Above max revolvers, S&W 28&27,Ruger Redhawk,DW

[dan-g]

Alright this might be a taboo subject but I want to hear what some more seasoned forumites have to say about it.

When the 357 mag first came out we had some incredible rounds operating at substantualy more pressure than current loadings, (some very similar to some speer#8 list pressures). After talking to some other reloaders, there are some similarities in preferred arms for these hot loads.

Any smith steel N frame 357 6 shot, the Ruger redhawk 357 and the dan wesson model 15, all have been quoted as guns capable of firing the original pressure 357 rounds. I personally think the buffalo bore rounds are good enough for hot rod shooting and havent gone above max load more than a few times.

Whats your take on this?

 

[ckprax]

If I want beat a gun with really hot loads it will be a single action Ruger.

 

[RGMoore]

Or if you want a really hot 357 see if you can find a DW 357SuperMag.
1450fps with 180's all day long. Just make sure you wear your earmuffs or you will never need them again.

 

[358156hp]

I've always felt that "The Peace Officers Dream" was primarily responsible for the downloading (old definition) of the 357 magnum. There had to be a lot of people shooting them full time with the old full power ammo, something S&W said not to do int the first place. The result would be predictable. I'm content with L frames & GP100s, myself.

 

[brucev]

All right. I'll give it a go. When the .357 Magnum first came onto the scene, velocity estimates were well-educated guesses. Nowadays chronographs are not so terribly expensive. Much if not all load data is pressure tested, etc. in laboratory settings. The early loads were certainly "hairy chested," but I am not so sure that they reached the velocities that were commonly quoted/estimated.

My first new revolver was a 6" 28-2 that I shot the hound out of using every load I could concoct using the data in the reloading books of the era 1979-1985. I will confess to pushing that 28 hard enough that, in retrospect, it is amazing S&W didn't swear a warrant out against me for abuse and endangering a revolver! I have since moderated my reloading practices. If I want some romping stomping .357 loads that will really produce the speed/power once thought to have been produced by the loads of the 30's-50's, I'll just load up something from Buffalo Bore. What they produce amazes me. How they load ammunition to such a heavy level while remaining within SAAMI standards is beyond me. My hat is off to them!

I recently found and bought a very nice virtually unfired 6" 28-2. Yesterday I put a nice pair of S&W Target Grips on it. Later this year I will zero it with a nice 158 or 180 gr. .357 Mag. load from Buffalo Bore. Then... when deer season rolls around, I will take that wonderful example of S&W craftsmanship and head for the woods. I figure after 30 years of dropping the hammer on 28's, this new revolver should be just about perfect for hunting deer... and hogs, etc.

As to the Redhawk and DW-15, I am sure they are fine revolvers. I once owned a Redhawk in .44 Mag. It was heavy. I found I preferred the S&W N-Frame for it's better trigger (SA/DA), grip and balance.

 

[David Sinko]

More important considerations are the barrel length and what you want to do with it. You need a lot of barrel length to get the high velocities. I have always felt that the .357 Magnum is overrated as a field gun and has its niche as a carry gun. To me that's a 4" barrel, and you can do only so much with that 4" barrel. And how much recoil can you manage when shooting fast double action? I find that I can manage a 158 gr. bullet at 1250 FPS quite nicely, and the only real advantage to me are the two extra rounds I get in my 627. If I'm carrying something that holds only six, it's going to be a .44 or .45.

Dave Sinko

 

[CWH44300]

There is a reason they are called
MAX loads - use with caution - don't exceed - or pay the price

 

[Maximumbob54]

If I want beat a gun with really hot loads it will be a single action Ruger.

I thought the Redhawk was the stronger of the two???

 

[ckprax]

I thought the Redhawk was the stronger of the two???

It may very well be, but have you tried finding a .357 Redhawk lately? At least in my area it is near impossible. Plus they are more expensive. The large frame blackhawk should be able to handle any .357 load, I am sure the redhawk and DW could as well, but the blackhawk is my personal choice.

 

[Shooting4life]

You can also hot rod the freedom arms 83 in 357 mag. The frame is built to hold 454 so hot 357 are nothing. I have read people are able to get 357 maximum performance out of 357 mag cases with the freedom arms. Me though I'll stick with my Dan Wesson super mag.

 

[dan-g]

Hmmmm shooting for life, I dont know if I believe shooting that DW is a good idea. Maybe I should test that out to ascertain the merits of the 357 supermag. A good start would be to send me that gun and your reloading dies and brass and I will get back to you with the data.

Seriously, very nice Dan Wesson. I have an offer for a trade for my model 28 on a 4 inch DW 357 supermag and ive been really thinking about it.

 

[Nemo288]

You want to push a cartridge and gun to the max, you should
investigate getting a more powerful cartridge and gun.
I have a Dan Wesson 44 SuperMag and it, too, can be
broken. Ask me about it around the campfire.
Or on the Dan Wesson Forum.

These guns have the same ballistics as a lever rifle in the
regular magnum calibers. For hunting it might actually be
easier to just carry the small rifle.

The Browning B-92 gives 1750 fps with the standard load of
24 grains of W296 with a 240 XTP. No extreme pressures.
Just extreme velocity for the bullet. And that's a whole 'nother
story.

...Nemo...

 

[chud333]

Agreed Nemo, What's the point of pushing something beyond max?
Just move up a caliber to get desired velocities or downrange energy.
Not worth it in my opinion. Although i've got a buddy who "Starts" at book max and then works up from there, i'm not that brave. I've seen him piercing primers and blowing up bullets in midflight in S.Dakota
on prairie dog shoots with an AR-15. Scary to me !!!!


chuck

 

[Nemo288]

Agreed Nemo, What's the point of pushing something beyond max?
Just move up a caliber to get desired velocities or downrange energy.
Not worth it in my opinion. Although i've got a buddy who "Starts" at book max and then works up from there, i'm not that brave. I've seen him piercing primers and blowing up bullets in midflight in S.Dakota
on prairie dog shoots with an AR-15. Scary to me !!!!
chuck

I was once in a clique that was shooting and buying guns every week.
One of the guys tried reloading and after we saw a bullet fall out of
one of his .45acp's we took a close look and he had not crimped
the loads at all. We relieved him of all his reloading equipment
and he was not all that pissed

...Nemo...

If you are Carlos Hathcock, my hat is off to you Sir.
It's an honor. Your service is legendary.
I am a member of the Patriot Guard Riders and ride in every
service member's honor. My Dad's WW2 duffel is mounted on
the bike. It's older than I am and still does the job. Awesome
piece of engineering.

WJE

 

[chud333]

I was once in a clique that was shooting and buying guns every week.
One of the guys tried reloading and after we saw a bullet fall out of
one of his .45acp's we took a close look and he had not crimped
the loads at all. We relieved him of all his reloading equipment
and he was not all that pissed

...Nemo...

If you are Carlos Hathcock, my hat is off to you Sir.
It's an honor. Your service is legendary.
I am a member of the Patriot Guard Riders and ride in every
service member's honor. My Dad's WW2 duffel is mounted on
the bike. It's older than I am and still does the job. Awesome
piece of engineering.

WJE

Nemo:
He is just a hero of mine. Carlos has long since passed away to the big snipers nest in the sky. My father was a retired 20 year Marine who passed in feb. 2010 so i've always been fond of military heros. My father was mine, as well as "White Feather". Thank You for being part of the Freedom Riders my friend. If you ever find yourself in east-central Indiana, PM me before hand and i'll buy you a beverage of your choice.


Chuck

 

[Nemo288]

Nemo:
He is just a hero of mine. Carlos has long since passed away to the big snipers nest in the sky. My father was a retired 20 year Marine who passed in feb. 2010 so i've always been fond of military heros. My father was mine, as well as "White Feather". Thank You for being part of the Freedom Riders my friend. If you ever find yourself in east-central Indiana, PM me before hand and i'll buy you a beverage of your choice.
Chuck

As it so happens I do pass that way annually on my way from
Wisconsin to east Ohio for a meet with another bike club I am
in. Be nice to do an eyeball.

...Nemo...

 

[Shooting4life]

Hmmmm shooting for life, I dont know if I believe shooting that DW is a good idea. Maybe I should test that out to ascertain the merits of the 357 supermag. A good start would be to send me that gun and your reloading dies and brass and I will get back to you with the data.

Seriously, very nice Dan Wesson. I have an offer for a trade for my model 28 on a 4 inch DW 357 supermag and ive been really thinking about it.

At first I was worrying about my s&w's being contaminated by Dan wesson's, but after getting rid of a few small frame Dan wesson's and keeping the super mag Dan wesson's everything fine. I just got the package together, took about a year to find the correct case/scope/rings, it is a monson manufactured 445 superag hunter pack. The shroud with the scope does not have a frot sight. It is the only hunter pack from this manufatoring location that I have ever seen. No one on the Dan Wesson forum has ever seen one either.

 

[Nemo288]

I seem to remember seeing a hunter pac in one of their catalogs
around 1990, but have never seen the real thing until now.
The only DW catalogs I could dig out quickly predate the 445 and 7445.

...Nemo...

 

[Shooting4life]

They only made the super mags at monson for a few years. Most of the hunter packs I have found information for we're made in the early 90's. This is the only refrence I have ever found of the earlier hunter pack.

 

[1973Glenfield25]

Nice grips on that DW. Are they maple? Beautiful.