ColbyBruce
Member
There is also a nickel 3.5" S&W 24-? "Classic" 5 screw with the ILS NIB at a shop back home, and a nickel 21-4 with the ILS, both around $1,200.00 each.
Big Bore Snubbies?
- Thread starter njr
- Start date
RobertJ.
Member
As far as ballistics for mine goes, I really don't know. I use 8.5 gr. of Unique, and a 250 gr. SWC. I don't have a chronograph, but the book says 850, and with the shortened barrel, I'm guessing at least 800. I chose the front bead height so I could set it just over the rear notch, for quick close range shooting. I also practice point shooting with it, and it's a natural.
I've never weighed it, and I don't have a very good scale, but I'd say it's in the neighborhood of 40 ounces.
Now, this is one of my other snubbies, it's a SRH that's had the barrel trimmed to 2.75". This is the one that goes out in the woods with me. The bottom group was a .44 Special load that I loaded for my Contender, it was nice to find out the Ruger liked it, too. The top group was what I carry in the woods, a 300 gr. XTP over H-110. Both groups were shot at 10 yards, offhand.
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Many thanks for the responses and all the gun porn, heh.
My preliminary conclusion is that: 45 acp would make sense but as a previous poster noted, it works better in the semi auto platform due to the necessity of using bulky moon clips which would rule out summer carry. However, could you have the cylinder recessed?
44 special would seem to be more of a natural fit but the ammo is still expensive and almost all of the offerings are in n frames.
You would probably have to reload for 44 special or have a supply line to a reloader for cheaper rounds. Still, how cheaply can you buy 44 reloaded special? I almost bought a Dillon but honestly, maintaining an apartment as a bachelor is enough work and I probably wouldn't put the extra time into reloading, cleaning, prepping, etc.
The Charter Bulldog would seem like the platform I'm looking for in terms of size, but they are pretty cheaply made.
Have to go to bed, so I'll leave it there.
My preliminary conclusion is that: 45 acp would make sense but as a previous poster noted, it works better in the semi auto platform due to the necessity of using bulky moon clips which would rule out summer carry. However, could you have the cylinder recessed?
44 special would seem to be more of a natural fit but the ammo is still expensive and almost all of the offerings are in n frames.
You would probably have to reload for 44 special or have a supply line to a reloader for cheaper rounds. Still, how cheaply can you buy 44 reloaded special? I almost bought a Dillon but honestly, maintaining an apartment as a bachelor is enough work and I probably wouldn't put the extra time into reloading, cleaning, prepping, etc.
The Charter Bulldog would seem like the platform I'm looking for in terms of size, but they are pretty cheaply made.
Have to go to bed, so I'll leave it there.
44 special Dave
Member
The op asked about the weight of a cut down 45 colt.
Well that will vary.
a 2nd model 455 cut to 3 1/4" and done in 45 colt will weigh in at roughly 32oz empty WITHOUT grips. The type of grips will make a difference. Let's say 34 to 36 oz empty with grips.
Now the 25-14 and Jovino and Behlert jobs may will be 39 to 40 oz empty with grips.
The ones mentioned above are steel frame guns.
I have a 625-10 2.1 in barrel that weighs in empty with wood boot grips at a hair under 22 oz. stainless cylinder, scandium frame.
Also have a 325sc weighing empty with larger grips at 22.5 oz. Titanium cylinder and scandium frame.
I know the Taurus 44 spe ultra lite with factory grips is 22 oz empty.
Recoil goes up with the 625-10 and other light weights.
Still effective. Mine is a pleasure to shoot with PMC 200 gr copper jacketed.
As for ballistics, for my purpose that 45 cal hole in the barrel might be all I need. Still a big slug at self defense ranges. Don't care if it's 750 or 700 fps at 10-15 yards.
Big bore snubs are nice!
Dave
Well that will vary.
a 2nd model 455 cut to 3 1/4" and done in 45 colt will weigh in at roughly 32oz empty WITHOUT grips. The type of grips will make a difference. Let's say 34 to 36 oz empty with grips.
Now the 25-14 and Jovino and Behlert jobs may will be 39 to 40 oz empty with grips.
The ones mentioned above are steel frame guns.
I have a 625-10 2.1 in barrel that weighs in empty with wood boot grips at a hair under 22 oz. stainless cylinder, scandium frame.
Also have a 325sc weighing empty with larger grips at 22.5 oz. Titanium cylinder and scandium frame.
I know the Taurus 44 spe ultra lite with factory grips is 22 oz empty.
Recoil goes up with the 625-10 and other light weights.
Still effective. Mine is a pleasure to shoot with PMC 200 gr copper jacketed.
As for ballistics, for my purpose that 45 cal hole in the barrel might be all I need. Still a big slug at self defense ranges. Don't care if it's 750 or 700 fps at 10-15 yards.
Big bore snubs are nice!
Dave
RE: Moon clips in summer. There are 3 versions of clips for 45ACP
Full moon, Half moon and 1/3rd moon.
In the winter I dump a couple of full moons in a coat pocket. In summer I use the 1/3rd moons. Dump several in the watch pocket of my britches and I'm good to go.
Full moon, Half moon and 1/3rd moon.
In the winter I dump a couple of full moons in a coat pocket. In summer I use the 1/3rd moons. Dump several in the watch pocket of my britches and I'm good to go.
You can always go old school:
This is a .455 Hand Ejector that was converted to 45 Colt and snubbed to a 3 1/4" barrel.
A 3 1/4" bbl does not a snub nose make methinks.
I was right kinda sorta, because I was thinking Milt Sparks although I typed Mitch Rosen. I'm bad about mixing them even though I keep it straight in my head. Sharp, sharp holster.
Thanks Bruce that looks really nice but I'm thinking it's probably closer to an N frame?
Thinking that 44 special would be the way to go because it's rimmed and widely available add I'm assuming that 44 special defensive loads are more available than say 45 Colt. Also I'm looking at getting a Smith 29 so the ammo would be compatible.
Still, that's a really nice revolver.
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ColbyBruce
Member
Yes, this is a N frame snubbie. The .45 Auto Rim cartridge is a rimmed .45 a.c.p., made so one does not have to use the moon clips in the revolvers. There is a wide range of self defense ammo in the big bore calibers.
You might also look at the Taurus 431 .44 special, a beefier gun than a Charter Arms, also a five shot revolver.
You might also look at the Taurus 431 .44 special, a beefier gun than a Charter Arms, also a five shot revolver.
David Sinko
Member
This one has been around. It's my 625-4 with 2" barrel installed. It's a one of a kind, so I had to make the holster myself. The short, flat 2" barrel with large cylinder and heavy weight for size made holster design very critical, as it would fall out of every conventional holster that I tried. I finally got it right, and it has been my daily carry for a while now.
Moonclips are NOT bulky to carry. If I wanted, I could carry five or more reloads clipped to my belt and nobody would ever know it. Carrying the same amount of ammo for a rimmed cartridge is much more difficult if not impossible.
Dave Sinko
Moonclips are NOT bulky to carry. If I wanted, I could carry five or more reloads clipped to my belt and nobody would ever know it. Carrying the same amount of ammo for a rimmed cartridge is much more difficult if not impossible.
Dave Sinko
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CTI1USNRET
Member
Look at the Charter Arms Bulldog in 44 Spl. I had one back in the early 80's and I loved it. The only reason I sold it was because I was transferred to Japan.
This Autumn their 45 ACP Pitbull will be coming out. I'll be first in line.
IMO S&W really missed the boat on this. A 5-shot 44 Spl or 45 ACP is a natural progression from 38 Spl. With the popularity of 5-shot 38's no one will ever convince me there isn't a HUGE market for people who love a 45.
Steve
"It's not the critic who counts ..."
This Autumn their 45 ACP Pitbull will be coming out. I'll be first in line.
IMO S&W really missed the boat on this. A 5-shot 44 Spl or 45 ACP is a natural progression from 38 Spl. With the popularity of 5-shot 38's no one will ever convince me there isn't a HUGE market for people who love a 45.
Steve
"It's not the critic who counts ..."
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44 special Dave
Member
to the op: Not sure if anyone answered this , but a 296 is a 5 shot L frame.
A friend had one, at 18.5 oz it was a handle to shoot because it was double action only.
Some one mentioned a Taurus 431 (fixed sight). My wife had a Taurus 441 (adj sight) 5 shot that weighed in at 33oz or so empty.
I'm still opting for the lighter weight packages. At 33 oz empty add another 4 to 5 oz loaded (5 rounds). Granted the frame is closer to in between a k and L but still a hefty gun.
Not trying to steal the thread but it was mentioned Charter is FINALLY coming out with their 45acp bulldog in the fall.
I will believe it when I see one. First announcement of rimless revolvers from Charter arms was back in late '08,early '09.
As for caliber, for snub noses, I prefer the 45 acp these days. Can still find 100 rounds of 45 acp in white box at Walmart for 39.99 to 44.99. When the scalpers don't get them first.
Dave
A friend had one, at 18.5 oz it was a handle to shoot because it was double action only.
Some one mentioned a Taurus 431 (fixed sight). My wife had a Taurus 441 (adj sight) 5 shot that weighed in at 33oz or so empty.
I'm still opting for the lighter weight packages. At 33 oz empty add another 4 to 5 oz loaded (5 rounds). Granted the frame is closer to in between a k and L but still a hefty gun.
Not trying to steal the thread but it was mentioned Charter is FINALLY coming out with their 45acp bulldog in the fall.
I will believe it when I see one. First announcement of rimless revolvers from Charter arms was back in late '08,early '09.
As for caliber, for snub noses, I prefer the 45 acp these days. Can still find 100 rounds of 45 acp in white box at Walmart for 39.99 to 44.99. When the scalpers don't get them first.
Dave
mc5aw
Member
There is a tremendous allure to a large bore snub, but be careful what you wish for. I owned a 396 Mountain Lite, and @ 19oz, it was virtually unshootable with the factory open backstrap rubber grip. I have NEVER experienced recoil like that. A 500 Mag grip helped, but the concealability was lost on the large rubber handle. Gemini Customs worked up a pair of 296s for CCW and they looked beautiful. I'm sure the price for the custom package was not quite as attractive.
With the importance of the N-frame platform to the roster, S&W really should rethink the .45 ACP as a viable caliber to produce in something more than just the Miculek models. I bet a steel .45 snub would do well with the current interest and ammo availability.
With the importance of the N-frame platform to the roster, S&W really should rethink the .45 ACP as a viable caliber to produce in something more than just the Miculek models. I bet a steel .45 snub would do well with the current interest and ammo availability.
44 special Dave
Member
I can image the 19oz mtn lite was a handful. Recoil can be a variable "felt" perception.
By that I mean it depends on the caliber, load and configuration of the gun.
The hardest recoil I ever felt with a "handgun" was shooting a Remington XP bolt action pistol in .7mm/.308. quite an experience.
Now having said that, my 625-10 45 stings a bit with the wood boot grips. With the larger rubber grips, tame by comparison.
I guess I will trade felt recoil for weight and portability for close encounter defensive purposes.
It's been asked many times on this forum: If Taurus can make a 45acp and 45 colt in nearly a K frame, why can't Smith?
I will tell you though the Taurus tracker (model 455) 5 shot 45 acp would only fire 45acp with it's own designed stellar 5 round clips. It would not chamber the 45 auto rim. Something to do with headspacing and the way the cylinder was cut.
Smith 6 shot n frames will fire both acp and auto rim.
Now that I think of it, if Charter ever does come out with the 45 rimless bulldog, I'm guessing it won't fire 45 auto rims.
Dave
By that I mean it depends on the caliber, load and configuration of the gun.
The hardest recoil I ever felt with a "handgun" was shooting a Remington XP bolt action pistol in .7mm/.308. quite an experience.
Now having said that, my 625-10 45 stings a bit with the wood boot grips. With the larger rubber grips, tame by comparison.
I guess I will trade felt recoil for weight and portability for close encounter defensive purposes.
It's been asked many times on this forum: If Taurus can make a 45acp and 45 colt in nearly a K frame, why can't Smith?
I will tell you though the Taurus tracker (model 455) 5 shot 45 acp would only fire 45acp with it's own designed stellar 5 round clips. It would not chamber the 45 auto rim. Something to do with headspacing and the way the cylinder was cut.
Smith 6 shot n frames will fire both acp and auto rim.
Now that I think of it, if Charter ever does come out with the 45 rimless bulldog, I'm guessing it won't fire 45 auto rims.
Dave
Cocked & Locked
Member
My current duo
S&W 629-5 .44 mag. (pre-lock)
1917 Colt .45acp
S&W 629-5 .44 mag. (pre-lock)
1917 Colt .45acp
I have to say THANKS to all who contributed to the thread so far.. I am a snubbie fan. I love shooting my .41 mag, however it is not a smith it is a Taurus model 415. I have to say it shoots just fine for me and I would buy another .41 if I could find one at a price I could afford, with a wife and two teenage daughters I have to be careful with my money. Thanks again to all who posted the fine photos. Be safe.
fds5116
Member
are you pondering what I'm pondering?
A model 69 could be shortened to near snub-nose length. A hacksaw, a file, some elbow grease, a virtual trip to brownell's for a crowing tool...the front sight would be the trickiest bit.
A cylinder with enough meat for a 44 magnum should have enough meat for a 45 at acp pressures (or colt pressures). I wonder if Hamilton Bowen would think so?
Cheers,
A model 69 could be shortened to near snub-nose length. A hacksaw, a file, some elbow grease, a virtual trip to brownell's for a crowing tool...the front sight would be the trickiest bit.
A cylinder with enough meat for a 44 magnum should have enough meat for a 45 at acp pressures (or colt pressures). I wonder if Hamilton Bowen would think so?
Cheers,
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