9mm vs 40S&W

Gunsmithattheguncloset

Gunsmithattheguncloset

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Ok guys,

My intention is not to start a war. I am presented with an opportunity to purchase a SW99 from a local dealer (police turn ins) I am confronted with the choice of buying the 9X19mm vs the 40S&W. I would like to hear from supporters of both calibers. My current carry piece is a 4" M-19-2. I am in the market for something that conceals a tad bit better than the Magnum. I don't want to focus on anything other than the caliber and not for "you ought to carry such or I carry this...etc" The SW99 is what i want, just not sure of the caliber. I have little to no experiance with the 40S&W and ZERO experiance firing it. I know lots of LEOs carry it and it seems to be the new 38spl for Police. So what are the pros and cons of the 9mm vs the 40S&W.

Thanks,
Trey
 
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The .40 is so popular because it offers big-bore stopping power in 9mm-sized guns. However, it does so at the cost of a round or two in magazine capacity due to its chunkier diameter. The 9mm is ultimately the more common round and therefore ammo is a bit cheaper, but what are a few pennies when you're protecting your life?
 
Watchmanjimg,

Thank you for your input and service. Right now I am loaded with 158g Hornady hollow points in my magnum. Bullet technology has come a long way in the past 10 years. Could a good quality hollow point loading in the 9mm come close to that of the 40 for stopping power? Honestly the last time i paid attn to the 40S&W was about 18 years ago when i was reading (at the time) that the 9mm and 45 acp would zip through a car's windshield and the 40s would bounce off of it.

Trey
 
9mm vs .40 only IMO.

9mm;

Pros:

*Very cheap to shoot
*More rounds in a mag
*Very low recoil
* You can buy a subcompact and the recoil is still nice

Cons:

*Only a little bit smaller than the .40 when the bullet is expanded

IMO, best weight for a 9mm is 115gr or 124gr +p or not

.40S&W;

Pros:

*Only a little bit bigger than the 9mm when the bullet is expanded

Cons:
*Snappy recoil
*Less ammo in a mag
*Cost more to shoot
*Only can get true power over the 9mm if you have lower weight which would make it have a more snappy recoil

Best weight for a .40 is 180gr only

Once again, this is only IMO
 
For range ammo 9mm is cheaper if your talking about self defense ammo .40 is easier to find in the 50 round law enforcement boxes and is also cheaper or the same price in most cases.
 
Gunsmithattheguncloset said:
Watchmanjimg,

Thank you for your input and service. Right now I am loaded with 158g Hornady hollow points in my magnum. Bullet technology has come a long way in the past 10 years. Could a good quality hollow point loading in the 9mm come close to that of the 40 for stopping power? Honestly the last time i paid attn to the 40S&W was about 18 years ago when i was reading (at the time) that the 9mm and 45 acp would zip through a car's windshield and the 40s would bounce off of it.

Trey
Click to expand...

Trey:

Thanks for your kind words. First off, I'm no ballistics expert but I strongly believe that the 40 S&W offers a definite advantage over 9mm in stopping power. Clearly a large percentage of the law-enforcement community in the US agrees, as evidenced by their transition to .40 and .45 from 9mm in recent years. I've heard the windshield story you mentioned but I think it dealt with round-nose lead .38s, the so-called "widow makers."

The very best 9mm hollow points will come close to a 40 S&W in stopping power, but all indications suggest that the .40 will still have an edge albeit with snappier recoil. Personally I'd prefer the .40 if my life were on the line, but I suppose a well-placed shot makes all the difference regardless of the caliber involved.
 
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I prefer big bullets. They make big holes. Terminal ballistic performance is always subject to many variables, so predicting how an expanding bullet will perform is always speculative at best.

My prefered defensive handgun will always be a .45 ACP. For something smaller that I can tuck under a shirt tail on a hot day I'll take my Kahr P40 and feel well-armed. Even in a 16.1 oz. pistol the .40 S&W is easy to shoot well and recoil is not a major factor for me.

Best regards.
 
Well............you know what they say about opinions.

I am fortunate to own handguns of about all calibers. Each has advantages over others so your use will depend on what may be best for your needs.

I enjoy shooting a 9mm but would not care to use it for a carry gun and would take a .40 over the 9mm but really love a .45acp over any of the other calibers.

My 9mm guns are used strictly for the range. My .40 cals are sometimes used for carry and to keep in vehicles just to have. My carry guns are going to be .45acp.

Most likely, you will be happier with a .40 since the 9mm lacks the power and one shot take down that the .40 has.
 
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For some reason, I have never warmed up to the .40. Maybe because I reload and have never felt like gearing up for another mouth to feed. My choice between a 9mm or a 40 would have to be the .40 simply because it is a bit bigger. Personally, when I can, I carry a 9mm about 90% of the time. Rest of the time it's a .38. Have several .45's, which I also feel is the best defensive round, but just can't shoot them quiet as well as the 9mm or .38.

I am an older individual and have become a tad recoil sensitive as I have matured. Bottom line, IMHO, is to pick the one you will be able to shoot accurately, with confidence that you can hit the spot you are actually intending to hit. After all, misses don't count.
 
I've read about .40 caliber rounds with a 93% one shot stop percentage and 9mm rounds with 91%. That is really an insignificant difference, especially since defensive firing is normally done in 2 or 3 shot groups. the biggest difference between the two is recoil. Under stress when you're pulling the trigger as fast as you can to stay alive the follow up shots from the 9mm will have much better placement. Three 9s in center mass will have a lot more stopping power than a 40 in the chest one in the hip and one in the arm as well as being easier to accomplish when you only have a second or two. IMHO with the big difference in recoil and the very slight difference in single shot stopping power if I didn't feel confident in my ability with the 9mm I would go with the .45acp leaving the .40 out of the equation all together. Also in a duck and cover type shoot out capacity becomes more important. No matter how fast you can reload, the more often you have to do so the more vulnerable you become.
 
flagaman1950 said:
Personally, when I can, I carry a 9mm about 90% of the time. Rest of the time it's a .38. Have several .45's, which I also feel is the best defensive round, but just can't shoot them quiet as well as the 9mm or .38.

I am an older individual and have become a tad recoil sensitive as I have matured. Bottom line, IMHO, is to pick the one you will be able to shoot accurately, with confidence that you can hit the spot you are actually intending to hit. After all, misses don't count.
Click to expand...

We are in the same boat but I am likely older. Let me guess about you though.

I bet you shoot a 9mm more often in practice. As an older individual, I have found I cannot fight or run as good I once could. I also find the .45 to be the caliber I have the most confidence in and can shoot it far better than any of my other calibers. During qualifying each year, I get to shoot both .40 and .45acp. My .45 scores are way better than with the .40 but both are acceptable.

We tend to fall into a mindset as we age. In shooting, we begin to limit ourselves in calibers based on a mental perception that causes us to say a lighter bullet is better to shoot. Therefore we use the lighter caliber more and we get better with it. Using a heavier caliber will keep you in shape and increase your accuracy with it. We get out of shape simply because our minds tell us we are older and cannot do what we used to do. I am 64 and still ride horses, run occasionally as needed, chase women as often as the budget allows and shoot at least three times a week.
 
Strato said:
Under stress when you're pulling the trigger as fast as you can to stay alive the follow up shots from the 9mm will have much better placement. Three 9s in center mass will have a lot more stopping power than a 40 in the chest one in the hip and one in the arm as well as being easier to accomplish when you only have a second or two.
Click to expand...

I agree up to a point. Having to fire under stress on more than one occasion, I can honestly say that I could not tell you how many shots I made until the casings were counted afterward. Recoil was never noticed and I really did not hear the gun go off in either event.

BUT, I also shot a tight group with both the .40 and .45 under stress. During the late 70s, I fired the 9mm, as did others and we all were found to use the "pray and spray" technique while maintaining a mental image of having more shots so shot placement was not important. Departmental studies have shown since getting away from the 9mm, shootings have gone down in shots fired and vital hits have became more common. The second departmental shooting after the 9mm was put in service had an officer firing 17 rounds while only striking the perp once and that was in the leg from 28 feet. I wish I could find some stats on other departmental shootings with various calibers over the years. The first shooting was almost comical. There were 63 rounds discharged with only three hits by five officers from distances ranging from 15 feet to 38 feet.
 
Don't let anyone push you away from the .40 because of the "snappy" recoil comments. "Snappy" is relevant. As a LE firearms instructor I shoot a lot of both 9mm and .40 S&W, mostly out of Glocks of similar size except caliber. I would say the felt recoil between a same size gun in 9mm and .40 S&W is noticable, but not objectionable.

In comparison, shooting my Walther PPK/S in .380 exhibits much more felt recoil than either baby Glock (26 or 27) in 9mm or .40 S&W.

Preference of caliber can be a personal choice. I've carried 9mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP firearms on duty as a LEO and my personal preference is the .40 S&W in 180 grain JHP's, but I'm certainly not slamming the other two as ineffective.
 
oldman45 said:
I agree up to a point. Having to fire under stress on more than one occasion, I can honestly say that I could not tell you how many shots I made until the casings were counted afterward. Recoil was never noticed and I really did not hear the gun go off in either event.

BUT, I also shot a tight group with both the .40 and .45 under stress. During the late 70s, I fired the 9mm, as did others and we all were found to use the "pray and spray" technique while maintaining a mental image of having more shots so shot placement was not important. Departmental studies have shown since getting away from the 9mm, shootings have gone down in shots fired and vital hits have became more common. The second departmental shooting after the 9mm was put in service had an officer firing 17 rounds while only striking the perp once and that was in the leg from 28 feet. I wish I could find some stats on other departmental shootings with various calibers over the years. The first shooting was almost comical. There were 63 rounds discharged with only three hits by five officers from distances ranging from 15 feet to 38 feet.
Click to expand...

Thankfully I've never had to shoot under stress so I don't have your experience in that area. I wasn't actually referring to the "spray and pray" method as I strongly believe that every shot has equal importance in placement. In practicing rapid fire with a 9mm I can pull the trigger as fast as I can and bring every shot back to POA and with the .40 either my follow up shots aren't quite back to POA or I have to hesitate a fraction of a second between shots. That fraction of a second could be the difference between life and death. I do better at rapid fire with a .45 than with a .40 so I personally feel that the .40 is an in between with disadvantages at both ends and no major advantages at either end making the real choice being between the 9mm and the .45. I respect the fact that I don't have the experience and expertise of many of the people on this forum. This is simply my oppinion formed after a little research and observation.
 
Thank you everyone for your points so far!

Faulkner said:
Don't let anyone push you away from the .40 because of the "snappy" recoil comments. "Snappy" is relevant. As a LE firearms instructor I shoot a lot of both 9mm and .40 S&W, mostly out of Glocks of similar size except caliber. I would say the felt recoil between a same size gun in 9mm and .40 S&W is noticable, but not objectionable.

****************************************************Currently I carry and shoot a 357 magnum with magnum loads. I can't imagine the 40s&w being more snappy that those. I have owned 9mms in the past mainly Lugers and p-38's, beretta 92f and a glock 19 from time to time and have always gone back to a more powerful round. I guess my biggest hang up is i have just never been a fan of the 40cal, I guess if my dad can change and actually like the Gov Issued Glock 23 that he carries, i guess i could start liking the round.
Click to expand...
 
watchmanjimg said:
Trey:
I've heard the windshield story you mentioned but I think it dealt with round-nose lead .38s, the so-called "widow makers."


It was the 40 but at one time not long after it's introduction you could only get FMJ and Trunkated (sp?) cone bullet loadings. It was the conical loadings that skipped off the windshields. As I said, that was right after it was introduced and several bullet maufacturers hadn't ramped up their production yet.

Great information everyone thank you very much!

Trey
Click to expand...
 
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