455 Hand ejector question

[kayak]

Is there any way to tell if one of the British proofed 455 hand ejector was converted to 45 colt by Smith and Wesson as opposed to a private gunsmith? Mine has all the British proof marks the 'not english made' mark and is serial numbered 12xxx. It also does not have any cartridge designation anywhere on the gun not even 455 on the barrel.
Thanks for any info you can provide.

 

[kayak]

hopefully uploading photo

Photo of the barrel

 

[Buford57]

Caliber marking was not uniform on the .455s and it is not unusual for there to be none.

Conversion methods that are earmarks of non-factory origin include:

Shaving the rear of the cylinder, which eliminates the serial number (this is more common on .45ACP/Auto Rim conversions)

Milling the recoil shield.


If the chambers have been countersunk for the Colt rim, it could go either way, but while I have heard of S&W converting surplus .455s still in inventory at war's end to .45 Colt, I can't say I've seen an example that can be verified as converted by the factory after a trip across the pond and back.

Never say never, and more experienced voices will soon be heard.

 

[kayak]

thanks -

the cylinder hasnt been shaved and I dont think the recoil shield has been milled - it does not have have the crown over 30 on the butt but each cylinder is proof marked -
I bought it with the intention of rust bluing it as the finish is no longer blue - it isnt pitted so I thought it might be a good project but I want to make sure it isnt unique as I dont want to devalue it if it is unique -
not sure if I am patient enough for a letter from Smith -

 

[DCWilson]

My .455/Second was converted to .45 Colt by lengthening the chambers and planing the face of the recoil shield.

The barrel was additionally marked CAL. 45 S.W. above and to the right of the original SMITH & WESSON .455. rollmark:

I have heard of a couple of other guns that are similarly marked, but despite discussion on this forum in the past, I am still confused about the "45 S.W." reference. If S&W handled the conversion, this might be how they marked it. If somebody else did a series of conversions, I don't know what "S.W." really stands for. It needn't be Smith & Wesson, as I don't recall every hearing of a .45 S&W cartridge dimensioned like the .45 Colt. I think there was briefly a .45 S&W that was shorter than the .45 Colt and went nowhere commercially.

Super Webley? Standard Workhorse? So What?

This gun is from very late in the second model production sequence -- S/N 73778.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

David, I believe .45 S&W was the Schofield cartridge which was shorter than the .45 Colt and resulted in the Army moving to the Colt SAA instead of the Schofield as the military service revolver. But, I doubt that your gun is chambered for it. More likely it is chambered for the .45 Colt.

 

[DCWilson]

That's right. I remember Hondo44 suggested the .45 Schofield some time ago, and it just slipped my mind.

Yes, this gun chambers .45 Colt. I have wondered if it went through a two-step cartridge conversion, first to .45 Schofield and later to .45 Colt, or if it was just ground out for the longer cartridge first and labeled for the other one because S&W would not at the time put the word "Colt" on one of their products.

I know the gun was worked on at least a couple of different times because it has target sights on it now -- Micro, probably early '60s -- and a pretty nice recent refinish.

Here's the whole gun photographed from its least attractive angle. Ugly to regard, but a hoot to shoot. Very accurate. If you move it around hastily, you can do some inadvertent damage to work surfaces and lamps with that front sight.

 

[Hondo44]

If none of the three routine headspace enlargements have been done, I wonder if the front of the cylinder and the gas ring were shaved off ??? Only about .015" is needed. I guess it's possible.....

 

[lebomm]

I don't think that conversion would work, as the extractor and ratchet would move forward, making function unreliable.

Larry

 

[Hondo44]

I don't think that conversion would work, as the extractor and ratchet would move forward, making function unreliable.

Larry

You may be right. I didn't give it a lot of thought initially. But after taking my gun apart I'm convinced it will work. The difference between the 455 rim and 45 Colt rim is actually .015", which isn't very much. The extractor pin will need the same .015" removed from the rear of its collar (which is .055" wide) as is removed from the front of the cylinder. Therefore it will not change its position.

The ratchet star is not affected, because even though it's moved forward .015" of an inch, the cyl hand can protrude forward much more than needed and is only restrained by the ratchet star when the cyl is closed. So the hand has more than enough forward movement under its spring tension to properly engage the star.

My preference for conversion however is still recessing the chambers .015". Clean and simple and .455 rounds can still be used.