442 PC Shooting Way Left

[Kifaru]

I just picked up one of those 442 Performance Center J-Frames that Bud's Gunshop was selling for $399. I figured that a PC gun with a tuned trigger for $399 shipped was a tough deal to beat. The gun looked great initially, but I took it to the range and it was shooting about 3" to the left at 7 yards and about 1 1/2" to the left at 5 yards with WWB 130 gr., PMC 132 gr., and some Perfecta 158 gr. FMJ (snappy stuff). I thought it might be me as I am not used to those Desantis Hip Grips that the gun came with, and every other fixed-sight S&W I've ever had has been pretty much dead on.

So I switched grips and got the same results. I took a closer look at the barrel, and it is indeed canted to the right ever so slightly. The center line of the sight rib and the center of the gutter for the rear sight is off by about a millimeter or so. It's very noticeable if I look at the barrel straight on. I can see that there is more frame showing on one side of the barrel. I know that they make a million of these, and a bad one is bound to slip through every now and then, but I guess I expected a bit more QC from the PC.

I don't know if I can get used to that much of a deviation. Should I send it back to S&W, or am I overreacting?

 

[kaaskop49]

If you're speaking about the Chattanooga Shooting Supplies "pinto" model with a stainless cylinder and black frame, I bought two recently. One is fine, the 2nd is at my gunsmith because the DA "fatigued" and the gun would not cycle reliably, if at all. I also am concerned about the apparent lack of QC by the PC on this model. I also own 2 of the "Wyatt" PC 637s from a few years back, and while they have that same terrible (IMO) grip, they cycle wonderfully and are a pleasure to shoot and carry.

If you know how to shoot, have changed to a better grip and are still shooting so far off at a minimal distance of 5 yards, I would send it back. Taking my experience into account, the PC should not be putting their stamp on these models with such firing-line issues. Please let us know how it turns out.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

 

[slabside2]

It used to be there lack of quality control was just limited to the standard production guns now it's trickling into the Performance Center Guns. So sad.

 

[Wee Hooker]

I bought a 637 with the same issue a while back. It shot 6" left at 50' as I recall. Sent it to smith and the gave the barrel a good whack or two to straighten it out. All good now. Shoots POA. Give them a call.

 

[Edmo]

To echo others, send it back. However, my personal experience says be prepared to send it back again if it isn't right.

My Pro Series 640 had to make four trips back to the mothership and had two new barrels installed before a point-of-aim/point-of-impact issue was finally solved.

They will fix it... At least the FedEx boys are keeping busy with all of the S&W shipping labels.

Edmo

 

[Florida J Frame]

Seems to be a business decision. They sell so many guns to people that don't know the difference it's worth the expense to fix the few that come back from knowledgeable shooters. It's not your father's Smith & Wesson. The other issue is the craftsmen have all retired and now we have machinists making guns.

 

[APS]

Before you send it back just verify with an empty gun that you aren't pulling the trigger incorrectly. Watch the front sight and see if it twitches left at the break.
If no problem there send it back. I have two 642 Talos and had to send one back for shooting left. Came back in a little over a week and the barrel was centered.

 

[Kifaru]

If you're speaking about the Chattanooga Shooting Supplies "pinto" model with a stainless cylinder and black frame, I bought two recently. One is fine, the 2nd is at my gunsmith because the DA "fatigued" and the gun would not cycle reliably, if at all. I also am concerned about the apparent lack of QC by the PC on this model. I also own 2 of the "Wyatt" PC 637s from a few years back, and while they have that same terrible (IMO) grip, they cycle wonderfully and are a pleasure to shoot and carry.

If you know how to shoot, have changed to a better grip and are still shooting so far off at a minimal distance of 5 yards, I would send it back. Taking my experience into account, the PC should not be putting their stamp on these models with such firing-line issues. Please let us know how it turns out.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Yes, it is one of those Chattanooga Shooting Supplies "pinto" guns, nice looking little smokewagon, even if a little blingy. I started at 7 yards because that's a distance at which I know I can shoot good groups from standing. Pulling to the left even after moving in to five yards was disappointing. On my second trip out with a "normal" set of S&W rubber bootgrips installed, I brought along my trusty 642 for comparison to make sure it wasn't me. It wasn't me. The 642 shot like it always does, dead nuts on.

Thanks for the input, everyone. I will contact S&W for a shipping label. I'll let you all know how it turns out.

 

[kaaskop49]

Yes, it is one of those Chattanooga Shooting Supplies "pinto" guns, nice looking little smokewagon, even if a little blingy. I started at 7 yards because that's a distance at which I know I can shoot good groups from standing. Pulling to the left even after moving in to five yards was disappointing. On my second trip out with a "normal" set of S&W rubber bootgrips installed, I brought along my trusty 642 for comparison to make sure it wasn't me. It wasn't me. The 642 shot like it always does, dead nuts on.

Thanks for the input, everyone. I will contact S&W for a shipping label. I'll let you all know how it turns out.

One byproduct of these little "smokewagons" (Love that term, haven't heard it for ages!) is that I find myself humming, singing, and two-stepping Glenn Miller's "Chattanooga Choo Choo." BTW, it was the 1st gold record ever! There's another Forum member here who refers to his 442 PC as his "choo pinto."

Kaaskop49

 

[Kifaru]

One byproduct of these little "smokewagons" (Love that term, haven't heard it for ages!) is that I find myself humming, singing, and two-stepping Glenn Miller's "Chattanooga Choo Choo." BTW, it was the 1st gold record ever! There's another Forum member here who refers to his 442 PC as his "choo pinto."

Kaaskop49

My mom loved '40s music and played it all the time when we were growing up. Later, I went to school at the University of Colorado, and as Glenn Miller was one of the more distinguished alumnus of that school, it was nearly required that students commit "Chattanooga Choo Choo" to memory. It's a toe tapper, alright!

 

[Kifaru]

It took about two and a half weeks, which was fine since I was on vacation, and the turnaround seemed faster than I expected. And it took me another few weeks to finally get to the range. But I'm happy with the results. The four rounds on the left are from the first cylinder I fired. Then I figured out how to use those DeSantis Clip-Grip stocks...sorta. I had to grip a bit tighter with my strong-side thumb to counteract my trigger finger pushing against the clip on the grips. After about 50 rounds this technique proved, uh, suboptimal. All in all, though, not a bad little shooter.

 

[iPac]

Glad you got it fixed. There is no cure for a canted barrel on a fixed sight gun. It's not like you can adjust the rear leaf to offset it. Even if you could, a canted barrel is so annoying that it makes a gun almost un-ownable, at least for me. I had to have my 629 barrel straightened cause it had a canted barrel and I couldn't live with it.

 

[kaaskop49]

I would ditch those grips since they seem to do nothing well, IMO. Please try your 'smoke wagon' with another type of grip. Sad as I wrote above about lack of PC QC. Perhaps we should ask the factory to "choo choo us home!"

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

 

[APS]

Had to send one of my 642 talo back, they reset the barrel and had it back quick. I personally would not put up with blisters. If you can swing it, the crimson trace LG-405 have a nice recoil pocket and since the laser is on the grip, the holster options are huge. I had one of those lasermax lights on my 642 and basically there is one flimsy pocket holster available.

 

[ParadiseRoad]

...maybe the barrel was loose...since they're not pinned anymore...

 

[Kifaru]

I would ditch those grips since they seem to do nothing well, IMO. Please try your 'smoke wagon' with another type of grip. Sad as I wrote above about lack of PC QC. Perhaps we should ask the factory to "choo choo us home!"

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Yeah, those grips leave a LOT to be desired. There is a reason for them, however. I plan to use this revolver as a BUG dedicated to ankle carry. Both Claude Werner and Michael deBethencourt have opined that as awkward as it is to present from an ankle rig, it's far worse to reholster. After the action, it makes sense to have an alternate way to quickly stow the gun that is concealed yet readily accessible. That way, you're covered regardless of who shows up first: the police or your attacker's friends and family. I like that idea.

I also like the idea of a laser on my defensive guns, especially J-Frames. I prefer Crimson Trace Grips, but they don't come with a clip, and they will not work with a Clipdraw, Techna Clip, or similar. Optics Planet had the LaserMax on sale for $104 shipped, and it happened that LaserMax was also running a $30 mail-in rebate offer. So for less than $75, I figure it's worth a try. As far as the holster goes, I have a friend who owns an upholstery shop and also does leatherwork out of his house. I asked him about it, and he says it would be no problem to modify my Galco Ankle Glove to fit.

Finally, the grips are inexpensive enough to where I wouldn't mind risking experimenting with some epoxy resin putty such as Aves Epoxy Sculpt or even JB Weld to re-contour them. They also look as if they would be easy to stipple if needed.

I've tried ankle carry before, and I could never fully embrace it. Still, there are certain situations where ankle carry would be very handy. So I'll try a little harder to make it work this time.

 

[kaaskop49]

Attn kifaru

Thanks for acknowledging my post. If you are going to work on the grips, the 'shelf' is too small for IWB carry w/o holster. Shelf aside, they pretty much dupe the boot-grip design. Take care not to lose the escutcheons: the teeny screw holding one fell off at the range, fortunately in my hand.

IMO, ankle carry makes the most sense when driving a vehicle. How else to access a firearm on your person when driving scrunched up and locked in by the belt?

Please let us know how you handle this kettle of fish!

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

 

[Kifaru]

IMO, ankle carry makes the most sense when driving a vehicle. How else to access a firearm on your person when driving scrunched up and locked in by the belt?

Please let us know how you handle this kettle of fish!

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Yes! That is what I was thinking. This was the main reason I tried ankle carry in the past, using a strong-side (left leg) holster on the right leg, butt forward. This way I can do a sort of cavalry draw with my right hand and not have to reach around the steering wheel. Additionally, I've recently come to realize that if I am knocked on my back and my attacker has mounted me, this would be about the only way to access a weapon from a closed-guard position. I'll let you know how things work out. It might be a while, though. The guy I have lined up for the holster has 5 kids, and school just started. And they are all playing fall sports. To say he's a little busy right now would be an understatement!

 

[gnystrom]

It used to be there lack of quality control was just limited to the standard production guns now it's trickling into the Performance Center Guns. So sad.

AMEN!!!!!!