Attempted Robbery next door

[Zeteo]

The business next to mine was a source of high excitement today. Suspect entered the business at about noon EST and demanded register money. Female business owner pulled out handgun (don't know make or caliber) and he ran out the door.

She must have depressed a panic button during the encounter, as several police descended on the area very quickly. She chased the suspect, and while outside in her parking lot, discharged her weapon in the air over busy business & traffic area.

Suspect was apprehended by police across the street in the K-Mart parking lot.

I think this highlights how critical it is for those of us who use firearms as self-defense weapons to be well trained in their use. She should NEVER have fired that weapon, in fact, she never should have left the building in pursuit. The police were on scene when the weapon was discharged. She is incredibly lucky that the bullet didn't hit an innocent bystander.

Police confiscated the weapon. Don't know what will happen with her about the discharge.

It's a mad, mad, world!

 

[Cocked & Locked]

uh oh

She has probably messed up...big time. Keep us posted as to what happens.

 

[The Big D]

What goes up must come down.

Wow, what an incredibly bad decision(s) she made.

This illustrates why training is, IMHO, a very important and necessary component of firearms carriage.

Be safe.

 

[PDL]

Welcome to the forum.

Here behind the lead curtain, she would have been in cuffs in the back of the patrol car. Her assailent would be suing her for reckless endangerment. She definitely should not have shot in the air regardless of in or out of the building. Major bad, outside when the threat was not there.

 

[Larry from Bend]

Where I live she would have been cited for poor marksmanship.

 

[Zeteo]

I have a couple of good buddies on the local PD. As soon as I hear from them with details, I'll pass them on.

 

[HotRoderX]

I think common since would go along way also. I know someone who carry's who should not be aloud. There the type of person who will escalate a situation instead of trying to avoid it or deescalate it. They sound just like the store owner instead of escalating the situation by chasing the robber out. She should have locked the door to her business and waited for Police.

 

[fiasconva]

On a positive note: The rest of the guys in the 'hood are going to say that lady's crazy and better not try to rob her again.

 

[raven818]

Too much T.V., not enough training...

 

[oldman45]

I agree mistakes were made. I agree she did some stupid things.

I also will say this is not uncommon in people after going through a stressful event where their life was in danger.

A good friend of mine with 27 yrs on the Dept and having been on the scene of many shootouts was involved in a shooting several years ago. He totally emptied his gun into the felon, picked up his partner's gun and emptied it into the fallen felon. When quesitoned as to how many shots he fired, he told the board he thought he fired about five and said he never heard any shots other than the ones fired by the felon. He did not remember getting his partner's gun but it was caught on security video.

If someone talks with the lady that fired the airborne round tomorrow, I will bet she will not remember doing so.

I get to interview a lot of people after the fact. They often make a remark like "I do not remember doing it but ws told I did." This is also why I am not fond of people carrying a pocket full of magazines. Under stress, common sense and cool heads go out the door and I include my self in this group. I have done some stupid things over the years that had I not been under stress, I would not have done. Since the mid 80's I have investigated and attempted to reconstruct several civilian shootings where there would be over 30 casings at the scene but the shooter was not able to recall swapping magazines.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

A good friend of mine with 27 yrs on the Dept and having been on the scene of many shootouts was involved in a shooting several years ago. He totally emptied his gun into the felon, picked up his partner's gun and emptied it into the fallen felon. When quesitoned as to how many shots he fired, he told the board he thought he fired about five and said he never heard any shots other than the ones fired by the felon.

Bad answer. He should have pled temporary sanity.

 

[feralmerril]

I bet he wont try robbing her again though.

 

[BaldEagle1313]

So, are you planning your expansion in to the soon-to-be-vacant space next door? Shooting him while in her store pointing a gun at her is one thing. Chasing him into the street and firing in the air? Hope no one 6 blocks away got hit when the bullet came back to earth. She's in a world of trouble.

 

[jtpur]

Dumb and probably a techinical violation of improper exhibition of a firearm and maybe even a violation of discharge not in necessary self defense...Prosecutor should decline charges and they should return her gun.

 

[hatt]

A few of you guys are beating up the victim. She was under intense stress and did some stupid stuff. So what. No harm, no foul.

And oldman45. Those are good stories illustrating why everyone should keep their trap shut right after an incident.

 

[BaldEagle1313]

Hatt, I didn't think I was beating up on her - just reciting what happened and offering the opinion that the authorities will be mightily displeased. We all to things under extreme stress that we would never normally do. Unfortunately for this shop owner she's going to get sued by someone - even if just for "emotional distress."

 

[jamesk1989]

And oldman45. Those are good stories illustrating why everyone should keep their trap shut right after an incident.

I've been told that in Massachusetts, pleading the fifth is discouraged by the police. Does anyone want to shed some insight on this?

 

[jimmyj]

In my patrol area a convenence store manager (female) would run out of the store into her private vehicle and go in high speed pursuit of a "Gas Drive-Off".
At another convenence store the clerk (male) ran after a shop lifter who stole a six pack of beer firing a revolver. The pawn shop manager next door joined the foot pursuit firing a auto pistol.
The thief stopped after several blocks and sat on the ground. When I arrived both the clerk and manager (with guns in hand) was standing with their backs to the thief.
DUMB??

 

[oldman45]

In my patrol area a convenence store manager (female) would run out of the store into her private vehicle and go in high speed pursuit of a "Gas Drive-Off".
At another convenence store the clerk (male) ran after a shop lifter who stole a six pack of beer firing a revolver. The pawn shop manager next door joined the foot pursuit firing a auto pistol.
The thief stopped after several blocks and sat on the ground. When I arrived both the clerk and manager (with guns in hand) was standing with their backs to the thief.
DUMB??

Jimmy, you reminded me of an incident I worked in Texarkana many yrs ago. There was a drive off (gas theft) of $3.00 (gas was cheaper back then) and the station owner got in a car chase with the thief. The owner caused the man to spin out, overturn and fatally injured. It was learned the deceased was a mental patient due to war and was highly decorated hero during the war. He came back early due to brain issues. The station owner was charged with the accident since he was ramming the car at the time the accident took place and was chasing him without calling the police. The station owner also had a .357 in his possession. Depending on who one spoke with, he possibly fired shots at the fleeing vehicle.

There was so much wrong in that incident that it took weeks to figure it all out.

 

[paplinker]

The business next to mine was a source of high excitement today. Suspect entered the business at about noon EST and demanded register money. Female business owner pulled out handgun (don't know make or caliber) and he ran out the door.

She must have depressed a panic button during the encounter, as several police descended on the area very quickly. She chased the suspect, and while outside in her parking lot, discharged her weapon in the air over busy business & traffic area.

Suspect was apprehended by police across the street in the K-Mart parking lot.

I think this highlights how critical it is for those of us who use firearms as self-defense weapons to be well trained in their use. She should NEVER have fired that weapon, in fact, she never should have left the building in pursuit. The police were on scene when the weapon was discharged. She is incredibly lucky that the bullet didn't hit an innocent bystander.

Police confiscated the weapon. Don't know what will happen with her about the discharge.

It's a mad, mad, world!

So zeteo,what is the dividing wall of your shops made of? I hope concrete.If not be careful.

 

[redlevel]

I've told this one before, but its true and fits here. It illustrates the fact that it just depends on the jurisdiction.

A year or two back a guy drove off from a rural grocery/gas station without paying. Took off in a cloud of dust and a hail of gravel. The proprietor ran out hollering. A deer hunter sitting in his pickup eating his beanie weenies and soda crackers jumped out with some kind of scoped .357 revolver. He fired several shots, attempting to blow a tire. A deputy ran the guy down a few miles down the road. The car had a couple of holes in the left rear quarter panel. As the Sheriff was cuffing the guy, who had outstanding paper in a couple of jurisdictions, the guy asked the Sheriff, 'What are you going to do about that man who shot holes in my car?" The Sheriff replied, "I'm going to buy him a box of ammo and tell him to practice some."

Rural Georgia is a good place to live if you are a law-abiding citizen, because generally, the law is on your side.

 

[Kanewpadle]

I'm glad she was armed and unharmed. But warning shots are just a waste of ammo.

I believe it was the ever so eloquent Mr Ayoob that said "every bullet has an attorney attached to it".

 

[Fishslayer]

I've been told that in Massachusetts, pleading the fifth is discouraged by the police. Does anyone want to shed some insight on this?

Because saying nothing without an attorney makes their job harder.

 

[Rule 303]

Where I live most of these folks would get a "Good Citizen" Commendation. But then again, Texas is different than most states.

Most folks don't know what training is and that's too bad.

Once had a Case where a little ol' Lady went out at O' Dark Thirty to confront the Yoots who were stealing her fire wood.
She got in the middle of the Alley and told them to halt. The three yoots thought they would proceed down the alley over her until she started blowing big chunks of their windshield all over them with her trusty Security Six Revolver. At the hospital the yoots were subdued but their Mommas and Daddies wanted the lady arrested for assulting their precious little boys. As soon as the ER Doc got finished sewing them up, we hooked them up for Burglary of a Habitation, 5 to 99 years or life and a $10,000.00 fine. Seems where they were stealing the firewood was a shed attached to the Deweling.

Mommas and Daddies about stroked and the DA laughed at them. All of de Yoots got Felony Probation. My DA was refered to by the Defense Attorneys and Criminals as "the Prince of &*^%^$^ Darkness." Graduate of the Military Academy at West Point and Army Airborne Ranger. Tough ol' boot and he had Texas Criminal Penal Code and Code of Criminal Procedure to work with. He used it to the State's Advantage.
He loved citizens who protected themselves, their families and their property.

Rule 303

 

[Zeteo]

OK, so I spoke to my police buddy, and have some more light to shed on the incident. Turns out - not a robbery attempt. The suspect was involved in a police chase. No plates on his car. After his arrest, PD discovered he had several felony warrants and most likely the reason he decided to run.

He ditched the car and ran behind several businesses with an officer in pursuit on foot.

Several other cars were already on their way to the area due to the pursuit. The suspect slipped between my building and the tanning salon. (Our buildings are not attached, both are freestanding businesses). Fortunately for me, my entrance is on the other side of the building, but the salons entrance faces my store, right where the suspect was running. He ran into the salon in order to hide from officer on foot chase, who did not see him enter the salon.

According to what she told police, he ran in, no shoes, muddy feet, and started running around looking for a place to hide. She pulled out her weapon (I forgot to ask him what make/caliber) chased him out of the store, and fired the shot in the air after him.

We'll see what happens from here. In my mind, this illustrates exactly why we need to be well trained if we decide to arm ourselves. Someone could have been killed. Her life was never in danger, yet the intensity of the situation got the better of her and she acted without thinking.

 

[The Big D]

And there you have it!

Be safe.

... In my mind, this illustrates exactly why we need to be well trained if we decide to arm ourselves. Someone could have been killed. Her life was never in danger, yet the intensity of the situation got the better of her and she acted without thinking.

 

[redlevel]

Her life was never in danger

That's a mighty easy judgement for you to make, a day after the fact, from in front of a computer screen, isn't it?

Did you say he was a fleeing felon? Running from police? Hunting a place to hide? Do you suppose she just might have been considered a good subject for a hostage by the fleeing felon, except for the fact that she was armed?

 

[Zeteo]

That's a mighty easy judgement for you to make, a day after the fact, from in front of a computer screen, isn't it?

Did you say he was a fleeing felon? Running from police? Hunting a place to hide? Do you suppose she just might have been considered a good subject for a hostage by the fleeing felon, except for the fact that she was armed?

Good point redlevil, good point. I hadn't thought about it that way.

At the same time, though, I don't believe she was aware of a foot chase by LEO when he came running in. She saw a man run into her shop, no shoes, muddy feet, and running around looking to get into a tanning room. She then pulled the weapon, chased him out and fired.

My point is that training is essential for those of us who wish to use firearms to protect ourselves. She not only endangered my daughter, who was waiting on customers approx 50 feet away from where she discharged her weapon, but also many people in a busy area at a busy time of day. That bullet has to go somewhere when it leaves the gun. A responsible gun owner needs to be trained well enough to take those things into consideration even when things get out of the ordinary. In fact, that's why we carry our weapons, isn't it? In order to deal with situations that are out of the ordinary?

 

[hatt]

Her life was never in danger...

That's one of the silliest things I've ever heard. I'm pretty sure most police are shot trying to apprehend suspects. Clearly if they're willing to shoot police trying to catch them they'll harm someone else caught up in the situation.

 

[Zeteo]

That's one of the silliest things I've ever heard. I'm pretty sure most police are shot trying to apprehend suspects. Clearly if they're willing to shoot police trying to catch them they'll harm someone else caught up in the situation.

Hatt, what I meant to say, was that her perception of being in danger was very low. In fact, she told police that she fired in the air to alert them to suspects presence. How smart is that?