645 vs. 4506

[John Fritz]

I have searched and searched and can't find a good comparison anywhere. Can the forum B&B give me a quick rundown of the differences between the two? Or a link to the post(s) I couldn't find.

I seem to see a lot of 645's out there in nice shape for reasonable money. The 4506's, people are a little more proud of them.

Thanks.

 

[k22fan]

[...] Can the forum B&B give me a quick rundown [...]

I don't know what "B&B" means but inasmuch as no one else has replied yet maybe a quick rundown from an amateur who has owned both since 1996 will hold you over until you hear from the "B&B".

The main difference is that 645s have an old fashioned frame with an aluminum mainspring housing whereas a 4506's one piece wrap around grip conceals the absence of a metal backstrap and has a well to hold the mainspring. I'm seeing posts by members who prefer the more traditional look of 645 frames which I agree with except for their butt ugly trigger guards. Shortly after their introduction 4506 trigger guards were changed to a much more attractive oval shape. Disregarding fitting issues the slides will interchange between the two.

The biggest difference firing them is that 4506s have a shorter trigger reach which gives better leverage to work the DA. Otherwise, the DA and SA pulls feel the same to me except that you can feel a click as a 645's sear drags across its half cock notch in DA. To me that click wouldn't be worth mentioning except for someting to chat about on the internet. Third generation hammers don't have the half cock notch and many 645 hammers were replaced with them while back at the factory. When I first got them I compared parts numbers and the only piece in the trigger to hammer linkage that is not the same is the sear spring so it figures that the trigger pulls would feel the same. I find both models' DA easy to use but unless you have long fingers or plan to not use the DA I would favor the 4506 for its shorter trigger reach.

I've found both models to be more reliable than a variety of 1911s. They will feed square cornered SWC bullets from molds that were designed for revolvers that most 1911s have no hope of feeding. The only issue I know of with the two models is the 645's off side safety lever retaining screw requires a drop of Locktite. I gave mine the obviously needed drop of Locktite seventeen years ago and it's still tight. Now a days there are lots of tighter fitted 1911s that will group tighter for target shooting but they cost a lot more and thats not what 645s and 4506s were designed for.

Regarding pricing, service grade S&W auto prices have always been up and down all over the place depending on wether a specific model was recently surplused by a large police department. Mine were bargins but I haven't seen five inchers surplused in awhile and 645s were discontinued a long time ago. My 4506 was surplused by a just elected sherif who wanted his officers armed with .40 cal. 4006s. It was less than a year old and still unfired NIB. I was lucky. I wish I'd bought two. You rarely see the bargin prices on minty examples in collectable condition.

I hope I wrote a little of what you wanted to know.

Best Regards,
Gil

 

[Stu1205]

I picked up a 4506 no dash at a gun show I was woking at this past December. A guy walked past my table twice with a sign around his neck. I finally called him over and asked him how much he wanted for the gun? He told me to make him an offer. I said I was having a slow day and I didn't have much cash on me and I didn't want to insult him. He said it was OK to insult him, so I offered him $300.00 for the gun. He thought for a second and then said, how about $300.00 and one of the gun belts you have for sale. I couldn't whip out the $300.00 fast enough. I checked with Smith & Wesson, and this gun was originally shipped to the Windsor CT Police Department in 1988. It does not have any police department marking on it, and it it in cherry condition. I took the original grips off and replaced them with the hogue grips as they fit my hand better. I took it to the range and put two boxes of ammo through it; 50 FMJ and 50 JHP. Not a single jam or stove pipe. The accuracy is amazing. Whoever had it before had it sighted perfectly. What a great shooter. I love this gun.

 

[John Fritz]

B&B = Best and Brightest.

Thanks both you guys for the info. I don't have the cash right this minute to make the purchase so I'm taking some time to do my research before I start doing my bid thing on GB.

I really want a NIB or LNIB example and the latter is definitely achievable from what I've seen. Based on the info you all provided so far, I believe I'll bid on either one as long as it meets my criteria for condition and cost. Being OK with a 645 or a 4506 just doubled my potential possible purchases. I was only going to buy a 4506 before.

I too can't stand those damn square trigger guards but it's sort of like the PV Arms import mark that was crushed into my otherwise mint P6; I can ignore it because the gun is nice enough otherwise.

Thanks again, I hope a few more members jump into the thread but you guys told me enough for me to know that either a 645 or a 4506 will be fine.

 

[k22fan]

B&B = Best and Brightest.

I hope stuborn and opinionated was an adaquate substitute. You could just pick one based on whats available at the best price. They're both good guns.

Gil

 

[John Fritz]

I hope stuborn and opinionated was an adaquate substitute. You could just pick one based on whats available at the best price. They're both good guns.

Gil

Stubborn and opinionated is what I have the most experience with personally. You just summed up my entire three-paragraph response with your one sentence. It's off to GB now. Either gun will be great.

 

[Stu1205]

I too can't stand those damn square trigger guards ..........

I don't like the square trigger guards either, (which my gun has), but for the price I paid and the overall condition of the gun, I guess I can live with it.

 

[VTHokiesDuckHunter]

I have the squared off , or "combat style" trigger guard on one of my 5906's. I kind of like it, but maybe like the rounded style slightly better.

I was told there were a couple of possible reasons for this:

-To be able to rest your off hand finger on the front of the trigger guard (that technique is out of favor now)

-To be able to rest that part of the gun on any flat vertical surface for one handed slide work if your other arm is injured or weak in combat

-Or to rest it for steadying against somthing that you are holding, like a riot shield.

Not sure if all of these are true or not.

It is interesting that some CZ's, Sigs, Glocks, and Beretta's are still made this way I think- especially a lot of the polymer guns.

 

[John Fritz]

The reason I had heard was to provide a finger rest for your left hand while shooting.

I've been looking at a ton of 645's and 4506's over the last few days and I have to say, that square trigger guard is growing on me a bit. It is definitely not a deal breaker if I find a blaster I like.

 

[10ring]

For a short while, the concept of placing your weak hand index finger on the front of the trigger guard was in vogue. Thus, guns with a squared area and checkering or lines on the front of the trigger guard were cool and modern and tactical and all that.

Some people continue to shoot this way. A lot of shooters found that this grip had a tendency to pull or push the gun horizontally. If it works for you, go for it!

For most, though, it is purely a cosmetic issue now. The one issue of consequence is that if you have a squared trigger guard, you need to get the right holster to accommodate it.

 

[Philip Marlowe]

The 645 has an aluminum mainspring housing? I did not know that.

 

[k22fan]

The 645 has an aluminum mainspring housing? I did not know that.

Yup. Unfortunatly they tend to be dull gray and dinged up on police trade ins.

Anyone know of a couple shinny new ones for sale?

 

[Philip Marlowe]

Yup. Unfortunatly they tend to be dull gray and dinged up on police trade ins.

Anyone know of a couple shinny new ones for sale?

I would prefer having a separate mainspring housing, and 4 grip screws of the 645 compared to the 4506 and its mainspring held by the plastic grip and grip that is held by a punch pin . I don't like the 4506 delicate sideplate assembly that the grip fits around either. And yeah, I have a 4506 and 4586 that I do love.

 

[lackejd]

I guess I am in the minority on the squared trigger guard versus oval trigger guard. I love the squared trigger guard look. If there were two 4506s in identical condition and priced the same, I would buy the 4506 no dash over the 4506-1 every time just to get the squared guard. I currently have a 5904, 5906, 6906, 645, 745, and a 6453 (all with squared trigger guards). I am currently looking for a LNIB 4506 no dash for a reasonable price.

 

[K Frame Keith]

I have a 4505 that I carried as a duty weapon in the 90's. The 4505 was a limited release version of the 4506 in blue steel. I heard there may be 5000 of them. My weapon is probably the most reliable semi-auto I own. I found this out years ago when taking part in failure to fire drills where my 4505 would feed empty casings from the magazine during live fire drills rather than jamming. Semi-wadcutters? Never a problem.

 

[John Fritz]

I would prefer having a separate mainspring housing, and 4 grip screws of the 645 compared to the 4506 and its mainspring held by the plastic grip and grip that is held by a punch pin . I don't like the 4506 delicate sideplate assembly that the grip fits around either. And yeah, I have a 4506 and 4586 that I do love.

I'm doing some bidding right now and, armed with my new knowledge thanks to the first two reponses to my question, I am definitely prefering a 645 to a 4506. For the exact reason you point out. Now that I know what I'm looking at, I like the older MS housing and grip set-up better.

 

[John Fritz]

Got one to sell?

By the way, if anyone has a nice specimen they want to part with, please PM me. I'm ready to buy.

 

[k22fan]

I have a 4505 that I carried as a duty weapon in the 90's. The 4505 was a limited release version of the 4506 in blue steel. I heard there may be 5000 of them. My weapon is probably the most reliable semi-auto I own. I found this out years ago when taking part in failure to fire drills where my 4505 would feed empty casings from the magazine during live fire drills rather than jamming. Semi-wadcutters? Never a problem.

I wouldn't be surprised to see 645s, 45XX and 10XX pistols feed pine cones. Well, O.K., the 10XX chambers are smaller so maybe fir cones.

 

[Kavinsky]

Personally for me I like the old early trigger guards the early 4506's had as the rounded one just looks too plain and boring just like that one piece grip they went with.

as for the 645's looks the sights look abit stubby and that right side safety lever looks wrong but both of those can be replaced easily with novaks and the 4506's right side safety lever.

and the 4506's trigger is apparently a touch more redefined but other than that from what everyone else has been saying there great value for the money for a gun that can run pretty much whatever you feed it (500 - 600 vs a 1000 for a colt series 70)

 

[18DAI]

I own examples of both the 645 and 4506, as well as the 4506-1.

I'd be hard pressed to choose between them.

I like the grips and checkered front and backstrap on the 645. I would have to say my 4506-1 03 has the best trigger.

I think the "perfect" solution, for me, is to get a Novak sighted slide fitted to my 645 and have someone do a trigger job.

Both the 645 and 4506 are great pistols. More reliable and accurate than their contemporaries at half the cost. Regards 18DAI.