Auction fees

[22hipower]

The 1% fee is for using the RIA live bidding platform.

Phone bid and pay with a check -- 17.5% plus sales tax and shipping.

Again, do your homework. Not every auction house charges sales tax for out of state bidders and not every auction house does their own packing/shipping. Overall costs vary significantly.

Thanks for the clarification. You'd think, I would anyway, that the automation of the process (live bid platform) would cost less than having an employee in a one on one bidding process that could go on for some time depending how many items in which a bidder had interest.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

 

[Borderboss]

I often buy guns through the various auction houses but hadn't bought anything from Rock Island Auctions in quite a few years. Their descriptions were always vague and with each purchase I ended up disappointed. I decided to give them another try in the October 3-6 event but just dipped my toe in the water, only buying one gun at a hammer price of $850. Today I received my invoice— Hammer price $850, Buyer's premium 148.75, credit card fee 38.70, shipping 46.00, insurance 9.99, Live Bidding Fee (Proxibid) 51.00, sales tax (Joplin, Missouri) 99.84, for a total of $1,244.28. So $394.28 above the hammer price. Yes, I'm definitely done buying from them.

All of that is plainly spelled out on their website, and you have to click to accept the terms. It shouldn't have been a surprise. When I buy from them, I take all of that into account when I decide how much I'll bid. I don't buy much from them, but I have bought a few times.

 

[glowe]

The 1% fee is for using the RIA live bidding platform.

Phone bid and pay with a check -- 17.5% plus sales tax and shipping.

Again, do your homework. Not every auction house charges sales tax for out of state bidders and not every auction house does their own packing/shipping. Overall costs vary significantly.

Thanks for the clarification. Checked the RIA site and find the same statement on Live Bidding only. Phone is the same as absentee and online bidding.

I have not found a site that does not charge sales tax yet, and if one does not, I believe they are violating all the 45 state laws that have been enacted. Non-sales tax states are Alaska, Delaware, Montana, New Hampshire, and Oregon

 

[Borderboss]

Thanks for the clarification. You'd think, I would anyway, that the automation of the process (live bid platform) would cost less than having an employee in a one on one bidding process that could go on for some time depending how many items in which a bidder had interest.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

I think they're charging the 1% as an offset to someone just putting in a bid on the website before the auction and riding it out to see if they won. I've done that before with them and won some and lost some. I just put in the max I'm willing to pay, factoring in the additional stuff coming afterwards, and then check the day after the auction to see if I won.

 

[Bald1]

Buyer's premium and bidders fee are the two I don't like. It's like a double dip. I wonder how bad the sellers fees are? Anybody know? I think there is a misconception on shipping cost. As an FFL I ship several handguns a yr. Unless it's a very expensive gun requiring a lot of insurance it's always under $30. Usually a $18.99 priority flat rate box from USPS. Add signature and it's $23…. Anything above that is what a shipper is charging for their time. In this cases it should be part of buyer premium. When I see sellers on gun broker who are FFLs charging $75 I cringe.

 

[VaTom]

Thanks for the clarification. You'd think, I would anyway, that the automation of the process (live bid platform) would cost less than having an employee in a one on one bidding process that could go on for some time depending how many items in which a bidder had interest.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

A local auction house here in Va. has at least two to three firearms/sportsman's auction a year. A lot of the firearms are from estates auctions that they do and hold the firearms for that auction. Before Covid they were live (in person) with telephone, sealed bid, on line options. Loved to go to the live auctions and got some really nice pieces at good prices over the years. The buyers fee was 15% for cash check.
The owner sold the business and now all auctions estate, real estate and firearms, coins are online only. Haven't bought any since then. Seems all auction houses are going this way.

 

[LVSteve]

I have an ever growing list of auction houses I won't deal with because of their markups.

It's all about reading the terms. During one of the huge Darnell auctions here in Vegas, I watched a guy bid on a Smith revolver then immediately go to pay. He came back grumbling about the buyer's premium and taxes. I exchanged glances and eyerolls with the guy next to me, then showed him my 'total cost' cheat sheet. He smiled and nodded towards Mr Grumbling and said, "Pays to plan ahead."

 

[VaTom]

I have an ever growing list of auction houses I won't deal with because of their markups.

It's all about reading the terms. During one of the huge Darnell auctions here in Vegas, I watched a guy bid on a Smith revolver then immediately go to pay. He came back grumbling about the buyer's premium and taxes. I exchanged glances and eyerolls with the guy next to me, then showed him my 'total cost' cheat sheet. He smiled and nodded towards Mr Grumbling and said, "Pays to plan ahead."

I have one also. Learned early on that you can get caught up in the bidding at a live auction. Constantly checking my cheat sheet at any auction,

 

[Pisgah]

Some of my favorite things to hear complaints about:
1. A perceived flaw in a new gun, by the person who bought it without really looking at it;
2. High auction house fees, from folks who never bothered to read and understand the terms of sale before bidding.

 

[Exmilcop]

Rock Island's fees are pretty stiff but when you factor in the USD to CAD conversion, a $1700.(USD) purchase becomes $2900!

 

[Sevens]

I would be curious what the seller took in on the $850 hammer price.

 

[444 Magnum]

I have not found a site that does not charge sales tax yet, and if one does not, I believe they are violating all the 45 state laws that have been enacted. Non-sales tax states are Alaska, Delaware, Montana, New Hampshire, and Oregon

Maybe that's it ^^^. Amoskeag is in NH, but they didn't charge me Georgia sales tax either. My invoice is dated 9-8-24, just a month ago.

Fees are steep no matter how you bid and the sales tax makes it worse.

 

[444 Magnum]

I would be curious what the seller took in on the $850 hammer price.

The last time I called RIA, they wanted 30% for small collections.

 

[raljr1]

I won my first Rock Island auction the other day. Hammer price was $1400...ok not bad. After shipping, tax, buyer premium, cc charge, and insurance, the total is $1951. And I will probably pay another $100 for the dealer that brings them in....might be my last foray with them. $92 UPS, when it would probably have gone in a USPS large flat rate for $26. I thought I'd be all in around $1800.

Three Smith & Wesson Double Action Revolvers | Rock Island Auction

 

[444 Magnum]

$92 UPS, when it would probably have gone in a USPS large flat rate for $26.

Three Smith & Wesson Double Action Revolvers | Rock Island Auction

Pistols have to ship 2nd day air.

Did I miss the leafy scroll engraving?

 

[raljr1]

Pistols have to ship 2nd day air.

Did I miss the leafy scroll engraving?

USPS Priority mail flat rate boxes work, I have used them with my dealer a dozen times.

 

[mrcvs]

Auctions for the last ten years, until recently (the last few years) used to be a sweet spot. Not many bidders, less who could spot a bargain, low buyer's premiums, limited competition, no sales tax, and reasonable shipping.

No more!

More and more folks with deep pockets seem to bid, and bid unrealistically, determined to get an item at any cost. Or don't know, and there are more bidders than ever. Increased hammer prices mean more commission for the auction house at a set buyer's premium, but this isn't good enough, and buyer's premiums seem to go up frequently at auction houses. The logic is unbeknownst to me, but it's the same as the ill founded claim that you now need to tip 20% instead of 10% because of inflation, never mind that the tip doubled already because the meal cost doubled as well??? Then there's sales tax that I account for when I bid, and others don't, which handicaps me relative to others. In the past, there wasn't any, until the Supreme Court decided to rule in favour of the States, no matter if it's Constitutional or not. Leave at least one loophole out there, for crying out loud. And then shipping seems to have doubled in the last few years.

And it's even not rosy for consignors. Auction houses now 1099 sales. And, I'm sure, seller's premiums have increased as well.

Costs buyers more, sellers net less, the government and auction companies and shipping companies all benefit.

AVOID THE MIDDLEMAN! Sell in the Classifieds section of this forum.

 

[rct269]

444 Magnum makes a good point---bid by phone and pay by check.

I'm not sure of these numbers I'm going to run my mouth on, but I should make my point anyway. I'm thinking you'll find RIA's buyer premium is 17%. Any more than that is because YOU chose to run it up. Proxibid's add-on is 6%. Charge cards are 4%. Any other extras are what YOU chose to make them!

There's a sticker on the front page of most/many insurance contracts----says "Please read your policy!"

It might help if you also read the auction house's admonitions.

Ralph Tremaine

And speaking of bidding by phone, why bid at all-----just so your competitors can raise your bid? I tell the nice ladies on the phone I won't be making any bids, to just tell me when it's time to buy the gun----saves wear and tear on your nerves. Then I buy it----or not!

 

[TheTinMan]

Amoskeag doesn't charge sales tax because there is no sales tax in New Hampshire.

In most cases, a national auction house has no choice but to charge sales tax. Maine is so aggressive about collecting sales tax that I've found 2 national sellers of ammunition who will not ship to my state. One was kind enough to explain that they got a bill for over $30,000 for tax on sales that had occurred over the preceding year or more. I wouldn't do business here either.

The thing about Rock Island is that they get items that are hard to find. Their descriptions are usually accurate and the pictures are good although you're responsible for knowing what you're buying (the ad may say "with box" but it doesn't necessarily say its "the" box or even a box for that model gun. Many items go for premium prices but now and then, as with any auction, some bargains sneak through. Not the best place to buy relatively common firearms that can be found elsewhere.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

In their Premier auctions, Rock Island offers some rare firearms in excellent condition. This summer I bought Registered Magnum #302 with a factory letter confirming that it was shipped with the grip adapter, the original order form, the invoice, and the letter from D.B. Wesson assigning the number. Did I have to pay for it? Of course. Could I have found it anywhere else? Highly unlikely.

Two points I'll add about dealing with Rock Island, one good one and one not so much. Their descriptions are accurate but you have to read them very carefully and know what Rock Island's wording means. I've been looking for a high condition Winchester Model 70 for a while but that's not my collecting niche. When RIA describes a rifle as "upgraded" that means a stock replacement, refinishing, or ____. Fortunately I didn't learn this the hard way. My second point is to call them if you have any questions. That's how I learned what "upgraded" meant. If the description doesn't say "mechanically excellent", that might mean they didn't bother typing those words or it could mean it's not mechanically excellent. I don't know if they'll do this for everyone, but I've had them take my questions on multiple firearms and reply in detail within a day or two.

Amoskeag seems more straightforward about their descriptions and they are very accommodating about answering questions. There's also the added benefit of being 90 minutes away so I can go to every preview.

 

[rover1992]

The seller also paid a 20 % seller fee to them plus shipping. If the firearm is special and goes to specialist sell they will reduce seller commission to 15%.
I have a NC auctioneer license. I don't use it much but have been thinking getting in. I think there is a market for regular sellers and buyers. Gunbroker is over whelming and a lot of fees.

Covid changed the auction process and auction house can get more money for the seller using the internet and reduce their labor costs and operating costs.