A different way to talk optics.

[Rastoff]

We've spent many pages/hours discussing optics for our ARs. One thing we can all agree on is, we'll never agree exactly what's the one right way to go. So, let's try something different.

There are a lot of guys here that have a lot of experience with different optics. So let's discuss what we like in optics by simply listing our choices. You can list stuff you like, don't like or both.

I'll start...

If you want a good magnified optic, I'm very happy with the Hi-Lux (Leatherwood) CMR 1-4x24:

This scope can be had for less than $350. It is a 30mm tube, finger adjustable turrets and illuminated 2nd focal plane reticle. The turrets have a zero stop and I've found the adjustments to be extremely repeatable. As a bonus it comes with lens caps.

I also have the more expensive Vortex Viper PST 1-4x24 and I like the CMR better.

The reticle is very easy to use:

I like the horseshoe. It makes for super fast acquisition. The 1MOA dot in the middle makes for really precise shots.

When it comes to a red dot, I like the Primary Arms Advanced Microdot:

This tough little optic boasts a 50,000 hour battery life. The dot is clear and easy to adjust brightness. Some have told me that the glass is more clear than the Aimpoint of the same size, but I'd have to compare them side by side to verify. The unit is parallax free beyond 50 yards. I've verified this, but there is some parallax error if you let the dot get right to the edge of the optic; who does that?


For the pinnacle I like the ACOG TA33R-8:

I've only owned this optic for a short time, but it's easily my favorite. The reticle is super simple and easy to use. The optic overall is very compact and light. Of course it also has battle proven durability.

The reticle is lit by a fiber optic tube on the top. It has a secondary light source of tritium for when it's dark.

This one new is over $1,300 so, it's not cheap. However, it is worth every penny. If you want an optic that you can rely on, this is it.



These are my picks for optics I'd recommend to people to put on their AR. What are yours?

 

[vonn]

Should be an interesting thread. Is it ok to discuss iron sights? Nice post that people can give real world info about what has worked for them.

 

[BAM-BAM]

Red Dot....... Aimpoint PRO is hard to beat at about $400. The only down side from the top tier of Aimpoints is 30,000 hours vs. 50,000 on a battery. Batteries are cheap and have a long shelf life.

Scopes..........I like the little Weaver 1-3x20 ($180-200)for general purpose and "utility rifles"been using this scope for 15-20 years on everything from 10/22s to ARs.......... and Leupolds 1-4x20 scopes (IIRC $250+ to about 500) are my go to scopes on my woods bolt guns; CZs rifles in .22lr,.22mag and .223 .

With my 60+ eyes I like the 1X option and most shooting here in Pa. ( where you can't hunt with a semi) is 100 yds or less................

I've used the Bushnell TRS-25 for at least 10 years with good results ...... but will be checking out the PA Microdot.

 

[WVSig]

I have owned a fair amount of optics over the years but nothing under the $100 price point. Here is a list of ones I have owned in the past or one I currently own. I will start with the ones still in the safe.

Optics I still own:

Aimpoint Pro which can be had new for $400 to $450 and used LNIB for $350 to $400 and it comes with its own mount which can be set absolute or 1/3 co witness.. This is a rugged optic that has a 2 MOA dot and is nightvision compatible. It will take a lot of abuse but its two downsides are its weight and its battery life which is 30,000 vs some of the other Aimpoint which are as high as 50,000. If you leave it on all the time you want to leave it on a mid range setting because higher settings will kill the battery much faster. Some people prefer the large field of view on these vs the micro Aimpoints. I highly recommend this optic as the entry point into "higher end" optics.

Aimpoint T2 which is the top of the line Aimpoint Micro dot. It does everything well. It is light, Weight 3.7 oz. and has a few advantages over the H1/T1. The glass is clearer and does not have the blue tint of the T1 and H1. When compared back to back the dot is clearer which is a complaint on the H1/T1. The T2 comes with flip covers and the adjustment dials are protected and the mounting screws are less prone to stripping which was also a complaint on the H1/T1 sights. If you look at the spec sheet it pretty much has it all but that comes at a hefty price for a red dot. NIB they run $700-$800 LNIB for $600-$750 depending on the mount. IMHO LaRue tactical is the best place to get one because they have packages with mounts for about the same price other people sell just the sight.

Primary Arms Micro Dot which is the cheapest optic I have on an AR15. I got it NIB onsale for $100 with a 1/3 co-witness mount. It does not have great battery life but the dot is decent and for plinking at the range there is nothing that this optic can't do that my T1 can do. It is not as rugged and it would not be my first choice for a defensive rifle but for $100 it has served me well.

Primary Arms 1-6X Scope with Patented ACSS. This is the newest addition. I wanted something that I could use to stretch out a bit to 300-400 yards yet still shoot at 50. I put this on a 18" PSA build. It is sitting in an American Defense quick mount. I bought it used LNIB. The scope runs $269 and the mount runs $149 NIB. I have only been to the range once with it shooting about 200 rounds as so far so good. The eye relief is not as good as I wish it could be and the sight "box" is somewhat small but with more time behind it I think I will like it. When you compare it to other 1X6 it has a lot going for it. Mainly what it has going for it is price. Other 1X6s will cost you $1000. It is nicely built and time will tell if it will stay in the stable. If not I will sell it for what I have in it. LOL

Magpul Pro BUIS these run about $170 a set but I picked them up from Primary Arms via Jet.com for about $135. They are nice metal sights and IMHO an upgrade over the MBUS sights. The only thing they lack is that they do not flip up. I like that the adjustments including the front post are dials so no tool or bullet is needs to adjust them.

Aero BUIS HK Style Hood Sights. I have always been a fan of Troy BUIS but I am not a fan of Troy Industries so I have always pasted on their sights. Aero who is an OEM AR15 manufacturer who makes a similar sight. I got these for $125 shipped. They are spring loaded and the HK style hood gives a great sight picture. I really like these and original mounted them on my 18" PSA but moved them over to my 14.5" BCM to to rifle.

Vortex Sparc 2 This is a nice optic which can be had for about $169 NIB on sale up to $200. LNIB should be in the $150 range. 5,0000 hours of battery life at 50% and decent specs. It is a poor mans Aimpoint H1/T1 style micro dot. Its footprint is bigger but weights about the same. They are pretty rugged and seem well built. Check the specs and decide for yourself. IMHO this a good basic option. Some people complain about the parallax but I don't have that issue.

Optics I used to own:

Primary Arms Advanced Micro Dots. These are great little optics that run $169 on sale with mount up to $169 + mount. I only sold mine because a friend talked me out of it and I knew I could get another if I needed to. It has decent battery life and PA stands behind them. These are a setup from the standard PA dot but if your gun is just a range toy the basic dot might be good enough but if you can afford closer to $200 this is a solid option.

Trijicon TriPower which is not discontinued. It was a a decent optic which used battery power, natural light and trinium to power the sight. It had a nice combat recticle and was built like a tank but its batter life sucked and so I sold it.

Trijicon ACOGs of various versions. These are great sights. They are amazing but cost you $1200+ NIB and $900-$1000 used LNIB. I liked them a lot but could never justify keeping them at their price point. The glass and the recticle are great. They really set the bar for BAC type single power setups that most people can actually afford.

The Eclans might be better but you are going to spend $2000+ for one of those. In my mind if you are going to use the ACOG as your go to defense optic you have to shoot it a lot. You have to train with it so that you can use it properly at various ranges from point blank to 500 yards. If I were going to choose ACOG for that role I would make sure every gun in that roll had the same ACOG on it so there would be a consistent manual of arms.

Eotech I have owned a few of these but sold them after extensive shooting. For me they were too busy. They clouded the field of vision too much with their sight picture. This was before they cheated the Govt and as a result I would not buy another one.

Magpul MBUS BUIS These are great plastic BUIS and if you use your irons mainly as BUIS they will serve you well but IMHO if you want to shoot irons a lot which I recommend everyone do there are better options. You can get these for about $70 new or $50 LNIB, people are selling takeoffs all the time cheap on forum classifieds.

There are some others but I can't think of them right now.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

I use an Aimpoint micro on my AR and a Primary Arms micro on my .22lr understudy. I chose the 1x red dot type optics to compliment the AR platform as a CQB offhand weapon. The overall size and weight as well as the dot sizes are near indistinguishable to me so the understudy well serves it's purpose.

I suppose the best way to say what I like most about 1x red dots is what I don't like about magnified optics for offhand shooting -- they exaggerate movement and make me more tentative. So in the great debate over the price of optics... I wouldn't mount a 4x ACOG or NightForce magnified optic on my rifle if it was for free because magnification doesn't well suit me or best suit the environment of the thick Tennessee woods where I live.

 

[blues7]

Aimpoint H2. Great optic and fits the intended purpose of my M&P15 TS to a "T".

I wanted a battle worthy optic, light in weight in line with the short and light dimensions of the TS, and only wanted to buy once and cry once.

Finally, wanted the optic that made the most sense for our deeply wooded mountain environment.

Thanks to the good advice received here I have no regrets whatsoever and would do it again if I had to choose today.

 

[apollo99]

Bought an Aimpoint PRO, and a Trijicon MRO, The Aimpoint looks more tactical, the Trijicon has a better sight picture. I'm starting to build a long range 500-600 yard AR, and have been looking at the Vortex line. I'm going to keep checking back to see what you guys are using.

 

[Rastoff]

Is it ok to discuss iron sights?

When I first dreamed this up I was thinking of glass. However, I see no reason we can't discuss irons as well. In the end it's all about sighting systems and not all irons are the same. So, go ahead. I look forward to reading about what you like.

 

[sgtsandman]

I think with the AR15 and the 5.56 MVP Patrol, I'm going to be looking at the better Primary Arms scopes. The 1-6 or 1-8 for the AR and the 5.56 MVP. I like the ranging ability built into the reticule and I've yet to see much in the way of a bad review on them once you filter out the elitists that will accept nothing less than U.S. Optics or Nightforce. I'll give them a test run and see how they do but I think I'll be happy with them. I also like that they do not have exposed, tall turrents or the turrents are capped, so getting bumped is less of an issue or not an issue at all. The other nice thing is that they are a relatively small scope, so less likely to get in the way. And since both have shorter barrels, 18" and 16.5" respectively, I doubt either would be able to take advantage or more magnification or a bigger objective lens.

I like the Nikon M-308 scopes I have on both the M&P10 and 7.62 MVP Patrol. So far both have performed well and the glass is very clear. One has the 800BDC reticule and the other quick adjusting yardage turrents up to 800 yards. The turrents are taller and can be bumped but since they can be set to zero, so if they get knocked out of adjustment, it can be readily seen and corrected. The scope is also specifically designed for short barreled.308 AR rifles, so are a good match.

Beyond that, I may get a scope for my 10/22. I'm thinking a fixed 4X Leupold for it and maybe one for my bolt rifle since the glass quality of the Tasco that came with it is so horrible. It works for now and the price was right but ugh!

 

[fyimo]

My 3 AR-15's all have scopes on them with two having Nikon P223 3x9x40mm scopes and one having a Nikon 2x7x32mm scope on it.

 

[WVSig]

I think with the AR15 and the 5.56 MVP Patrol, I'm going to be looking at the better Primary Arms scopes. The 1-6 or 1-8 for the AR and the 5.56 MVP. I like the ranging ability built into the reticule and I've yet to see much in the way of a bad review on them once you filter out the elitists that will accept nothing less than U.S. Optics or Nightforce. I'll give them a test run and see how they do but I think I'll be happy with them. I also like that they do not have exposed, tall turrents or the turrents are capped, so getting bumped is less of an issue or not an issue at all. The other nice thing is that they are a relatively small scope, so less likely to get in the way. And since both have shorter barrels, 18" and 16.5" respectively, I doubt either would be able to take advantage or more magnification or a bigger objective lens.

This is a lot of the same thought process that I used to choose the 1X6 Primary Arms for my 18" build. My only issues so far is getting the stock fit right because I am a nose to the charging handle kind of guy and the eye relief does not allow me to do that with this scope mount combo. I might try the ADM Recon X which would give me another 1.4" of relief but for now the standard Recon works if I back off just a bit.

 

[sgtsandman]

This is a lot of the same thought process that I used to choose the 1X6 Primary Arms for my 18" build. My only issues so far is getting the stock fit right because I am a nose to the charging handle kind of guy and the eye relief does not allow me to do that with this scope mount combo. I might try the ADM Recon X which would give me another 1.4" of relief but for now the standard Recon works if I back off just a bit.

I like the nose to charging handle concept. It sets a consistent placement along with the cheek weld. Figuring out how to do it in the winter with heavy clothing, in the summer with light clothing, and various thicknesses with weather in between is where I run into the problem. It may be that I'm not problem solving correctly. As a result, I gave up on the idea, at least for now and set my scope eye relief for a fully extended stock so I can compensate for heavier clothing later.

 

[WVSig]

I like the nose to charging handle concept. It sets a consistent placement along with the cheek weld. Figuring out how to do it in the winter with heavy clothing, in the summer with light clothing, and various thicknesses with weather in between is where I run into the problem. It may be that I'm not problem solving correctly. As a result, I gave up on the idea, at least for now and set my scope eye relief for a fully extended stock so I can compensate for heavier clothing later.

I have short arms so its hard for me not to be on the charging handle. LOL When you go to variable power optics or magnified optics I have trouble because I have to be close to the gun for it to "fit" me which is why I looks for mounts which push the optic forward into the rail space while still mounting solidly on the upper.

 

[sgtsandman]

I have short arms so its hard for me not to be on the charging handle. LOL When you go to variable power optics or magnified optics I have trouble because I have to be close to the gun for it to "fit" me which is why I looks for mounts which push the optic forward into the rail space while still mounting solidly on the upper.

Mine are cantilevered but not that far. With the big 10, I pretty much have all the rail I would want. The catch is that the eye box is kind of tight, so I only have so much distance I can move it and still get a good sight picture.

So far, I've made it work. Now that I think of it. I never did check out the eye relief while shooting prone. I might need to address that next time I'm at the range before I get the thing completely zeroed and find out I need to redo it....

 

[coolcobramatt]

I went with a Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6 with a Burris PEPR mount on my AR. Picked the Diamondback model 2-7 for my 15-22 baby 22. With careful price matching got both for $350.

 

[highsideforum]

I have owned a fair amount of optics over the years

Wow.
That's a TON of information.
Thank you for taking the time to post.
Rep given.