.38 special looked down upon?

[thedogfather]

Well, to add my .38 cents worth, I've been shooting the .38 special for many years and have never felt undergunned. They are just plain fun to shoot and their long track record "on the job" speaks for itself. I think over the last several years, with the increase in semi auto pistol options and all the "tactical" bells and whistles available, the revolver in general and the .38 special cartridge have fell out of favor with the general handgunning public. The .38 special is cheap to shoot, easy to handle and a proven self defense round if the need should arise.

 

[semperfi71]

I look down upon my .38 Specials a lot.

I look down on them as admire them in my hand as they exit the gunsafe.

I look down upon them as I raise them up to shoot them.

I have S&W's and Colt's and enjoy the heck out of reloading and shooting them.

If I were to carry concealed I'd carry an older J-Frame in .38 Special, or even .38 S & W. Easy to hide and carry and then easy to pull out and use with no safeties or switches. Just pull the trigger when you're ready.

 

[luis]

According to an FBI study done after the 1986 shooting, the 38 Special has killed more felons than all other handgun calibers combined. Need I say more?

 

[tom chapman]

38 is great

ived carried one for yrs. complete confidence . only one better in my opinion 1911 45.

 

[rpg0123]

I see many people at the range looking down at revolvers and making statements like, "Its an old timer, He STILL shoots a revolver."

It's not just old timers... it's people with good taste. I own exclusively revolvers at the moment, and I'm 26. When the gun range I frequent recently got rid of their rental revolvers, I heard somebody asking about why they didn't have rental revolvers anymore. The dude asking was maybe 20 years old.

 

[Barsch]

In my younger days, my on duty firearm was a S&W model 10, off duty it was a model 36 and my nightstick was wood with a leather strap. My job then was to prevent trouble. Today I'm the older guy walking a little slower, maybe with a slight limp, looking to avoid trouble...and always in my pocket (or IWB) is my chief special, with the factory grips and a Tyler that is a trusted old friend in my hand. The outside of the gun lost its shine a long time ago, but the inside is very well maintained, shot and cleaned often...and I have complete confidence in the ability of the .38 round and it's gray haired owner.

Some unsolicited advice for all you younger guys...if you're at the range and see a Tyler on some old guys revolver, don't bet against him.

 

[Black Knight]

I carried a revolver for many years as my duty weapon. Most were 357s with 38 Special +P ammo, others were 38 Specials. They were simple and worked every time. Several of the guys I work with wish we had been able to keep our S&W model 64's instead of going to Beretta's, but as they say, "the times they are a changin'".

 

[Capt Steve]

Too many folks remember the Dirty Harry scene where he explains to Tyne Daley why he carries a 44 Magnum. Something to the effect that a 357 is a fine weapon but he has seen 38's bounce of windshields..etc.. He carries the 44 because he hits what he aims at (muy macho). (o; Just because Clint Eastwood's character said it in a movie doesn't necessarily make it so. Now I am sure you could have a problem with a 38 vs a 44 or even a 357 but as pointed out it was good enough for LEO's for generations. Like many here I usually shoot 38's (+ P's), in both of my 357's. It is nice to have that option.

 

[Jim PHL]

My favorite revolvers are my 2.5" M19 and 3" M65's. All were bought or traded for used so I don't know their history, but I've never shot magnums out of any of them. Standard pressure .38's are fine for the range and treasury loads will work for defense if I need them.

 

[Infidel]

All of my revolvers are chambered for .38 Special+P. With quality ammo (I use 158 gr LSWCHP+P) you will have about the same bullet performance as with .357 Magnum. Also, a .38Spl+P will penetrate through the torso of an average human with no problem. So how much penetration do you really need?

Just select ammo suitable to the task and .38Spl is more than capable.

 

[Dave_n]

Took my "slightly breathed on" Model 67 to the range today (tapered 4" barrel variety) and had some "odd looks" from people with "Tupperware guns in various calibres". Then I simply shot my usual 0.38 reloads both single and double action at "minute of 4" paper plates". People were a trifle upset because the 70+ graybeard was hitting the plate and their ammo must have been bad as they could not get all of their shots into a regular 12 x 12 target at 10 yds. I simply said the it is the old mantra of "location. location, location (of the bullet)" that counts. The much younger set (with a visitor who was a prototypical Mall Ninja) were not happy campers. Dave_n

 

[LDThornton]

Took my "slightly breathed on" Model 67 to the range today (tapered 4" barrel variety) and had some "odd looks" from people with "Tupperware guns in various calibres". Then I simply shot my usual 0.38 reloads both single and double action at "minute of 4" paper plates". People were a trifle upset because the 70+ graybeard was hitting the plate and their ammo must have been bad as they could not get all of their shots into a regular 12 x 12 target at 10 yds. I simply said the it is the old mantra of "location. location, location (of the bullet)" that counts. The much younger set (with a visitor who was a prototypical Mall Ninja) were not happy campers. Dave_n

Ya gotta love it..... Personally, I will never own a tupperware gun.

 

[rkjent]

She may shoot better than the men because she is a distraction

Most people that critisize +P .38 are just gun snobs.

.38/44 Outdoorsman .38Special loaded to 1050ft/sec !

It's this woman's gun but nobody at the range laughs at her !

Jerry

P.S. : She is 5'11", can handle "problems" herself, and outshoots most of the men at my range !

 

[adwjc]

Dave N said it very well.

A lot of opinionated, but unskilled or ignorant folk have opinions not based on reality or experience.

At my club our biggest expense is replacing target stands that are shot up by the spray & pray crowd. We never run out of targets though.

The old saying "six for sure" rings true for many an old cop. The advent of multiple offenders helped drive the move to semiautos in my area. A few incidents were POs were shot trying to reload their revolvers helped the cause (backup guns were not allowed, in case they would be throwaways). Now we have some of the cops spraying too.

Where years ago you had a qualification score of 80% required to pass, now they only have to get 70% on the paper. Qualification is no longer a test of skill, it is now an exercise in litigation dimunation.

 

[eod354]

While at the range the other day, one of the guys brought in a vest to try some ammo on.


,45 JHP: stopped at front panel, a lot of blunt force trauma would have been sustained. poor expansion

9mm JHP: less BFT would have appeared to have been sustained. poor expansion, stopped at front panel.

40 JHP: BFT would have probably fallen between the 9mm and .45, poor expansion, stopped at front panel.

.357 JHP: Would have sustained significant BFT, great expansion, stopped in front panel.

.357 mag from 20" lever action: Through front and back panel like nothing.

.357 mag 158 gr. JHP from 4" ruger revolver: Surprised us...Through BOTH front and back panels... easily.

500 S&W Magnum - well...significant damage to the vest.

Both of us are getting the old S&W Model 19 2.5" out for more carry time. Still one of my favorites. I just ordered a pair of eagle secret service grips, and trying to fine a good ccw holster for it.

 

[andyL8]

Ruger gambled that people still love the 38 Spl, with their LCR. The only 38 Spl in my house is a late 40s, early 50s 5" M&P, but I have burned a LOT of the ammo in my Security Six and SP101 357s. Even +P handloads are pleasant to shoot in my 357s, compared to magnum loads.

Andy

 

[trusty4711]

Real Deal

I really wish it was looked down upon. Then maybe there would be more on the shelf to shoot. Go anywhere a box of 38 spl is like looking for the holy grail. The only reason they say it is because there afriad of wheel guns only six shoots no 30rd mags....( I'm scared I'm gonna have to aim and not blast away)

 

[maccpd]

When I started out we bought .357's Mine was a 686 the duty load was the .38spl 158 gr LSWCHP+P. I still use a 442 as a back-up. I agree that the .38spl has alot of life left in it especially in snubs. But I really agree with what SIGP220.45 said if you are are going to have only one revolver I would go with the .357 just so you could have the option of running the full spectrum of ammo through it.

 

[51plymouth]

I saw a bumper sticker that said "Nobody ever raped a .38".

 

[hedge313]

I hate em

Pretty soon I am going to stop buying all of them I can find.
The one in front is factory satin, and I polished the one in the back.

 

[squiggy]

look at 1 shot stop data. the 38 spl is down in the 80s. wile 9mm, 357, 40 and 45 all have loads that have produced one shot stops in the 90s. the 38 looks good not paper but not in the real world. that said I sure as heck don't want to be shot with one, but I sure as heck don't want to be shot with a 32....

 

[Landric]

look at 1 shot stop data. the 38 spl is down in the 80s. wile 9mm, 357, 40 and 45 all have loads that have produced one shot stops in the 90s. the 38 looks good not paper but not in the real world. that said I sure as heck don't want to be shot with one, but I sure as heck don't want to be shot with a 32....

Handgun Stopping Power and Street Stoppers are interesting reading, but given all the variables in actual gun fights and the necessity to drop all shootings involving multiple hits from the results, its not particularly useful in determining the overall effectiveness of various handgun cartridges beyond broad generalizations. I wouldn't choose my carry load based on any one particular source or set of data. The .38 Special has been used effectively for over 100 years. There are cartridges that do some jobs better than the .38, but there are also plenty that don't do the job nearly as well.

 

[Horseless Trooper]

I have the good fortune to be able to carry whatever I want at one of the PD's I work for so I chose a S&W Model 14-2 6 inch. It is stuffed with Federal 158+p LSWC right now but I am going to try the GoldDot short barrel loads soon just to see how they shoot. My other dept. mandates a Glock 21SF but I am working on the Chief to see if I can show him the error of his ways.

 

[Kanewpadle]

I load my 642 with Corbon 115gr at 1050fps. (4 inch barrel)

But it's still nothing to sneeze at.

According to an article on an another site, the S&W 642 was Smith's best selling handgun in 2006.

Ain't nothing like a j frame in the jacket pocket.

Read Ed Lovettes "The Snubby Revolver".

 

[Kanewpadle]

look at 1 shot stop data. the 38 spl is down in the 80s. wile 9mm, 357, 40 and 45 all have loads that have produced one shot stops in the 90s. the 38 looks good not paper but not in the real world. that said I sure as heck don't want to be shot with one, but I sure as heck don't want to be shot with a 32....

I have the utmost respect for Evan Marshall and his work. Those who truly know him and understand his work will tell you that the statistics gathered were meant to be used as a unit of measurement, not a tactical philosophy. Since his booked were published there has been a significant improvement in self defense ammo. Especially the 38spl. With modern loads such as Corbon DPX, Speer Short Barrel and others, the 38spl now closely resembles the 9MM.

But as always, bullet placement should be the first consideration.

 

[ENGINE18]

God made K-frames to shoot .38s! (and Js and Ls) Most of my handguns are .38s or .357s, but none of them ever saw a 158gr LSWCHP+P that they didn't like!

 

[pharmer]

38's? Nah, too puny. Joe

 

[Beans]

IN 1974 The Dept I was working for issued model 15's.

Four officers answered a burglery in progress call. We assembled at the front of the warehouse. The shift commander, with no military service, assembled our group.

He gave us a once over and discussed our plan of action. His eyes were as big a pie plate when he looked us over.

Shift Commander, Sgt Shinn (civilian no military experience) was holding his issued S&W model 15 4 inch

The other three of us were all recent Viet nam vets
Jack Kolb (USA 11-B) was holding a Colt Govt model in 45 ACP
George ( last name to long to spell and pronounce)(Brown water Navy) was carrying a Colt Gold Cup in .45 ACP
and I (USMC 0311) was carrying a Satin Chrome Colt Combat Commander in .45 ACP,-- I still have it.

No one was in the warehouse, but the shift commander never questioned the choice of weapons.

 

[Kanewpadle]

IN 1974 The Dept I was working for issued model 15's.

Four officers answered a burglery in progress call. We assembled at the front of the warehouse. The shift commander, with no military service, assembled our group.

He gave us a once over and discussed our plan of action. His eyes were as big a pie plate when he looked us over.

Shift Commander, Sgt Shinn (civilian no military experience) was holding his issued S&W model 15 4 inch

The other three of us were all recent Viet nam vets
Jack Kolb (USA 11-B) was holding a Colt Govt model in 45 ACP
George ( last name to long to spell and pronounce)(Brown water Navy) was carrying a Colt Gold Cup in .45 ACP
and I (USMC 0311) was carrying a Satin Chrome Colt Combat Commander in .45 ACP,-- I still have it.

No one was in the warehouse, but the shift commander never questioned the choice of weapons.

Great story.

 

[Dave T]

Well after 10 pages I guess I'm going to be the lone voice in the wilderness. I don't much like the 38 Special, with one exception. I do like the old 38/44 and have two Heavy Duties to prove it. They seem to like a +P load I found that pushes a 158g hard cast SWC at 1050 fps from a 4" barrel. The 5" HD might be getting closer to 1100 fps.

My favorite cartridge for revolvers is the 44 Special. I still wish S&W would make a 5 shot K-frame 44 Special. If Charter Arms can do it I just refuse to believe Smith couldn't pull it off.

My dislike for the 38 Special was formed back when I first got into handguns and the standard load was the 158g round nose lead bullet at 750 to 850 fps depending on barrel length. That one failed to stop about as often as it succeeded. Yea, better bullets and loads are available now and I don't begrudge anyone who wants to carry a 38 Special. It just isn't a caliber/cartridge I will use (with the previous stated exception of 38/44s). Another part of my lack of enthusiasm is probably because the J-frames are just too small for my hand. My trigger finger often hits the frame before the trigger pull is completed. Squeezing as hard as you can and not having the gun go off is kind of a turn off (LOL).

Oh well, you folks that love them are welcome to them. Just don't forget to pass on the 44 Specials you come across. Some of us can always use another one of those. (smiley face goes here)

Dave