DWalt
Member
Were it not for all the Personal Injury law firms in San Antonio advertising, the local TV stations and billboard companies would go broke.
Bottom Feeding Lawyers
- Thread starter dockmurgw
- Start date
I've known several Lawyers in My life. The only ones who really made money were the ones who worked for a huge well known firm. The rest were working two jobs with law on the side so They could feed Their families. I've known only two private practice lawyers that did well. Both worked mostly in US District Court and beyond. Never in City or County court. Most good trade school grads earn more than most Lawyers. Want a profession that really pays? Look at being a Dentist.
K-22
Member
DWalt
Member
I have two good friends who were USAF attorneys. Both retired from active duty as Lt Cols, both continued as civilian USAF attorneys, both as GS-14s, both now retired. Not a bad life, pretty much regular hours and good pay and benefits. Nearly all of their work involved regulatory compliance issues like NEPA, nothing concerning UCMJ. One now does consulting for two of the big DC law firms that do a lot of military legal work, and he can't handle all of the jobs they pass to him. He works from home and makes about $150/hour. He is dropping one of them in 2025 so he can have some time to himself.
My granddaughter, who was just commissioned as an Army 2LT, is now in pre-law at Syracuse, and the Army is paying the tab. She is now doing National Guard duty in a JA group and wants to follow in my friends' footsteps and become an Army lawyer.
My granddaughter, who was just commissioned as an Army 2LT, is now in pre-law at Syracuse, and the Army is paying the tab. She is now doing National Guard duty in a JA group and wants to follow in my friends' footsteps and become an Army lawyer.
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OP
I posted what I did because I thought it was cute and funny, I generally have no issues with lawyers. I think that in general they are more honorable than building contractors...that aint saying much about building contractors.
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Oldengineer
Member
My wife and brother in law are attorneys. They usually live in a high pressure environment with very often really unreasonable deadlines. I will say that it's usually a good idea not to argue with them! At the end of the day, they are not their job.
Tom H.
Tom H.
Back in the early 90s was having drinks with a lawyer about 10 years older than me. We both were Pitt grads. His class was IIRC about 35/40, mine in 1978 was close to 200 out of the 260 who started. TV shows made Lawyering look glamorous, fun and well paying! Think,"LA Law".
To Caj's point; One prof can lecture 100 students as easily at 20. I covered my whole nut with about 10K a year; today they "recommend 100K! Twice the rate of inflation!!!!
Did an internship with the County Public Defender office..... cured me of ever wanting to do criminal law!!!
Got recruited to a Hospital; my starting salary in today's dollars was about $95,000. Turned it into a 45 year career. VP, General Counsel and on the Board by 30.
I was lucky to be ahead of the curve; my BIL, 8 years younger, struggled his whole career to make a living.
I'd rather spend time with a sick dog than with some of the clients I met!
To Caj's point; One prof can lecture 100 students as easily at 20. I covered my whole nut with about 10K a year; today they "recommend 100K! Twice the rate of inflation!!!!
Did an internship with the County Public Defender office..... cured me of ever wanting to do criminal law!!!
Got recruited to a Hospital; my starting salary in today's dollars was about $95,000. Turned it into a 45 year career. VP, General Counsel and on the Board by 30.
I was lucky to be ahead of the curve; my BIL, 8 years younger, struggled his whole career to make a living.
I'd rather spend time with a sick dog than with some of the clients I met!
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All lawyers are horrible... until you need one. Police officers generally hate the lawyers that cross-examine them on the stand. Would anyone care to guess which lawyers the police turn to when they are in trouble?
Lawyers are like Member of Congress. They are all bums.
Except YOUR lawyer and YOUR Congressman.
I started to say something about my congressman but I don't want the mods on me.
I had a good friend (lawyer) who was also the commander of the AH-64 Apache unit in Conroe, TX. What a combination If you can't beat them, give them a burst from your 30mm chain gun.
A prominent Con Law professor used to tell the story of his elderly, somewhat naive mother who, upon reading that Ernesto Miranda had been killed, commented, "I see that wonderful Mr. Miranda, who gave us all those rights, has passed away."
He said he didn't have the heart to tell her.
Nope, just something I heard along the way (which is why I qualified my post with "It is my understanding...").
Being a kinda middle level bureaucrat in the fire Dept I got to deal with the 2 ADAs where I worked. I got to deal with the administrative court, judges and lawyers. A lot of the lawyers were newbies...just getting started. Because the ADAs told me what to expect I learned to do my homework and keep my mouth shut. Never volunteer info. It's hard to get rid of a long term employee who works for a governmental agency...even when they TRULY need it. The people I really liked to get to the most were the administrators and their followers who weren't doing their jobs. That's when politicians really come in to play. I got the same upper/middle level bureaucrat twice...once in the legislature and 8 years later in the Admin law court
All bad lawyer jokes aside, truth be told my youngest sister (born when I was 16) and her husband are both lawyers. They specialize in contract law - which (as I understand it) is negotiating and enforcing the terms of contracts between companies, contractors, and other entities.
They are the only couple on both sides of our whole families who are better off, financially, than my wife and I. FWIW, I'm an engineer and my wife is a career IT professional, and we both have decades of experience and work history.
Yet they are in an even better place financially than we are, despite the fact that they are much younger than we are.
So, based on that fact, I have to conclude say that at least some areas of legal practice can be pretty lucrative.
They are the only couple on both sides of our whole families who are better off, financially, than my wife and I. FWIW, I'm an engineer and my wife is a career IT professional, and we both have decades of experience and work history.
Yet they are in an even better place financially than we are, despite the fact that they are much younger than we are.
So, based on that fact, I have to conclude say that at least some areas of legal practice can be pretty lucrative.
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I find this quite interesting. In most states, NOBODY is allowed to carry a firearm in a Courthouse building, let alone in an actual room where is a case is being decided. The exception is LE.
A Judge is surely not law enforcement.
My honest question — is a Judge "above the law" ?
DWalt
Member
In this case, it was years ago. He was on the bench from around the late 1960s until he retired due to health reasons (diabetes) around 15 years ago. He died in late 2019. This was in a largely rural southern Ohio county. Many fairly rough country guys lived there, sort of like in the Hatfield and McCoy days. I suppose judges there and then could get away with doing pretty much whatever they wanted. He was not really a gun guy, and he may not have owned anything other than that Beretta. At least I never knew him to have any other guns. Truth be told, he was a little on the wrong side of gun control.
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At least a dozen states permit judges to carry firearms in court facilities. Arizona, for example, passed legislation about ten years ago to allow judges to carry, subject to certain statutory qualifications and policies and conditions set by the presiding judge of the court in question. Here's an example:
https://www.superiorcourt.maricopa....veOrders/AdminOrders/Admin Order 2014-096.pdf
Doug M.
Member
I hated law school. I also learned more than I had appreciated. I have had generally had solid and respectful relationships with most of my opposing counsel. They know I like to fight but I do it well and fair. One once described me as the lawyer version of "House".
I am hard on stupid lawyers, in part because they make my job much more difficult. I have to do some stuff for our criminal division sometimes. Just did something of that nature in early October, and opposing counsel was so dumb she did not even know I was overtly insulting in the brief and oral argument. My (now) division chief and me had to some stuff for the criminal division now and again. In one, opposing counsel missed so much of the relevant facts that he was way off on the law. It is embarrassing to me when such folks do a crummy job. It is also hard to respond to garbage, and they are not doing what their clients need.
I frankly do not think that regulators are not hard enough on bad lawyers; I don't think the Bar or the public would be harmed if 20% of the lawyers I see got disbarred. I was the lead in standing up our new Public Defense system, in part because I am counsel to our judges. I have known both of them for years, and they know that I hate offenders but insist on professional standards for all.
When I read the discipline notices, the most common problem is a failure of their parents in raising that lawyer, not law school.
I am hard on stupid lawyers, in part because they make my job much more difficult. I have to do some stuff for our criminal division sometimes. Just did something of that nature in early October, and opposing counsel was so dumb she did not even know I was overtly insulting in the brief and oral argument. My (now) division chief and me had to some stuff for the criminal division now and again. In one, opposing counsel missed so much of the relevant facts that he was way off on the law. It is embarrassing to me when such folks do a crummy job. It is also hard to respond to garbage, and they are not doing what their clients need.
I frankly do not think that regulators are not hard enough on bad lawyers; I don't think the Bar or the public would be harmed if 20% of the lawyers I see got disbarred. I was the lead in standing up our new Public Defense system, in part because I am counsel to our judges. I have known both of them for years, and they know that I hate offenders but insist on professional standards for all.
When I read the discipline notices, the most common problem is a failure of their parents in raising that lawyer, not law school.
I don't know if it is legal for a judge to be armed in court but I do know the one who presided over the case of murder when I was a juror had a firearm during the proceedings. There was an overriding reason. We had an inordinate amount of sheriff deputies in the court protecting the whole process. The person on trial had made a threat upon the whole proceeding saying he was going to kill the judge jurors and lawyers. Evidently he had enough connections that they believed him...When the jury went to lunch the first time we had 3 deputies the 2nd time we had 4...after that we were not allowed to go out...we had to order lunch to be delivered. Being small town Eastern Shore Md I asked a fellow I went to school with what was going on...He happened to be the Clerk of Court...and he told me the reason...wasn't supposed to...but heck...he and I flew planes together a bit. I was cautioned not to speak of it. But the judge was arned...he had a 1911 under the bench. I saw him put it there...and he noticed me and just put his finger to his lips ro shush me and I just nodded...I knew the judge too...small town ya know
I live in the ultra strict state of NY. One of my neighbors was a judge in our town (J.P.-- Justice of the peace) He always carried and in fact when seated at the bench used his 9MM for a paper weight. That put it about 12'' from his hand.
Was talking to him about it and he told me "This is my court room, I make the rules" No scheduled security and he had a valid CCW permit!
Note this is a small town and the court is in the meeting room in the town hall. Most of what he handled was traffic law, neighbor disputes and had the power to remand people to jail.
