.38Spl 148grn. PLATED DEWC; W231

[SPDGG]

Hello,

Majority of the time I shot indoors. Local indoor ranges around here require FMJ or Completely Plated Bullet Ammo, No Lead or HP.

I searched for load data & feedback from other shooters using Xtreme, formerly known as West Coast Bullets, & Berry's 148 grain Copper Plated DEWC & Winchester 231. Searched multiple sites and only found a couple threads regarding the PLATED 148grn. DEWC.

Berry's recommends NOT to use LEAD 148grn HBWC data with their Cooper Plated Bullets.
Also, to load their plated bullets to ABOVE 800+ fps.
38 / 357 plated pistol bullets

Both manufactures recommend using reloading data IN BETWEEN Lead & Jacket Bullets. Data from manuf. sites, books and from other shooters posts using W231 were from 3.1-3.5 grains with LEAD 148grn HBWC.

Hodgdon HP-38/W231 Data link:
Cartridge Loads - Hodgdon Reloading Data Center - data.hodgdon.com

One member's thread here on S&W-Forum tried 4.0grains W231 with the PLATED 148grn. DEWC from a S&W Model 14-3.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/reloading/115241-plated-148gr-dewc-quality.html

My goal is to develop a PLATED 148grn DEWC .38Spl Load that is Light, & Accurate.

So far I have had great results from:

Revolver:
- S&W 14-3 6" .38Spl

10/06/10 Load:
Bullet: Xtreme Copper PLATED 148grn. DEWC w/ Canneular
Primer: CCI 500 SPP
Brass: Remington Brass .38 Spl
Powder: Winchester/W231 3.8 grains
Charge Weight: 3.8 Grains
Crimp: Taper Crimp
OAL: 1.227"

Randomly selected pieces, Close Up Pics:

* Will post additional target group pics, other load data/results & MV data as time permits.

 

[aquagear]

I have used the very same bullet. I have used either 3.2 gr of bullseye, or 3.0 of titegroup With plated bullets I normally start +.2 gr from the bottom lead load as a starting point, the plated bullets are not really that much harder to move than lead as the plating is very thin when compared to a jacketed round.( hope this helps) Good shooting

 

[SPDGG]

Thank you for your input/feedback, Appreciate it.
I'll load up some W231 @ 3.6gr & report back.

Anyone else have data on this bullet, 148gr. Plated DEWC?

Have a great one

 

[chingachkook]

go here: Rainier Ballistics, mainframe and in the left column click on reloading data. That should answer your question.

 

[Kevin G]

Similar situation on this end, indoor range requires jacketed or plated bullets.
Loading for a 52-2, object in addition to accuracy is to have just enough power to cycle the action reliably.

Win#231.
3.2grs for lead HBWC
3.4grs for plated HBWC & DEWC.

Would appreciate thoughts on the (Berry's) plated HBWC. Seems to me the plating makes the surface of the bullet harder than lead and the hollow base cavity shape and volume are smaller than lead HBWC, skirt is thicker. I question whether the bullet skirt will expand as a lead one does. Thoughts?

Tks, Kevin

 

[TSQUARED]

I have used the old standby load of 2.7 gr. Bullseye, Rem 1.5 behind the Remington 148 gr. LHBWC for many years. I experimented with both the Rainier 148 gr. WC and the Berry's 148 gr. HBWC. With the solid base Rainier bullet the velocity was somewhat lower but n increased charge of W-231 remedied that issue. With the hollow based Berry's bullet the velocity was 100+ fpos lower than with standard loads. I finally used up the remainder of the batch with 4.0 gr. W-231. In either case I did not experience the gilt edge accuracy of the Remington lead bullet.

 

[SPDGG]

Thank you everyone for your input/feedback/data, Really appreciate it.

Seems I'm going backwards than what is norm for load development. . .I usually load up than load down.

I tried out W231 @ 3.6grns & 3.8grns. today out of two S&W K-Frame .38 Spl(s).

Model 14-3 6" .38Spl
- Prints better with the 3.8grn W231 load than the 3.6grn W231 load.
- 3.6grn W231 recoil was just a tad lower, but nothing significant.
* Will probably stick with this unless the next load of 3.4grns. does better.

Mrs.'s Model 10-5 2"
- Prints better with the 3.6grn W231 load, but 3.8 was still quite accurate.
- 3.6grn W231 recoil was just a tad lower, but nothing significant.
* Trying to come up with a softer recoiling load for her to practice with.

I'll try 3.4grn W231 to see if it feels & groups any better than the previous loads in both.

Appreciate any input or suggestions, Thanks.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Just be careful when shooting the lower charge weight. The reason Berry's is recommending no less than 800 fps is because they are fearful of the bullet sticking in the barrel. There's no problem as long as you are aware of it and make sure you don't pull the trigger again if you are in doubt. The next shot will become very interesting very fast.

Anyway, it's always a good idea to carry a brass rod and light hammer with you to the range in case of a stuck bullet from a squib or other reason.

 

[Rule3]

Hodgdons web site data for a 148 LHBWC and Win 231 or HP 38 lists 3.5 to 4.0 gr with a max velocity of 956 fps out of a 7" test barrel so you will never exceed the 1200 fps max they mandate for their plated bullets. So I would stay more towards the max end of the load data for lead.

I used to shoot nothing but their plated bullets in almost every handgun caliber. Mostly 9mm and 40SW going a lot faster than a 38 load. I generally just used the average of the high and low values for FMJ if I could not find the lead data.

They loads you have listed should be just fine. The 3.4 to 3.6 range sounds good to me. I would never be able to tell the difference.

Cartridge Loads - Hodgdon Reloading Data Center - data.hodgdon.com

 

[SW CQB 45]

I bought two boxes of this (Berry's 148 HBWC) and was planning to load my standard 2.8 of Bullseye this winter and practice.

If this load is not sufficient for these slugs....then I will need to push as I want to stick with what I will shoot from 50 yds in a match and in practice.

dont know why I bought them....

 

[Snobal]

I believe that HP-38 and Win 231 are the same powder.

I've been wanting the try either one to compare to my "pet" 357 Mag target load with Bullseye powder and my cast BBWC bullets from an RCBS 148 Grain BBWC mold.

Last week I tried 3.4, 3.6, and 3.8 grains of HP-38 with my cast bullets and got no real difference in group size. Each of the three charge weights shot great groups (just not as good as my favorite Bullseye powder load).

My chronograph is "on the blink," but when I get it working, I'll clock these loads and see if the chronograph shows any real difference in the extreme velocity spread of 12 shot groups of these three charge weights.

I really like HP-38 because it flows like water through the powder drop, throws very uniform charges, and leaves the bore as clean as my favorite Bullseye load.

The things I like better about Bullseye than HP-38 is that Bullseye (so far) shoots better groups for me and the Bullseye powder/lube residue is easier to wipe off the gun.

I tried copper plated DEWC bullets last year and never could find a powder and charge weight that would produce groups of less than 2" at 25 yards like my cast bullets. I'd get results like 20 of 24 shots into a nice group, but the constant "flyers" spread the total group size to unacceptable levels.

JMHO - YRMV

 

[Rule3]

I believe that HP-38 and Win 231 are the same powder.

They are, exactly the same. Different labels.

 

[PattonTime]

Berrys 148 HBWC

I have had good luck with almost all the faster pistol powders I try this with.
I just go .2-.3 more then what the book says for lead.
I have never understood peoples trying so hard to go lighter.
There is no recoil with a 38 Special target load in the first place, I do not want to risk squibs by going too light.
I shoot out of various Smith Target Masterpieces and my Model 52's.
They all shoot better then I do.I like these bullets better then lead, I do not like the lube smoke.