Beginner to reloading-.38 Bullet Questions

[bowzette]

A long time ago when the earth was "flat" I did a little reloading on a single stage press for 25-06 and .45LC. Small batches for accuracy. I just bought some reloading equipment. I will reload 9mm and .38. I've decided for the 9mm to begin with Delta Precision 124gr FMJ and not plated. Now I trying to determine appropriate .38 for range shooting. I have a model 64, a Ruger LCR .357 (shoot .38 in it) a Ruger Vaquero and Uberti Cattleman but not shooting Cowboy comp.
Questions:
1. I can save money shooting lead instead of plated or FMJ. But i am concerned with leading issues and well as the safety of handling lead bullets and shooting lead bullets at the indoor range I've been using. In the spring I will join a gun club and can shoot outdoors much of the time. i can wear gloves when handling the bullets while reloading if that is appropriate. But when the gun goes "bang" I assume, but don't know, if small particles of lead spray from the chamber/barrel and barrel. Is this an issue at an indoor range (suppose to be well ventilated but the gun is still close to where i'm breathing)?

2. Any suggestions for specific lead or lead coated bullets that are reasonably priced and group well that don't create leading problems. These will be mild to mid level range loads not "hot" reloads. I'm guessing the HBWC like from Delta Precision works well and cheap but I'm back to the safety concerns and leading questions.

3. Any suggestions for inexpensive, but shoot well, plated or FJM .38?
Thanks
Mike

 

[cowboy4evr]

Many shooters use either Missouri Bullet co , or Bayou Bullets . I have personally never purchased from either but have read satisfied posts on both .
If you shoot " a lot " , then lead / coated bullets are a little cheaper . Xtreme Bullets for copper plated and they really aren't that much more and the concern about " lead " is gone .

 

[glenwolde]

I'd stick with 158gr to start. They will likely shoot closer to point of aim in your fixed sight guns. I've shot many tens of thousands of plain lead bullets, but now prefer coated. They only cost a few dollars more per thousand and won't lead and generally leave your gun and your dies much cleaner. Plus they are safer to handle as no bare lead is exposed.

I use SNS Casting's bullets. I have no fixed sight guns so I use their slightly cheaper 125gr LRN. Check with your indoor range. If they allow lead bullets then I'd say your good. Most allow coated but not conventional lead but I think that's more about smoke from the bullet lube. Most ranges are paranoid about safety so if they allow them it usually means their ventilation system can handle it.

 

[Eddietruett]

I have gone to plated for 99% of my .38 loads due that they are MUCH cleaner shooting and loading. The cost is a tad higher but buying by the 1000 is worth the difference to me. I have no leading problems and barrels are much cleaner than with lead. I mostly use Berry's 148gr HBWC with 3.0gr Bullseye and Berry's 158gr Target HP with 3.5gr Bullseye. I also shoot the same 158gr Target HP in .357 with 7.5gr HS-6 and 12gr 2400 that are light .357 loads around 1000fps by my estimate. These are very easy on recoil and great for plate shooting 75-100 yds again with no leading problems. Others here swear by X-Treme but I personally find Berry's more accurate for my loads/guns.

 

[joeintexas]

Shooting lead is definitely going to be more of a clean up. Having said that, I shoot mostly lead from Summers Enterprises in Mississippi. If I shoot plated I use Xtreme Bullets, a little higher in price but cleaner. I shoot 200-400 rounds a week so the savings on lead is worth it for me. I shoot outside so I can't comment on indoor ranges. 38s are fun to load.

 

[apollo99]

If you're going to shoot lead, you have to slug the barrel and make sure the lead has a hard enough Brinell rating. Or you can buy the Poly coated or moly coated bullets from various manufacturers. I buy mine from BadMan (bulletshttps://www.badmanbullets.com/OnlineStore/cart.php?mode=logout) Cheap, accurate, clean shooting. I can push these coated bullets to 2200 FPS without fouling. I say give them a try.

 

[BradLH]

I load 158 grain LSWC and LRN Zero bullets at about 750 fps. No barrel leading problem with them in my .38 Special S&W revolvers.

 

[bowzette]

Thanks for the comments,
Mike

 

[m657]

Q1) the only time I've had hint of lead fouling in 38/357 is decades ago when trying to maximize the velocity with very hot loads. Agree some powders are more/some are less complicit in 'fouling conditions' but in general over decades and tens of thousands of such rounds downrange, lead fouling is not an issue.

2) agree on the Badman product, I've never been disappointed. I've used a number of different poly coated loads, and in my 10mm versions have had a faint odd odor.

The 'blood lead level' as measured in my own lab work, on 2 different occasions when I was shooting thousands of cowboy rounds/month, was in the normal range. Granted I was shooting outdoors or in open sided range bays. Being concerned about the potential for lead poisoning, the lab work provided evidence that satisfied my theoretical exposure to such.

Good luck in your new reloading ventures.

 

[dr. mordo]

One thing about plated bullets - there's not really any load data for them, and they fall somewhere between lead and jacketed bullets. They are more prone to stick in a barrel than a lead bullet, so powder charges need to be hotter than you might think.

Some manufacturers specify to load their bullets above a certain FPS, others say to load up to 'mid-range jacketed velocities' which dosen't mean much to me because both .38 SPL and a .357 "mid range jacketed velocities" will be very different.

My point is that plated bullets require some guesswork and experimentation to use, while you can simply follow the Hodgdon website and slap a 158 gr LSWC (coated or not) on 3.1-3.7 gr of W231 and you are all set.

Lead is certainly simpler for a beginner.

 

[824tsv]

Regarding lead exposure:
Wear nitrile gloves when handling lead bullets and washing your hands very well after reloading. Tumble your brass outside if possible and have a dedicated pair of shoes/ball cap/jacket that you only wear at the range and store in the garage. Change your clothes when you get home and wash the other clothes you wore at the range separately. Take a plastic jug of waterless hand cleaner with you when you go to the range and clean your hands very well afterwards. Limiting your exposure to lead is the key. It's impossible to fully protect yourself, just use common sense.

 

[ontargetagain]

For your 38's I have been delighted with Missouri Bullets, coated in 158gr but look for the 'grooveless' selection in the menu. Clean to handle, clean to shoot, easy to reload.

Missouri also has a nice 9mm SWC bullet if you are looking to punch paper with a more rounded hole. Just make sure with any bullet profile and seating that it passes the 'plunk test' in your barrel before loading up a bunch

Badman bullets also makes quality coated projectiles.
Karl

 

[elpac3]

Questions:
1. I can save money shooting lead instead of plated or FM?
But i am concerned with leading issues and well as the safety of handling lead bullets and shooting lead bullets at the indoor range I've been using. In the spring I will join a gun club and can shoot outdoors much of the time. i can wear gloves when handling the bullets while reloading if that is appropriate. But when the gun goes "bang" I assume, but don't know, if small particles of lead spray from the chamber/barrel and barrel. Is this an issue at an indoor range (suppose to be well ventilated but the gun is still close to where i'm breathing)?

2. Any suggestions for specific lead or lead coated bullets that are reasonably priced and group well that don't create leading problems. These will be mild to mid level range loads not "hot" reloads. I'm guessing the HBWC like from Delta Precision works well and cheap but I'm back to the safety concerns and leading questions.

3. Any suggestions for inexpensive, but shoot well, plated or FJM .38?
Thanks
Mike[/QUOTE]

Shooting lead will be cheaper. I have shot lead for well over 40 years now and never had any issues.

When handling lead bullets simple precautions such as good hand washing after reloading and no food or drinks at the reloading bench will take care of any issues associated with handling lead. Elemental lead (bullets) cannot be skin absorbed and must be inhaled or injested to get into the body.

Shooting indoors you certain can have some lead exposure. Most ranges are pretty well ventilated and should pose no unusual hazard. Typically, the majority of large lead exposures in indoor ranges come from sweeping and bullet trap cleanouts.

If you keep the velocity less than about 900 fps you should not have leading issues with target velocities which are generally in the 800 fps range. Most of the smoke you see is from the lube burning off. Going to a coated bullet will really cut down on the barrel smoke. I have used Bayou coated bullets with good success. I have found the SWC do not cut as clean a hole as lead SWC's due to some coating buildup on the shoulder of the bullet. FMJ 38's are hot load propositions.

Again, if you are paper punching, paper does not really care how fast the bullet is moving. Paper is not especially tough and jacketed bullets are not necessary for penetration. For .38, go with a 148 wc and 2.8 of bullseye or 3.0 of 231.

 

[OKFC05]

I load 158gr Berry plated over 4.3gr HP38 in .38 Special cases by the thousands to meet the power factors for IDPA Revolver and ICORE. I started with lead but switched to plated because of the cloud of lube smoke generated by rapid fire in competition.


Added: Metallic lead is not the main health risk in shooting. The risk is in breathing or eating the firing residue containing soluble lead salts. Fired empty cases, fired primer residue, what your cases cleaner gets off, black residue on the range, and the smoke all contain material that will absorb directly into the bloodstream if breathed or ingested. Sweeping up the indoor range is about the quickest way to fail a lead blood test. Ask any indoor range owner that is testing his employees.

 

[StakeOut]

For hard cast lead bullets you'd be hard pressed to find better quality at a lower price than from Summers Enterprises Bullets.

For plated and jacketed bullets look for the Black Friday sale from X-Treme Bullets.

 

[Nevada Ed]

I load lead in the 38/357 because they are accurate and can be
loaded light or heavy. Lead can kill "Paper" and even 288 pound Mule Deer.
As for the safety....................... I use soap, after loading.

Plated as mentioned is cleaner and factory copper a tad higher in cost.
Both will do well in the 38 and 9mm, with less smoke, with the
correct powders.
The 148 and 158 weight bullets are the standard for target use.

Good shooting.

 

[Fostereast]

Avoiding Leading

Leading. One post above touched on it, but did not prescribe a process to avoid leading. Missouri bullet has a simple FAQ that can help avoid leading. From everything I've read, leading is based on Brinell (BHN) and Pressure.

Missouri Bullet Company

If your running about 15k PSI and BHN bullets at 12 BHN or 25K PSI and 18 BHN bullets, you should not get any leading. I set the velocity according to pressures found in my reloading manuals to come close to the BHN required. So far I have only used a 12 BHN bullet, and pressures around 12k-16k. No leading, as far as I can tell, has occured in my revolvers.

Also, the Missouri coated bullets are very nice, and run cleaner than un-coated lead. I think the lack of bullet lube helps avoid fouling. Lube seems to add to the fouling (But, I have not specifically tested this).

MB's customer service has also been very good. In the first batch I received, I thought the bullet diameter was .001 off and when I dropped MB a message, they responded immediately and wanted the bullets back, and were ready to send another box immediately and prior to my return. I suggested I measure a little more to confirm prior to sending them back, I measured with a micrometer vs. a caliper and realized it was my mistake, but the service was already demonstrated. I'm sure other manufacturers also make good bullets and provide good service, but I have not had to look elsewhere yet.

 

[oneounceload]

For your 38, 158 - whether you want to lead, plated, plastic-coated or FMJ in the SWC configuration. I have been reloading a 158 LSWC (from a variety of folks) for over 35 years; no lead levels in my blood. WASH your hands with soap. The smoke is lube burning off, not lead and unless you try running bullets near max (which are never the most accurate) your leading issues should be minimum if any. I tumble my brass in my garage merely because it's too noisy in the house. MY Thumbler's Tumbler has a solid lid, so no dust flying around. The dust from the spent primers has nasty stuff in it.
If you shoot a lot indoors, do wash your clothes, take a shower and WASH YOUR HANDS. After my last session, my hands were basically covered in black sooty garbage. A trip to the range's restroom and a few minutes and clean as new.

Take precautions, but use common sense. Clean your hands like you would if you were about to put contact lenses in your eyes of dunk your hands into a bowl of M&Ms to grab some and eat.

 

[StakeOut]

A gunbroker seller has coated bullets a a very reasonable price and shipping cost.Just search gunbroker for coated cast bullets

On the shooting bench at the range I have a pack of unscented baby wipes to clean my hands during the session.

 

[bowzette]

Very useful information. I won't start reloading for awhile although all the goodies arrived yesterday from Midway. I have to clean and organize my side of the garage and I want to do adequate research before beginning. I've ordered Lyman, Speers and Lee manuals. I also got the ABCs of Reloading. I've been studying the X-treme bullets site, Delta Precision, Berry's and Bad Man's Bullets. For 9mm I can get FMJ 9mm at DP for same price as plated or polymer coated. Regarding .38 the sales pitch from Bad Man's Bullets as to the advantages of hard lead with a polymer coatings sounds good. My understanding the plated bullets are a bit "delicate" especially with bullet seating but the coated lead also requires sufficient flare to avoid shaving the bullet when seating. Any experience of polymer coated vs copper plated?
Mike