An open carry observation

[rgmc2009]

Your statement shows a true lack of understanding of the current criminal activity in too many areas. When a group of teen agers will beat a man to death in a city park in the middle of the day and most crime is committed in groups, to think that you're not making yourself a target for someone who wants a firearm or just would like to deprive you of yours.

Statistically a police office is several times more likely to be shot or killed in an active shooter incident than a someone carrying concealed, Why, because a uniformed police office is perceived as the biggest threat which makes them a bigger target.

In such a situation I don't want anyone to know I'm carrying until I'm ready for them to know. To think you are going to intimidate someone from not targeting you because they "see" you carrying is like a kid playing cowboy. There is a reason the military uses stealth rather than marching out in huge numbers in bright red uniforms like they did 250 years ago.

Personally I don't want to get ganged up on by surprise or knocked in the back of the head (I'm sure you think you have eyes in the back of your head but at 60 I know I don't) by someone who just wants to gain a firearm. For many in the criminal community it's worth it's weight in gold.

Totally agree! Open carry is like having firearms related stickers plastered on your car. Both make you a target of criminal actions except the "Glock" sticker on your car will only get it broken into when you're not present...open carry can get you knocked in the back of the head and your firearm stolen with a high degree of likelihood it will be used against you. The key is NOT to be a target!

 

[Brian Parrish]

Totally agree! Open carry is like having firearms related stickers plastered on your car. Both make you a target of criminal actions except the "Glock" sticker on your car will only get it broken into when you're not present...open carry can get you knocked in the back of the head and your firearm stolen with a high degree of likelihood it will be used against you. The key is NOT to be a target!

Having a car makes you a target. We call it carjacking.
You do recognize that this argument is not convincing people?
There seems to be an effort to make our forum here hostile to open-carry advocates. If your comparison is valid should we also make people with those stickers just as unwelcome?
Kind Regards!
BrianD

 

[rockquarry]

I'm going to go home and put on an Aloha just to piss you off

Having a car makes you a target. We call it carjacking.
You do recognize that this argument is not convincing people?
There seems to be an effort to make our forum here hostile to open-carry advocates. If your comparison is valid should we also make people with those stickers just as unwelcome?
Kind Regards!
BrianD

I see no effort to make the forum hostile toward open carry disciples. I do see an effort, but not a hostile one, to speak out against those who use poor judgement and have an incessant need to draw attention to themselves. There are only so many ways of saying this. Other valid points have already been mentioned in other posts. Seems a waste of time to continue with this. Hard heads won't be swayed in the right direction.

 

[rgmc2009]

Having a car makes you a target. We call it carjacking.
You do recognize that this argument is not convincing people?
There seems to be an effort to make our forum here hostile to open-carry advocates. If your comparison is valid should we also make people with those stickers just as unwelcome?
Kind Regards!
BrianD

Point well taken regarding having a car making one a target which is one of the many reasons I carry.

My post was in no way intended to be hostile nor in any way an attempt to convince anyone one way or another. It's strictly my personal opinion. To open carry or conceal carry is an individual choice and I choose to carry concealed. The same applies to firearms related stickers on vehicles.

I have always assumed the core purpose of a forum was to foster the open, honest exchange of observations and opinions along with sharing knowledge, ideas and experiences. This was the intent of my post.

 

[Doriangray6]

Many years ago after a hunting trip on a blizzard day my stepson and I stopped for a bite to eat in Douglas Wyoming. My son was 14 but 6 foot 3. He wanted to carry while hunting and I allowed him to carry my model 19 from my local police officer days.

We walked into the cafe and not thinking he had the model 19 on his hip. we say down and two state troopers were in the table next to us. My son in a panic stated that he had the gun still on, both troopers looked. I told him to take it out to the jeep and put it under the seat. Both troopers smiled and nodded their approval.

It is Wyoming, who cares?

Hunting in Colorado for decades same deal. Except elk season sees half of Texas, and many show up in their finest gun gear, armed not for elk, but maybe zombies. So, the local cafe I frequented for decades, only 15 miles from camp, but up a sign, "gentlemen do not wear their hats or guns indoors".

That said, we still had lots of elk hunters with shoulder rigs showing of their biggest 44s and such. When you have 40 hunters in a room eating burgers and fries, i am not sure everyone needs an open carry 44. It is not too much to leave them outside. That said, I cherish the right to do so, and in that I do not condemn anyone for open carry, I just do not consider it smart in most urban areas.


Reaction time is what often wins gun battles, the 1/ 2 second extra time you have concealed gives you time to get off 2 or more shots before that reaction time is gone. On the other hand math and physics works both ways. If the other guy starts first, and he sees you are armed, he can shoot you 2 or more times before that reaction time gets away. Just saying, sometimes it is better to shoot the other guy twice before he shoots you twice, that's all I am saying..


And if I am in a place where some gun battle is going to occur, I always want a decoy in there, someone else doing open carry, so when they start shooting, maybe they will run out of ammo before they see me going out the back.....

As you mentioned reaction time can be a deciding factor and in my case, due to the arthritis in my hands, it's quicker and easier for me to react and access a handgun on my side rather than from a concealed carry position.
But just as with many other firearm related matters there is no "one size fits all" answer to carrying concealed or openly so all a person can do is decide on what works best for them and practice, practice, practice.

 

[Smoke]

Gentlemen do not wear their hats or guns indoors".

Their house, their rules but it's kind of a dumb way to put it.

I walked into a CSU facility with my supervisor one morning and he got on me about wearing my (uniform) hat indoors.

I reminded him that I was under arms and he dropped it.

 

[ladder13]

Having a car makes you a target. We call it carjacking.
You do recognize that this argument is not convincing people?
There seems to be an effort to make our forum here hostile to open-carry advocates. If your comparison is valid should we also make people with those stickers just as unwelcome?
Kind Regards!
BrianD

I am not hostile OC at all. Seen it here in this state. Never reared back in horror or made a comment either way. I see a lot of control freaks posting in every thread on OC.
They can't budge the needle at all.

 

[RebCop]

Nope.

This guy has never seen the video of the young man that had his gun taken and used to kill him.

 

[biku324]

If you've been a cop, you know the numbers - about 4%-5% of police officers shot to death are shot with their issued sidearm. Another 8% or more are disarmed and killed. That's less than half the numbers of 30 years ago. https://ucr.fbi.gov/leoka/2018/tables/table-19.xls

Police agencies spend enormous amounts of effort and money training officers in weapon retention and in purchasing/issuing high security holsters. Agencies analyze every shooting with the goal of preventing recurrence.

How about Joe Average open carriers?

NMSP Officers David Coker and Sherman Toler, RIP.

 

[fatcat3]

 

[ladder13]

So someone tell me exactly how many OCers have been killed or had their gun taken because of that.

I know myself of two neighbors who had their guns stolen because they left them in the car in their driveway with the keys also in it. There are probably hundreds if not thousands pilfered in that manner every year.

 

[Jul]

There is no intentional double standard. I've never given that a thought before. I don't know how you do it. I would guess that nylons are warm in the winter but hot in the summer. Is that true? When I say idiots I mean men that wear shorts in the winter, they are usually somewhat over weight but not all. Can't recall seeing any women wearing shorts in the winter. In my short post there was no mention of hunting, not a hunter myself. There was also no mention of women anywhere. I don't know where this animosity is coming from.

Rick

I wear shorts year round.

 

['79 Magnum GT]

I wear shorts year round.

That would be nice but we get some really cold weather and lots of snow here. It's even worse in Buffalo. Just ask Bald1 or Grimjaws. Those guys get it a lot worse than I do. That's what I mean when I talk about GUYS in shorts in the winter. I don't get it.

Rick

 

[Clayguy]

Wow, perhaps the most insightful words on this thread. Which provokes a response. We all have an inherent bias based on what we smell, taste, feel, and see. Then we read stuff and our brain gets filled with other people's opinions and their actual facts, misinformation and intentional lies. And we let that soak a while and then come up with our opinion, on our side of the fence.

Be then there is that cave bias or gated community bias, words I invented. Which means, we see things from the safety of our cave, crib or home. If there is no gunfights, or deaths withing a couple miles of us then we really have not seen blood or heard the sirens, so our opinion is really just based on what we believe from what we read. So there we are with that Tic Tok brain, kids believe that reality is what they read on Tik Tok and why it should be controlled, they still call it brain washing, right?

----------------------------------So, my perception, facts

1. Old guy 76

2. 24 years military in jobs where I carried a gun 90% of the time,

3, 4 law enforcement jobs

4. Hunter, killed well over 100 animals bigger than me, and lots of little ones

5. Master's Degree in Criminal Justice Administration--means I read lots of books about crime and trends and mentality and all of that.

6. Law degree and prosecutor last 25 years,

7. But..........I worked long term undercover and that is where my open carry concealed carry bias gets it belief.

Deep cover means you live with bad guys, all bad guys use drugs, steal stuff, break stuff, litter, cheat on their taxes, and carry guns. And we sit in strip joints and bars and anywhere and watch people and cops.

It is common for bad guys to trash cops and how easy it would be to kick their azz, snatch their piece, kick their azz and make off with their piece just for fun, how fun would that be?

Sitting in a bar with biker bad guys the talk is low, we could do this or that,,, and kick their azz and I have been there when bad guys attacked cops just for coming into the strip joint.

And now there are old men walking around Walmart with a $1,000-$4,000 handguns showing, how cool is that. Who is the blocker? The blocker is the guy that walks up after you snatch the gun and run, he thumps the old man chasing your or security or anyone who gets in the way.

But they are not stupid, Walmart has cameras everywhere including most of the parking lot, we all know what the cameras cover, so if we want that $4,000 handgun, we have to follow him and grab it some places he might stop, or just find his house and go back later, simple deal, we can take it today or any other day when we are not busy.

From those live events, where I participated in doing bad things to maintain my bone fides, I remember the talks of how easy snatching guns from any really was. I never did it because undercovers cannot intentionally hurt people just because they are easy targets, we could not hurt anyone at all, except bad guys and with the minimum force required to effect an arrest, but we all know that.

I would sometimes ride around and bust out windows on cars parked on the street, just to show the bad guys, that I was a bad guy what fun. Occasionally that is justified.

I am 76 years old and in poor health. I do not care who you are, if you open carry and your holster does not have a retention feature, I can take your gun, if I can get within about 36 inches of you, my reach is 36 inches, and I can do that. If I have a partner, it is easier and my success is higher. If you have a round in the chamber as you should, odds are high that I can snatch it and shoot you with your own gun. All about reaction time and training I have had, and more about actually doing it.

And keep in mind, when you are 76, a fair fight is the one you win. Sucker punch is mandatory, and using a club or something to protect your hands is just common sense. Only a fool participates in a fair fight.

------------------------------------

Bottom line. Our opinion about what some bad guy can do in grabbing an open carry gun is likely flawed, what we think is from our cave bias and not from trying it on the street perhaps in low light or when we are least expecting it.

Cops have a pretty good idea of when a perp can grab for the gun, I have had it happen a few times and it is not fun, because if the BG takes my gun, somebody is getting shot, probably several times. From my gun or my backup, or both.

And the problem nobody on here seems to grip, is that bad guys travel in pairs or groups, one guy grabbing for your gun, the others thumping you in the head and stopping your from reacting, that is reality. Or one or two of them may just shoot you with the stolen Glock or $4,000 custom they stole last week, that is reality.

My bias is with those like Clint Smith and others who have actually worked where real bad guys are encountered often. I worked in two jurisdictions which had the highest incident rate in my state. One was a tourist area, you may not live there but you are an easy target if you come visit and show your gun.

So, Clint Smith says you are a fool to open carry a handgun that is carried for defense. I am in that camp. I have ran with bad guys who would happily choose the fool in 5.11 pants with a $4,000 custom handgun, what fun. Nobody is afraid of any old man with an exposed gun, except the lady who is afraid to walk by the gun counter in Walmart.

So believe what you want, if your cave does not have murders nearby, you probably have little risk, wear your 5.11 pants and custom 1911 and go on about your business. You stick out like a clown when you do, and of course Karen notices you too. And I am glad you are there, takes me out of the list of easy targets.

We all choose how safe or not we want to be, I am that gray man, the one with 2 handguns somewhere on his body.

My 2 cents.

Several times I have read articles that claim Open Carry prevents crime. I'm calling BS on that. There is absolutely no way to statistically measure that false assumption. Moreover, we live a society where a significant number of people are terrified of guns and if they see a civilian wearing a handgun openly they assume he's a bad guy and will likely call the police. Please understand that a call to police for a "man with a gun". is a very hot call and you'll get attention like you cannot possibly imagine. If you are the kind of person whose ego needs to open carry then you should not be carrying. Period. "Because it's my right". is just a plain stupid statement. BTW, wearing open carry and going on the internet and buying a badge that resembles a police badge that says "Concealed Carry" will get you arrested in many jurisdictions so you can then have a one on one discussion with a judge. Open carry, though legal in many states, is just plain stupid!

 

[roundels]

Wow, perhaps the most insightful words on this thread. Which provokes a response. We all have an inherent bias based on what we smell, taste, feel, and see. Then we read stuff and our brain gets filled with other people's opinions and their actual facts, misinformation and intentional lies. And we let that soak a while and then come up with our opinion, on our side of the fence.

Be then there is that cave bias or gated community bias, words I invented. Which means, we see things from the safety of our cave, crib or home. If there is no gunfights, or deaths withing a couple miles of us then we really have not seen blood or heard the sirens, so our opinion is really just based on what we believe from what we read. So there we are with that Tic Tok brain, kids believe that reality is what they read on Tik Tok and why it should be controlled, they still call it brain washing, right?

----------------------------------So, my perception, facts

1. Old guy 76

2. 24 years military in jobs where I carried a gun 90% of the time,

3, 4 law enforcement jobs

4. Hunter, killed well over 100 animals bigger than me, and lots of little ones

5. Master's Degree in Criminal Justice Administration--means I read lots of books about crime and trends and mentality and all of that.

6. Law degree and prosecutor last 25 years,

7. But..........I worked long term undercover and that is where my open carry concealed carry bias gets it belief.

Deep cover means you live with bad guys, all bad guys use drugs, steal stuff, break stuff, litter, cheat on their taxes, and carry guns. And we sit in strip joints and bars and anywhere and watch people and cops.

It is common for bad guys to trash cops and how easy it would be to kick their azz, snatch their piece, kick their azz and make off with their piece just for fun, how fun would that be?

Sitting in a bar with biker bad guys the talk is low, we could do this or that,,, and kick their azz and I have been there when bad guys attacked cops just for coming into the strip joint.

And now there are old men walking around Walmart with a $1,000-$4,000 handguns showing, how cool is that. Who is the blocker? The blocker is the guy that walks up after you snatch the gun and run, he thumps the old man chasing your or security or anyone who gets in the way.

But they are not stupid, Walmart has cameras everywhere including most of the parking lot, we all know what the cameras cover, so if we want that $4,000 handgun, we have to follow him and grab it some places he might stop, or just find his house and go back later, simple deal, we can take it today or any other day when we are not busy.

From those live events, where I participated in doing bad things to maintain my bone fides, I remember the talks of how easy snatching guns from any really was. I never did it because undercovers cannot intentionally hurt people just because they are easy targets, we could not hurt anyone at all, except bad guys and with the minimum force required to effect an arrest, but we all know that.

I would sometimes ride around and bust out windows on cars parked on the street, just to show the bad guys, that I was a bad guy what fun. Occasionally that is justified.

I am 76 years old and in poor health. I do not care who you are, if you open carry and your holster does not have a retention feature, I can take your gun, if I can get within about 36 inches of you, my reach is 36 inches, and I can do that. If I have a partner, it is easier and my success is higher. If you have a round in the chamber as you should, odds are high that I can snatch it and shoot you with your own gun. All about reaction time and training I have had, and more about actually doing it.

And keep in mind, when you are 76, a fair fight is the one you win. Sucker punch is mandatory, and using a club or something to protect your hands is just common sense. Only a fool participates in a fair fight.

------------------------------------

Bottom line. Our opinion about what some bad guy can do in grabbing an open carry gun is likely flawed, what we think is from our cave bias and not from trying it on the street perhaps in low light or when we are least expecting it.

Cops have a pretty good idea of when a perp can grab for the gun, I have had it happen a few times and it is not fun, because if the BG takes my gun, somebody is getting shot, probably several times. From my gun or my backup, or both.

And the problem nobody on here seems to grip, is that bad guys travel in pairs or groups, one guy grabbing for your gun, the others thumping you in the head and stopping your from reacting, that is reality. Or one or two of them may just shoot you with the stolen Glock or $4,000 custom they stole last week, that is reality.

My bias is with those like Clint Smith and others who have actually worked where real bad guys are encountered often. I worked in two jurisdictions which had the highest incident rate in my state. One was a tourist area, you may not live there but you are an easy target if you come visit and show your gun.

So, Clint Smith says you are a fool to open carry a handgun that is carried for defense. I am in that camp. I have ran with bad guys who would happily choose the fool in 5.11 pants with a $4,000 custom handgun, what fun. Nobody is afraid of any old man with an exposed gun, except the lady who is afraid to walk by the gun counter in Walmart.

So believe what you want, if your cave does not have murders nearby, you probably have little risk, wear your 5.11 pants and custom 1911 and go on about your business. You stick out like a clown when you do, and of course Karen notices you too. And I am glad you are there, takes me out of the list of easy targets.

We all choose how safe or not we want to be, I am that gray man, the one with 2 handguns somewhere on his body.

My 2 cents.

What this man said. I'm getting up there myself and in a world where I have to be aware of my surroundings the one thing I don't need is to have part of my limited attention span focused on my carry gun and others' reactions to it. Out of their sight, out of their mind is the way to go when carrying a firearm.

When I was on the job as an FPS-contracted ACSO I once had an interaction with an individual who told anyone who would listen that he was being watched by the Secret Service for threatening President Reagan. This rabbit kept circling around to my strong side and after the fourth time around the floor I told him that if he did it again he was going to end up on the concrete. He was so focused on my sidearm that every alarm bell in my head was going off at the same time. I never want to feel that again. If you you open carry there is a risk of the same scenario assuming they don't just thump or stab you and take your weapon outright. Why create the opportunity?

 

[roundels]

That would be nice but we get some really cold weather and lots of snow here. It's even worse in Buffalo. Just ask Bald1 or Grimjaws. Those guys get it a lot worse than I do. That's what I mean when I talk about GUYS in shorts in the winter. I don't get it.

Rick

It's a thing in Utah. In the dead of Winter board shorts and hoodies abound. Common sense, on the other hand...

 

[Riposte1]

As an LEO (or at least acting in such a role) I am shocked that a holster w/o retention is even allowed. To me, no one in public should open carry without a retention holster. You're asking someone to take it away from you.

I've trained LEOs for close to 50 years, I don't tell people what to carry myself since everything is a compromise between speed and security and it is up to the individual which they lean towards.

That said I've carried both holsters with mechanical retention and holsters with only friction retention in uniform - Haven't carried much other than concealed for the last 30 years (only occasionally for public events did I carry openly in uniform) - for those events I carried basket weave gear with a Bruce Nelson thumb break (though I did also carry a web belt (Wilderness) rig for special duties with a safariland ALS and GLS holster).

I once worked for a really competent Sheriff who carried a 1911 in a Milt Sparks 1AT holster - a few of his deputies did the same - one of them was in a rollover crash and ended up upside down. He was unhurt and his 1911 remained in the holster.

I have carried a 1911 often in a 1 AT I bought at Gunsite in 1980 - it still works! These days I more often carry concealed in an Alessi ACP which Lou Alessi actually gave me. But I also like the Alessi G-man (like the Ritchie Lightning).

Just ramblin' - to each their own.

Riposte

 

[ferider]

A study done in Wyoming several years ago indicated that well over 90% of the people here own firearms, about 80% percent carry a handgun most or all of the time; usually concealed but also openly when engaged in an outdoor activity like hunting, hiking, horseback riding, camping, etc., so seeing someone openly carrying a handgun in public doesn't cause much comment except from some tourists and newcomers to the state.

This. I carry daily and open since Feb here, and - since we are building a house - am around contractors every day. Some of them carry open, too (which is why I decided to EDC - my wife manages the build). You go to a restaurant, and you see quite a few guns - always. I use leather holsters with thumb breaks, only partially covered by shirt or sweater. The contractors use OWB kydex.

When I was in Yellowstone a couple of weeks back, I got some looks by Tourist (mostly Asian), but that was it. Locally here (~1000 people town), everybody knows, and nobody cares. Was walking around inside Jackson Hole airport last week, checking my daughter in and no concerned looks at all. The local Sheriff encouraged both my wife and me to carry after we moved here last year. Etc.

I carry open because it's more comfortable. My 986 is a bit too heavy for pocket carry, and I need my belt to hold my pants up

It's really uncomplicated unless your state's politics and culture has made it an issue.

PS: I do agree with the OP of course that there needs to be a good retention mechanism, and that you have to be aware of people close to you.

 

[biku324]

So someone tell me exactly how many OCers have been killed or had their gun taken because of that.

I know myself of two neighbors who had their guns stolen because they left them in the car in their driveway with the keys also in it. There are probably hundreds if not thousands pilfered in that manner every year.

You'll never know, as no one tracks that data.

 

[Xfuzz]

Here is a taught...
Some moderator carrying concealed or open carry
should shoot this thread in the head....

 

[Chubbs103]

I'm not going to comment about average Joe and open carry. The OP was making an observation about a School Resource Officer.

There are occupations that require an individual to be in regular, close contact with people that want to do them harm. If you are already at bad-breath distance or closer when things go south, your life might depend on keeping the gun IN the holster.

If I carried a 3rd Gen Smith I would modify if to decock-only. That is personal preference. My issue duty gun used to be a Beretta M9. Our SOP was to use as a de-cocker, but carry off safe. Once I started shooting other pistols more on my own, I had to be very careful with a slide mounted safety not to engage it when overhanding the slide during malfunctions clearing.

 

[DocSkinner]

A study done in Wyoming several years ago indicated that well over 90% of the people here own firearms, about 80% percent carry a handgun most or all of the time; usually concealed but also openly when engaged in an outdoor activity like hunting, hiking, horseback riding, camping, etc., so seeing someone openly carrying a handgun in public doesn't cause much comment except from some tourists and newcomers to the state.
I don't usually carry unless I'm making a late night ATM, burger, gas run or something similar and then I carry openly for a couple of reasons. (A) Due to arthritic hands I can access a handgun from a holster on my side quicker and easier than from a concealed position.
(B) I believe that would be predators regard an obviously armed gimpy old fart as a less appealing target than an unarmed gimpy old fart.
So far so good.
The exception to this is when I go grocery shopping which I do late at night to avoid crowds; then because of store policies I carry a Beretta 21A in a pocket.

More like gimpy old guy with a gun showing? WooHoo! FREE GUN!

 

[Doriangray6]

More like gimpy old guy with a gun showing? WooHoo! FREE GUN!

Maybe where you live. However here in Wyoming I'm just another citizen exercising my right to live as I wish to; including carrying a firearm as I prefer to without having to be concerned about some sob sister getting their panties in a twist because I scare or offend their sensitive little minds.

 

[Brian Parrish]

I see no effort to make the forum hostile toward open carry disciples. I do see an effort, but not a hostile one, to speak out against those who use poor judgement and have an incessant need to draw attention to themselves. There's only so many ways of saying this. Other valid points have already been mentioned in other posts. Seems a waste of time to continue with this. Hard heads won't be swayed in the right direction.

Greetings Friend!
Hope all is well over your way.
Over here my adult daughter hurt her knee and it looks like she's got to get it x-rayed, but no reason to worry yet. Just because they grow up, you can't stop fretting over 'em.
_____________________________________-
You said open carry is stupid, and similar sentiment has been expressed every time the subject comes up.
"Draw attention to themselves" ,
"Incessant",
"Poor judgement",
"Hard heads"
It is no skin off my nose, but if you want to persuade this is not the way to do it. I suppose the Open Carry Disciples can be here as long as they stay in the closet. Anyway, at your request I am out of it for this thread and for a while.
Again as I have said before I always appreciate your contribution RQ.
Best to you!
BrianD

 

[Smoke]

No one. You needn't be a "guru" to recognize poor taste.

Sept 13 1315 MDT. Eastern Colorado.

 

[Smoke]

This thread is off the rails. This photo of me just might send some off the cliff. That's me.

Some of you need to rethink your opinions.

Cheers!

Be safe.

You need an Aloha to go with those shorts

 

[Smoke]

I use work type shirts by Wrangler or Carhartt, darker colors unbuttoned unless really cold out. Rolled up sleeves are accepted in mid season. CCW only. Or even pocket carry

NGL I buy the majority of my clothing at Goodwill. I tend to go with Cabela's, Red Head and Wrangler. Usually something like this

And Wrangler cargos.

As I have said multiple times, Probably a third of the middle aged men in Colorado Springs dress almost exactly the same way. If you throw a rock in Colorado Springs you're liable to hit a guy dressed like that. I don't stand out at all.

After I wrote that it occurred to me that I don't live in Colorado Springs any more and most of the folks around here look like this

 

[ladder13]

Greetings Friend!
Hope all is well over your way.
Over here my adult daughter hurt her knee and it looks like she's got to get it x-rayed, but no reason to worry yet. Just because they grow up, you can't stop fretting over 'em.
_____________________________________-
You said open carry is stupid, and similar sentiment has been expressed every time the subject comes up.
"Draw attention to themselves" ,
"Incessant",
"Poor judgement",
"Hard heads"
It is no skin off my nose, but if you want to persuade this is not the way to do it. I suppose the Open Carry Disciples can be here as long as they stay in the closet. Anyway, at your request I am out of it for this thread and for a while.
Again as I have said before I always appreciate your contribution RQ.
Best to you!
BrianD

Not to worry, there will be many more OC threads in the days ahead. Same ol same ol.

 

[GerSan69]

Well think about it. While you boys cringe at the thought of wearing shorts in the winter, you think nothing of a woman walking down the street or across the parking lot in a skirt or dress, which most of you appreciate. Do I detect a double standard here? Just for the record, skirts and dresses are worn year around in this neck of the woods. A lot of us non boy types also wear shorts. Toughen up boys, and before some idiot mentions it, NO, we don't wear shorts deer hunting or 10 degrees with 20 mile per hour winds and a foot of snow. There are a few of us girl types who have been out in the woods at minus 20 searching for bedded deer while the guys sat back at the cabin telling war stories and drinking whisky and beer while the girls jumped a nice 8 pointer from it's bed and dragged it back to the cabin only to have the guys complain that it was one of their deer and why did they allow girls in deer camp anyway??????

Tabby Lynn, you are my kind of girl. Any chance you are single and live in Arizona?!?!?