Brough my USGI - WW2 era Colt 1911 to the range this morning

[chief38]

My usual range day is Friday but since it is July 4th and we have a party to go to we went today. While showering this morning I was pondering which gun I'd bring today. We did not have a lot of time to spend at the range so only one gun was being brought. I could not think of a better one than my USGI Colt 1911 - I though it was fitting because it's Independence Day tomorrow. The pistol was produced in 1943/1944 and when my Dad passed I inherited it from him. I will give you a short history of what I know.

Like I stated the Colt was originally made between 1943 and 1944. He got the gun in 1959 or 1960 and paid a whopping $17.00 for it through the NRA / DCM program (predecessor to the CMP I think). I was about 6 years old at the time and I remember the day he received it! The gun was a typical USGI surplus 1911 that was not in the condition it is in now and that did not sit well with him. He immediately started working on the pistol, stripped it, re-parkerized it, stippled the front and rear back strap, added a modern safety and a set of Herrett Diamond stocks. I am guessing he probably replaced the springs and tuned the trigger as well. I still have the original grips, safety, along with a slew of springs for it.

The gun is 100% reliable and incredibly accurate which is a bit surprising because the barrel bushing will actually slide right off the barrel if tipped down when disassembled - no friction at all! The sights are the original USGI small narrow sights and the magazines (about a dozen of them ) are all USGI that have seen some good use. Two of the magazines have cyanide treated feed lips. He tuned the trigger so it has zero creep, very little take up and has a 4 pound very crisp let off. If I wanted to, I could easily restore it back almost to USGI issue because I do have all the original parts but since this is the way he wanted it and the way I inherited it - I will leave it as-is. I do shoot the gun at least once a year and enjoy the heck out of doing so! I shot 50 rounds of hardball this morning at 12 yards and this was the best of the targets although the rest of them were not far behind. The hardest part is seeing the puny GI sights. It isn't my Gold Cup NM, but as far as accuracy is concerned it's not far off! Pretty darn surprising to me! I let my two friends that were with me shoot a mag full as well and they did enjoy it. Happy Independence Day to all!

 

[Baxter6551]

I would leave it in the inherited condition also. My 1947 Colt Commercial is the closest I have to GI except the sights have been changed. I had a Remington Rand 45 years ago but traded it for a Gold Cup which is also long gone.

 

[chief38]

I would leave it in the inherited condition also. My 1947 Colt Commercial is the closest I have to GI except the sights have been changed. I had a Remington Rand 45 years ago but traded it for a Gold Cup which is also long gone.

Love those Sambar Stag Grips!

 

[chief38]

I have a Remington Rand also. Parkerized in the greenish tone IIRC. Haven't looked at it in a while and it is still in the Rig Universal Grease and waxed paper I wrapped it up in before we moved 4 years ago. I'll probably unwrap it and clean off the grease one day soon.

 

[Baxter6551]

Those are Eagle Sambar Stag I found used in LGS for $100.

 

[Greyman50]

Many “ as issued” 1911A-1s will shoot more accurately than the shooter. We shot arms room 1911A-1s to “qualify” to be on Army pistol team. If one could do well with an issue 1911 they would do much better with speciality ones.
I cringe when people say “ you could not hit the side of a barn with a 1911”, tells me they can’t shoot.

 

[M1A4ME]

Many “ as issued” 1911A-1s will shoot more accurately than the shooter. We shot arms room 1911A-1s to “qualify” to be on Army pistol team. If one could do well with an issue 1911 they would do much better with speciality ones.
I cringe when people say “ you could not hit the side of a barn with a 1911”, tells me they can’t shoot.

Exactly. I remember being handed a well used 1911A1 to try out for the battalion combat pistol team in about 1978 or so. If I pointed it down at the ground and shook it I could hear it rattle. And yet it would knock down the 50 meter pop up targets one after another pretty easily (got the 25 meter and closer pop ups, too, but I wasn't sure about the 50 meter ones till that morning.)

I've got a Colt made in 1917 and stamped with the info on patent dates, Property of the US, etc. The last time I had it to the range was to mark it's 100th birthday. I took a mix of partial boxes of ammo for the kids to use up while having fun. It "ate" the 230 grain LRN and FMJ, the 200 grain LRN, the 185 grain semi wadcutters and whatever else was in those boxes.

I always read threads about issues with 1911's and hope that if, some day, one of my Colts ever has a similar problem I'll be able to remember the possible fixes.

In other words the three Colt 1911 pistols I have work like a Glock and shoot like a good 1911.

 

[Muley Gil]

Many “ as issued” 1911A-1s will shoot more accurately than the shooter. We shot arms room 1911A-1s to “qualify” to be on Army pistol team. If one could do well with an issue 1911 they would do much better with speciality ones.
I cringe when people say “ you could not hit the side of a barn with a 1911”, tells me they can’t shoot.

I remember reading a magazine article by the late Major George Nonte USA (ret) where some of his troops complained about the 1911. He said he dropped to prone and put a magazine full of .45s into a 100 yard target.

 

[chief38]

Remember..... most large agency's, Armed Forces, Law Enforcement etc. must "dumb down" their weapons to the lowest common denominator. During WW2 there were probably many many soldiers who were familiar with rifles and shotguns but rarely shot and probably never mastered handguns. While most here do not find the recoil of a 45 acp in a standard size 1911 objectionable, there are some that may. That was just one of the reasons the US Army went to the M1 Carbine for issue over the 1911 to general foot soldiers. They could probably hit much more accurately and consistently.

 

[stansdds]

I think the as-issued military M1911 and M1911-A1 pistols are reliable, at least with 230 grain ball ammo, and capable of more accuracy than the average shooter. What handicaps the perceived accuracy is the as-issued trigger pull, which tends to be heavy and sometimes gritty. The small sights can also be an issue, but I found the small sights to be good for precision shooting, at least once the trigger action was tuned.

 

[chief38]

I think the as-issued military M1911 and M1911-A1 pistols are reliable, at least with 230 grain ball ammo, and capable of more accuracy than the average shooter. What handicaps the perceived accuracy is the as-issued trigger pull, which tends to be heavy and sometimes gritty. The small sights can also be an issue, but I found the small sights to be good for precision shooting, at least once the trigger action was tuned.

The tuned trigger on mine breaks crisp and clean at 4 pounds and while the sights are dead on, they are a bit difficult to zero in with on a dark target - hence the red dot I put on the bullseye.

 

[VaTom]

Great discussion in this thread. As a result I did an online search about the accuracy standard required for the 1911 adoption by the military back in the day. The AI generated answer to the question is:

“When the U.S. military adopted the 1911 pistol, they had specific accuracy standards that it had to meet
.
The official government accuracy standard for the 1911 was:

• 5-inch dispersions at 25 yards
• 10-inch dispersions at 50 yards

The pistols were typically sighted to shoot a bit high at 25 yards and then be more or less dead on at 50 yards.
While these standards may seem generous compared to modern handguns, the 1911 was considered quite accurate for its time and met the requirements set forth by the military. The testing involved extensive firing trials to evaluate the pistol's performance and reliability.”

I have two. One an all original military contract 1943 Ithaca 1911A1 and a Colt Custom Shop 1911A1 1943 Colt military reproduction from 2001 (1 of approx 2800 made). Great handguns.

 

[BillyKframe]

I bought a Remington Rand in the late 70s or early 80s at a gun show that was in excellent shape and it was my every day concealed carry gun for over a decade. I still have it although I wore probably a thousand dollars off the Parkerizing but I don't care. I shot the hound out of it and it was plenty accurate.

 

[chief38]

Great discussion in this thread. As a result I did an online search about the accuracy standard required for the 1911 adoption by the military back in the day. The AI generated answer to the question is:

“When the U.S. military adopted the 1911 pistol, they had specific accuracy standards that it had to meet
.
The official government accuracy standard for the 1911 was:

• 5-inch dispersions at 25 yards
• 10-inch dispersions at 50 yards

The pistols were typically sighted to shoot a bit high at 25 yards and then be more or less dead on at 50 yards.
While these standards may seem generous compared to modern handguns, the 1911 was considered quite accurate for its time and met the requirements set forth by the military. The testing involved extensive firing trials to evaluate the pistol's performance and reliability.”

I have two. One an all original military contract 1943 Ithaca 1911A1 and a Colt Custom Shop 1911A1 1943 Colt military reproduction from 2001 (1 of approx 2800 made). Great handguns.

A beauty! Thanks for posting the accuracy requirements - never knew that!

 

[Greyman50]

Just finished fitting the slide, barrel and bushing on this this AM. Makes 10 Colts I have. This one has turned into a really good one as fit is excellent and trigger is about 3 pounds. To range tomorrow. Have another GI replacement slide with a red dot. Lame gunsmith did not drill holes correct or mill flat in line with bore so have to get holes drilled deeper and shim sight. Another project. Wish I had access to machine tools like I used to, sigh…..

 

[rockquarry]

Just my thoughts on 1911s...When I first began shooting these years ago, I found them difficult to master. With factory 230 ball loads, I though the recoil was substantial but certainly not punishing. I had been shooting other handguns for a long time before I ever started working with 1911s.

I can see how some beginners could be intimidated by the recoil. I've gotten used to 1911s and shoot them often. My eyes are still pretty good and the small sights on a fixed sight 1911 are no handicap for me. I would never put optics on a handgun. I'd get a rifle first.

I shoot Bullseye style with one hand at 25 yards, sometimes 50 using my own cast bullet target ammo. I'm very comfortable with a 1911 nowadays, but I can clearly understand the difficulty some have in learning to shoot these pistols. Not guns I'd recommend for a beginner.

 

[TaxPhd]

The “loose” non-collet bushing on a disassembled gun is generally not an issue. What matters is how it fits when the gun is in battery and the barrel is tipped up. They can certainly shoot with a high degree of accuracy, as you found out.

 

[Greyman50]

FWIW, find a copy of this and read several times. One can apply The Basis in this to every day 1911 shooting and they will be good to go. The No booze, no sex, no smoking and the other no no’s apply only to pistol teams. In early 70’s we were all young with wives and told the Sgt instructor all but the no sex, lol….

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

… The small sights can also be an issue, but I found the small sights to be good for precision shooting, at least once the trigger action was tuned.

Original 1911 sights are perfect for the principle of “Aim Small, Miss Small”.

 

[rockquarry]

Original 1911 sights are perfect for the principle of “Aim Small, Miss Small”.

I've found that to be a very true statement as long as you can see the sights! I can see them fine as a result of an eyeball rebuild (cataract removal and lens implants) about eight years ago, but don't expect that to last indefinitely.

Aiming at small targets works in the same way; your groups will be smaller than when shooting at a large bullseye.