Went to the range today, my 4006 has an issue. After 3 shots gun would no longer fire. I took it apart (field strip) and don't see the problem. When I rack the slide with an empty mag it resets sa/da fine. With ammo in the magizine it wont reset properly. When I rack the slide with ammo in, the bar that sits in the recoil spring juts out a bit. Sorry for the lousy decription. Any idea what's the problem?
4006 problem
- Thread starter ar33
- Start date
joseph whitney
Member
If the guide rod inside the recoil spring is not in the nothc on the barrel,it will give the problem you are looking at. Regards,Joe
joseph whitney
Member
If the guide rod inside the recoil spring is not in the notch on the lower part of the barrel,it will give the problem you are looking at. Regards,Joe
SW CQB 45
Member
out of battery?
dirty chamber/bad ammo???
dirty chamber/bad ammo???
Hmmm. Not trying to offend, but are you sure the rod is notched in the right spot on the barrel? (Don't ask me why I am asking you that question -- let's just say I speak from experience. 
)
Bump to the top for you. Come on experts!
)Bump to the top for you. Come on experts!
Very understandable question, I am sure it is in the right spot. I broke it down and set it back up 6 times to be sure. I have 2 other 3rd gen smiths, the guide rod is set correctly on slot on barrel. What is strange is that it will reset with no ammo in.
Trying to think outside the box, is there anything in the saftey/decok that could be hanging up the slide? My 4006 was LE, the saftey lever on the outside is not there. Any possible connection to this issue?
Trying to think outside the box, is there anything in the saftey/decok that could be hanging up the slide? My 4006 was LE, the saftey lever on the outside is not there. Any possible connection to this issue?
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18DAI
Absent Comrade
I'm no gunsmith but when I've experienced the problem you describe it always entailed an improprly seated guide rod.
I'm confused by your statement that; "the safety lever is not there". ???
Do you mean that it is a single sided safety lever vice ambi?
I would look at the slidestop and the pin atop the guide rod. Does the pin move in and out freely? Is it tensioned? Is the pin deformed or peened?
Is there a shiny spot on your slide stop where the pin rests, or is it worn badly? Regards 18DAI.
I'm confused by your statement that; "the safety lever is not there". ???
Do you mean that it is a single sided safety lever vice ambi?
I would look at the slidestop and the pin atop the guide rod. Does the pin move in and out freely? Is it tensioned? Is the pin deformed or peened?
Is there a shiny spot on your slide stop where the pin rests, or is it worn badly? Regards 18DAI.
Yes, single sided safety lever vice ambi. I'm sure guide rod is seated correctly, I realize that it would explain whats happing here if it was not. I have 2 other 3rd gen smiths so I'm confident I have the guide rod seated in right spot. I will check these two tonight when I get home:
I would look at the slidestop and the pin atop the guide rod. Does the pin move in and out freely? Is it tensioned? Is the pin deformed or peened?
Is there a shiny spot on your slide stop where the pin rests, or is it worn badly?
I would look at the slidestop and the pin atop the guide rod. Does the pin move in and out freely? Is it tensioned? Is the pin deformed or peened?
Is there a shiny spot on your slide stop where the pin rests, or is it worn badly?
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Regards 18DAI.
Send the 4006 back to S&W for examination & repair.
If the hammer does not hold in single action when releasing the slide via the slide stop lever, or by manually retracting and releasing the slide, I'd suspect there's probably an issue involving the hammer and/or the sear.
Presuming, of course, that the manual safety lever is in the Up/Off Safe - Ready to Fire position when the slide is being released and this is happening. If it's in the Down/On Safe position, then the hammer should decock and not hold in the single action/cocked position. I'm not trying to infer you are unfamiliar with how the TDA guns operate, but sometimes an owner/user can overlook something like the position of the lever when they're distracted, thinking something may not be working properly.
I would NOT try to shoot the gun until it's been examined and determined safe for use again ... but, just out of curiosity, did this happen when you were trying to shoot the gun, or just when handling & manipulating it while using live rounds? (I'd use dummy rounds for examination purpose.)
Whether or not there are live rounds in the magazine, and the magazine is in the gun at the time this is happening, might be a coincidence.
FWIW, just a while ago one of our folks had a fairly new 4566TSW that started not holding in single action during live fire. It happened sporadically (but obviously shouldn't happen at all) and they didn't bring it to my attention until they were done shooting. I checked the gun at the bench (unloaded) and was able to replicate the the hammer failing to hold when running the slide at least once.
The first thing I did was completely disassemble the gun and give it a good cleaning. Why? Because the inside was terribly dirty and fouled. Fouling had congealed around the hammer and sear to the point that the sear appeared to be sticking. Once the parts in the frame were clean and dry, I couldn't get the hammer to follow the slide again when running it by hand and the gun passed all bench checks for normal functioning. I had the user and another instructor take it down range and run a couple boxes of ammunition through it. The gun ran just fine, as intended. (I also discussed how to properly clean and lubricate a TDA gun without using an excessive amount of solvent/CLP, too.
)
I was almost expecting a worn hammer (SA notches) or sear (nose), but it turned out to be a heavy accumulation of fouling, combined with what appeared to be excessive solvent/CLP where it should not have been (inside the frame's working parts), which was causing the sear to stick.
I have, however, come across an occasional older gun which had a worn hammer and/or sear. It just depends, and such conditions need to be checked and identified in any particular gun so they can be properly addressed and resolved.
LE duty guns can sometimes be subjected to "maintenance" at the user level which can border on neglect and abuse ... but that's just a personal observation and opinion.
Let us known what S&W determines to be the case in your gun.
If the hammer does not hold in single action when releasing the slide via the slide stop lever, or by manually retracting and releasing the slide, I'd suspect there's probably an issue involving the hammer and/or the sear.
Presuming, of course, that the manual safety lever is in the Up/Off Safe - Ready to Fire position when the slide is being released and this is happening. If it's in the Down/On Safe position, then the hammer should decock and not hold in the single action/cocked position. I'm not trying to infer you are unfamiliar with how the TDA guns operate, but sometimes an owner/user can overlook something like the position of the lever when they're distracted, thinking something may not be working properly.
I would NOT try to shoot the gun until it's been examined and determined safe for use again ... but, just out of curiosity, did this happen when you were trying to shoot the gun, or just when handling & manipulating it while using live rounds? (I'd use dummy rounds for examination purpose.)
Whether or not there are live rounds in the magazine, and the magazine is in the gun at the time this is happening, might be a coincidence.
FWIW, just a while ago one of our folks had a fairly new 4566TSW that started not holding in single action during live fire. It happened sporadically (but obviously shouldn't happen at all) and they didn't bring it to my attention until they were done shooting. I checked the gun at the bench (unloaded) and was able to replicate the the hammer failing to hold when running the slide at least once.
The first thing I did was completely disassemble the gun and give it a good cleaning. Why? Because the inside was terribly dirty and fouled. Fouling had congealed around the hammer and sear to the point that the sear appeared to be sticking. Once the parts in the frame were clean and dry, I couldn't get the hammer to follow the slide again when running it by hand and the gun passed all bench checks for normal functioning. I had the user and another instructor take it down range and run a couple boxes of ammunition through it. The gun ran just fine, as intended. (I also discussed how to properly clean and lubricate a TDA gun without using an excessive amount of solvent/CLP, too.
)I was almost expecting a worn hammer (SA notches) or sear (nose), but it turned out to be a heavy accumulation of fouling, combined with what appeared to be excessive solvent/CLP where it should not have been (inside the frame's working parts), which was causing the sear to stick.
I have, however, come across an occasional older gun which had a worn hammer and/or sear. It just depends, and such conditions need to be checked and identified in any particular gun so they can be properly addressed and resolved.
LE duty guns can sometimes be subjected to "maintenance" at the user level which can border on neglect and abuse ... but that's just a personal observation and opinion.
Let us known what S&W determines to be the case in your gun.
Fastbolt,
You give great advice and I appreciate you focus on safety. Yes, safety lever was in fire position. Yes, This happened at the range, I took gun apart (field strip) and put back together and still would not fire. Later at home I took apart again, cleaned, put back together and tried with dummy rounds and still would not cock to sa. Just to ease my mind I tried again today, still same result. Gun is being boxed up and sent to Smith tom. I will update this when I get it back.
You give great advice and I appreciate you focus on safety. Yes, safety lever was in fire position. Yes, This happened at the range, I took gun apart (field strip) and put back together and still would not fire. Later at home I took apart again, cleaned, put back together and tried with dummy rounds and still would not cock to sa. Just to ease my mind I tried again today, still same result. Gun is being boxed up and sent to Smith tom. I will update this when I get it back.
Fastbolt, I'm interested in this. I've acquired several 3rd gen TDA pistols over the past several months but have not been able to find any instructions on how to clean them properly. The owner's manuals are largely useless. Beyond explaining how to field strip they don't discuss the proper tools, solvents, oils or how to use them. Your instruction would be appreciated greatly here!
Thanks!
cmr
Got 4006 back from wesson today, gun has been fixed, and works perfectly. The comment they left is " rounded stock in chamber seat". Can someone here describe this comment and explain what they did?
Happy to have it back!
adam
ar33c9
Happy to have it back!
adam
ar33c9
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