38 Spl +P

[Cyrano]

I'd like some 38 Special +P loads using the H&G # 58GC 156 gr bullet, and the RCBS 9mm-124-RN bullet. Recommendations on bullet alloys would be welcome too.

My Lyman handbook doesn't list +P loads. I'll use them in a 2 inch barreled S&W 638-3 rated for +P. It carries Speer 135 gr +P short barrel Gold Dots. I shoot it for practice with the SAECO #50 150 gr wadcutter ahead of 3.0 grs of W 231. This is an accurate and gentle load, and is satisfactory for most of my practice which is usually at about 10 yds but sometimes goes as far as 25 yds. However I would like to get some idea of the trajectory at longer ranges and the #50/3.0 of 231 doesn't have a trajectory anywhere like the Speer loads. I'd use these loads up a canyon out in the desert on yuccas and rocks out to about 100 yds, to get an idea of how high I have to hold to hit targets at those distances. Sounds like fun. Any help gratefully received.

 

[tlen]

Alliant has .38 Special +P loads for 158 gr LSWC bullets. As long as you use the typical Lyman #2 alloy you shouldn't have a problem with .38 +P loads as the velocities aren't that great.

 

[ChuckS1]

For the 158 gr SWC, try 3.6 grns of Bullseye.

 

[Skip Sackett]

Funny, I've shot 3.5gr of Bullseye under a 160gr LSWC for years as a target round! Surely not +P! Maybe it is now!

What powders do you have available to you? There are some good 38spl +P loads available with other powders than W231/HP-38.

As for how high to hold, I think you will be surprised. The shorter sighting radius of the 2" barrel will prove to be difficult to have repeat shots. Think about it, the shorter radius means small changes make a lot of difference. Of course that is a moot point if you are as solid as a steel rest!

 

[ChuckS1]

Not +P, but a good start to work up from to about 4.5 grns. If he likes that, then we get out Speer #8 and the SR-4756 and really start to have fun...

 

[Skip Sackett]

Oh, yeah, we can talk about them!

 

[Cyrano]

I have more powders than I really need. For this application I have Bullseye, W 231, Unique, and Accurate Arms 5. I even think I have some Accurate Arms 2 somewhere. I'd prefer one of the faster powders, since I'm only working with 2 inches of barrel. I know I'm going to have to hold over quite a lot: the point of the exercise is to get a feel for how much. Experiencing it is worth a lot more than reading about it. Standing, with a two handed hold, I'm about as steady as a reed in a hurricane; I expect some pretty large groups with that short sight radius. I was shooting a Colt Bankers's Special 22 at a target today, and was surprised at the size of the groups from what appeared to be perfect sight pictures.

I can hit a torso sized target fairly consistently at 100 yds with a 6 inch barreled 357. In fact when I wandered the desert a lot I used to carry it sighted in for that range for more stand-off capability. I found, even with the sight radius of the 6 inch barrel, I had to have an absolutely perfect sight picture, and a very good trigger squeeze helped too. I imagine that with the shorter sight radius of the snubbie, I'll be lucky to hit an automobile sized target. Hitting a clay pigeon at 100 yds would be miraculous for somebody at my level of marksmanship.

 

[Skip Sackett]

It has been noted over and over again that even in short barrels, slower powders generate more velocity.

A load of 2400 from a 2" barrel will yield more velocity than say, a maximum load of Bullseye. Too much information out there to dispute that. Are you going to have a fireball with the slower powder? Yes. Efficient use of the barrel length with powder choice? No. Still, all in all, slower powders generate greater velocity.

The two that you have that I would use for this test are Unique or AA#5. Unique has it's followers, that's for sure!

Try 5.3gr to 5.9gr AA#5 or up to 5.2gr of Unique with a 158gr LSWC.

I think you are missing my point about how high to hold. Elmer Keith said that he would hold the base of the front sight blade even with the top of the rear sight for long distance shots. If you do that with your 2" barrel you are going to over shoot your target for awhile unless you have a spotter.

I have shot 6" barreled "L" frames with 125gr JSPHP factory rounds at clay pigeons at 100 yards and only had to have a standard sight picture with a 12 o'clock hold. Didn't hit them every time, scared a few of them pretty consistently though!



Have fun a be safe.

 

[Vanilla Gorilla]

Not +P, but a good start to work up from to about 4.5 grns. If he likes that, then we get out Speer #8 and the SR-4756 and really start to have fun...

Keep talking like that and somebody else will get banned from the forum.