, not looking for "HOT" 357 magnum loads, at least not until I am more expericienced in reloading.

 

[Krogen]

You'll be fine with that Hornady bullet and 231. Your 2400 would work fine too. It will take considerably less 231 than 2400 for your loads, so be sure to look in each case before you seat bullets. Make sure you don't mistakenly get a double charge of 231. I see from your original post you have a Hornady AP. Since it's a progressive press, just go slow and watch what's going on. A lot happens at once with a progressive, so taking your time is essential.

I give you about two days and you'll be hooked! You are getting started in a very rewarding endeavor. When you're not at the range "unloading" you can be at the bench reloading. It's the other side of the coin, so to speak.

 

[Osprey_2012]

You'll be fine with that Hornady bullet and 231. Your 2400 would work fine too. It will take considerably less 231 than 2400 for your loads, so be sure to look in each case before you seat bullets. Make sure you don't mistakenly get a double charge of 231. I see from your original post you have a Hornady AP. Since it's a progressive press, just go slow and watch what's going on. A lot happens at once with a progressive, so taking your time is essential.

I give you about two days and you'll be hooked! You are getting started in a very rewarding endeavor. When you're not at the range "unloading" you can be at the bench reloading. It's the other side of the coin, so to speak.

Thanks Krogen for the couragement. I bought progressive press was mainly due to the amount rounds I shoot per week. I don't plan to take full advantage of its max capacity and will use it a single stage for now and will check and double check every single round to ensure proper powder.

Plan to reload about 10 rounds of 357 of starting load tomorrow. Need to pick up W231 later on today and will do some manual reading tonight.

 

[Russell Cottle]

I started reloading back in the early '60's. I currently reload for .32's, .38/.357's, .41's, .44spec/.44mag, and .45colt/.acp. I'm never w/o Unique. It'll work in all the above, plus I've used it in some 'plinker' rifle loads. IMO, no reloading bench is complete w/o it.

 

[treerat]

SLOW DOWN! your getting to far into this with your experience. just make some loads with the 2400 you already have. do you realize how many loads a pound of powder will get you? one pound is equal to 7,000 grains, divide that by your load and you will have your number of rounds you can reload. I thought I reloaded quite a bit, but you are getting more powder than I have used in over five years, are you stocking up for the end of the world. seriously, slow down and get your game plan figured out first.

 

[Osprey_2012]

Ok, for now I'll hold off on getting more/different type of powders and work around with what I have already bought.

Just picked up one pound of W231 from BPS as planned earlier and this should last me a very long time. Next thing I need (besides the 100 of Hornady XTP I bought yesterday) is bullets which I have already been looking at X-treme Bullets:

9mm: 124gr RN Plated x1000 $82
38: 158gr RNFP Plated x1000 $94
44: 240gr FP Plated x500 $60

Shipping included in their prices so sounds like good deal?

Also just bought a box of 50 of Winchester 44 mag from Wal Mart today and shot about 10 rounds on SW M29-2 4" on the way back from BPS. The recoil wasn't as bad as I had anticipated it to be. I mostly shoot 357 and 38 special rounds.

Actually, I want to buy more new brass for 44mag so need to shop around for that. Any suggestion on online places? Thanks.

 

[mlapaglia]

It's been said already, slow down. Don't worry about the 44 at the moment. Get your 38sp figured out and do about 250-500 of them with a load you like. Then start on the 357. Go slow and stop jumping ahead. This is dangerous stuff. It's fun but you can really get hurt. I suggest that you stop throwing money at this hobby and learn to use and understand what you have so far. If you keep up spreading yourself so thin you could get hurt or damage a good weapon. Enthusiasm is a good thing but slow down and take it easy. One caliber at a time. Get it down and then move on to the next. Reloading is not the time to multitask.

The above is said out of concern.

 

[Osprey_2012]

It's been said already, slow down. Don't worry about the 44 at the moment. Get your 38sp figured out and do about 250-500 of them with a load you like. Then start on the 357. Go slow and stop jumping ahead. This is dangerous stuff. It's fun but you can really get hurt. I suggest that you stop throwing money at this hobby and learn to use and understand what you have so far. If you keep up spreading yourself so thin you could get hurt or damage a good weapon. Enthusiasm is a good thing but slow down and take it easy. One caliber at a time. Get it down and then move on to the next. Reloading is not the time to multitask.

The above is said out of concern.

Thanks for the concern. Since I have only 100 rounds worth of bullets and primers for 38/357, I need to order more online and wanted to go ahead and get stuff for 44 as well since I know for sure I will need them later. I wanted to have them ready when I need them. As far as reloading, I will mainly focus on 38/357. Thanks.

 

[kenjen]

you can find a loading for unquie in every pistol round and alot of rifle and shotgun rounds, that is way it is called unquie. 3 powers every pistol reloader should have are unquie, 2400 and bullseye.

 

[Titegroups]

The other thing you need to consider is switching over to lead instead of jacketed. That's where the savings start adding up when reloading. Paying $20/100 bullets is nuts. For target shooting lead is the way to go. No need to drive the bullets hard to punch holes in paper.

 

[ruger-p94]

I concur with titegroups on going to lead. Put that $20 for 100 jacketed bullets to good use,..... for the same price in making lead bullets you will get 1000. The funny thing is they all go boom and make a round hole. Switching to lead will pay for itself in only a few months and then you are shooting almost for free the rest of the year. Not to many things in life are like that and as much fun...cheers

 

[Cerberus62]

While at Bass Pro Shop yesterday, I was deciding between Bullseye, 2400, and Unique (they have others but I knew nothing of them) but picked 2400 and seems like it was not a very wise choice for my situation. I plan to go back to BPS today and pickup 1lb of either Unique, or Bullseye or W231 (not sure they have this on the shelf). This is an hour drive one way so still debating about going today or not.

2400 is a great powder and not an unwise choice, simply not the most flexible powder given what you want to do. It will work very well in mid-range to full loads in the 357 and in full loads in the 38. It is also better with the lighter bullets than H110/W296. It is probably the most useful 357 magnum powder, giving consistent results over a relatively wide range of pressures and bullet weights.

H110/W296, they are exactly the same and use the same data, are designed to give the highest performance from straight wall cases at magnum pressures. They have a very narrow range of operating pressures (high) and work best with heavy bullets. They are the best powders for full magnum loads but the least useful for anything else.They are proven unsafe for light loads, giving hangfires and squibs when loaded too light or under light bullets.

Red Dot, Bullseye and 231 are all great for the 38 and I have used them all in 38's and midrange 357's with great results. You must watch for double charges with the lightest loads, they don't take up much space in the case. You will be happy with 231 in your 38's.

I load 38/357, 44Spl/44Mag, 45 ACP and 45 Colt, as well as 12 and 20 gauge shotshells, and I cannot imagine reloading without Unique.

I loaded my very first batch of 38's with it in 1980 and have never been without some since. It is the single most useful and easiest to work with powder for all of the calibers you want to load. Forget the complaints about smoke. All powders give some smoke, and flake powders lubricated with graphite give more. Lubricated lead cast bullets are smokier with any powder than plated or jacketed bullets. It's just part of shooting and the only people who complain are those who don't don't like to clean their guns or think shooting real guns should be like a video game.

The flexibility, economy, excellent ballistics and general easy going good nature of Unique far outweigh any perceived smokiness issue.

BTW, all of the powder selection criteria for 38/357 loads apply to any of the straight wall cases. They all work the same, based on case length and pressure. Shorter case, lower pressure, use a faster powder. Longer case, higher pressure, use a slower powder. The 9mm is the slight exception, only due to the combination of short case and high operating pressure. And Unique is fine for the 9.

 

[Osprey_2012]

The other thing you need to consider is switching over to lead instead of jacketed. That's where the savings start adding up when reloading. Paying $20/100 bullets is nuts. For target shooting lead is the way to go. No need to drive the bullets hard to punch holes in paper.

From what I've read, I was concerning about barrel leading with lead bullets and that's the main reason I did't bother to look at them or compare prices with jacketed ones.

Perhaps I should give them a try and see. In terms of saving from using lead bullets, I just compared prices from Xstreme Bullets for 500 pieces on 44 cal 240gr SWC hard cast lead for $55 to 240gr FP plated for $60 and that's only $5 difference. Am I looking at this correctly? Or are there cheaper lead bullets out there that I need to know? Thanks.

 

[Osprey_2012]

Thanks much Cerberus62 for taking the time to share your experience and knowledge. Really appreciate that. I don't mind getting a pound of Unique later but for now I just want to give what I have on hand a try first.

2400 is a great powder and not an unwise choice, simply not the most flexible powder given what you want to do. It will work very well in mid-range to full loads in the 357 and in full loads in the 38. It is also better with the lighter bullets than H110/W296. It is probably the most useful 357 magnum powder, giving consistent results over a relatively wide range of pressures and bullet weights.

H110/W296, they are exactly the same and use the same data, are designed to give the highest performance from straight wall cases at magnum pressures. They have a very narrow range of operating pressures (high) and work best with heavy bullets. They are the best powders for full magnum loads but the least useful for anything else.They are proven unsafe for light loads, giving hangfires and squibs when loaded too light or under light bullets.

Red Dot, Bullseye and 231 are all great for the 38 and I have used them all in 38's and midrange 357's with great results. You must watch for double charges with the lightest loads, they don't take up much space in the case. You will be happy with 231 in your 38's.

I load 38/357, 44Spl/44Mag, 45 ACP and 45 Colt, as well as 12 and 20 gauge shotshells, and I cannot imagine reloading without Unique.

I loaded my very first batch of 38's with it in 1980 and have never been without some since. It is the single most useful and easiest to work with powder for all of the calibers you want to load. Forget the complaints about smoke. All powders give some smoke, and flake powders lubricated with graphite give more. Lubricated lead cast bullets are smokier with any powder than plated or jacketed bullets. It's just part of shooting and the only people who complain are those who don't don't like to clean their guns or think shooting real guns should be like a video game.

The flexibility, economy, excellent ballistics and general easy going good nature of Unique far outweigh any perceived smokiness issue.

BTW, all of the powder selection criteria for 38/357 loads apply to any of the straight wall cases. They all work the same, based on case length and pressure. Shorter case, lower pressure, use a faster powder. Longer case, higher pressure, use a slower powder. The 9mm is the slight exception, only due to the combination of short case and high operating pressure. And Unique is fine for the 9.

 

[Osprey_2012]

Loading Data

So I read and looked through both manuals I have (Lyman 49th and Hornady 8th) for 357 load data for 125gr HDY XTP and both show no Win 231 data but both list 2400 which is the other powder I have and was told to use Win 231 instead to suit my situation as first time loader.

Found another online data source: Data.Hodgdon.com which lists the Win 231 data as follows:
Starting: 4.3gr @826fps
Max: 4.9gr @934fps
COAL: 1.455"

Since my range is 45 minutes drive away one way so I am planning to load 20 rounds of 357 using starting load: 4.3gr of Win 231. At the range, will shoot 10 rounds out of SW 686P 6" and the other 10 on 686P 2.5" barrel to see which shoots better in terms of recoil.

Any suggestion/advice before I start loading? Dies are set up for 357 but power meter has not. Thanks.

 

[Krogen]

Look again, my friend. That's not .357 data. While you are on the safer side, >always< be sure of the cartridge, bullet and powder when you're looking up load data. Please, PLEASE don't get them mixed up. You have to be right.

 

[Osprey_2012]

Look again, my friend. That's not .357 data. While you are on the safer side, >always< be sure of the cartridge, bullet and powder when you're looking up load data. Please, PLEASE don't get them mixed up. You have to be right.

Here's the link to the site and data I was looking at for .357 Magnum. What am I looking wrong here? Thanks.
Cartridge Loads - Hodgdon Reloading Data Center - data.hodgdon.com

125 GR. HDY XTP  Winchester  231  .357"  1.455"  4.3  826  13,300 CUP  4.9  934  16,300 CUP