Buffalo Bore Ammo

[photoman]

Originally posted by Gun 4 Fun:
All of their loads are within SAAMI specs, so I don't think the term "hot" is really correct.

You can call it whatever you want. The standard pressure loads they offer have MUCH more recoil than any other standard pressure load out there. It's physics, fps and bullet weight. Doesn't have anything to do with pressure.

I'm making such a fuss over the matter because many will buy the standard pressure load thinking the recoil will be less and it isn't.

I will say again, the standard pressure loads are very good ammo and I have bought much of it myself but it has all the recoil of a +P load.

 

[reerc]

I read on the internet - so it must be true - that the Buffalo Bore ammo is actually too hot for the ultra lightweight KelTecs; that the punishment the rounds deliver the little pistols will cause them to self-destruct. When I read that, I swapped the BB I had in my KelTec P3AT for Double Tap.

 

[Gun 4 Fun]

Originally posted by Photoman44:

Originally posted by Gun 4 Fun:
All of their loads are within SAAMI specs, so I don't think the term "hot" is really correct.

You can call it whatever you want. The standard pressure loads they offer have MUCH more recoil than any other standard pressure load out there. It's physics, fps and bullet weight. Doesn't have anything to do with pressure.

I'm making such a fuss over the matter because many will buy the standard pressure load thinking the recoil will be less and it isn't.

I will say again, the standard pressure loads are very good ammo and I have bought much of it myself but it has all the recoil of a +P load.

I'm not sure why you felt the need to single out my post, unless it's because we have disagreed in the past, but that's OK. The term "hot" is not factual or accurate. Their loads are as I stated previously, within SAAMI spec., and therefore not any hotter than any other SAAMI spec load. If anyone who buys their ammo would simply read their web site, they won't think that their stuff will recoil less, standard pressure or not. Their standard pressure loads are listed as "Standard pressure heavy", so it pretty much speaks for itself as to what a person can expect. They are "heavy" loads, and produce higher velocity due to the powders that they use, but still within standard pressures. Obviously they will have more recoil than a standard pressure, standard load (more commonly known as Win, Rem, etc.) because they produce more velocity which translates into more recoil. Simple.

 

[photoman]

Originally posted by Gun 4 Fun:
I'm not sure why you felt the need to single out my post, unless it's because we have disagreed in the past, but that's OK. The term "hot" is not factual or accurate. Their loads are as I stated previously, within SAAMI spec., and therefore not any hotter than any other SAAMI spec load. If anyone who buys their ammo would simply read their web site, they won't think that their stuff will recoil less, standard pressure or not. Their standard pressure loads are listed as "Standard pressure heavy", so it pretty much speaks for itself as to what a person can expect. They are "heavy" loads, and produce higher velocity due to the powders that they use, but still within standard pressures. Obviously they will have more recoil than a standard pressure, standard load (more commonly known as Win, Rem, etc.) because they produce more velocity which translates into more recoil. Simple.

I forgot about our past disagreement. I just wanted to warn people that the recoil would not be the same as other standard pressure loads. That's what I mean when I say their ammo is "hot". I wont use that term in the future as it seems to be confusing to some.

Regarding the pressure issue, I wish Buffalo Bore would join SAAMI and put an end to all the debate over the issue of whether or not their ammo is within SAAMI spec.

 

[Gun 4 Fun]

Photoman,
I lifted this from the ne BB site-

"Both of these 45 colt loads are designed to be a heavy loading, yet be within standard(SAAMI) pressure. As such, both of these 45 colt loads are safe and recommended to be used IN ANY post-war 45 colt that is in normal working condition. ANY post-war means ANY post-war, so please take my word for it without phoning or emailing me "just to make sure". I love hearing from and appreciate customers, I really do, but there is no sense using up your or my time answering questions that have already been answered."

That was taken from the standard heavy .45 Colt listing. They aren't clear in all their lisings like they used to be, before they re-did their site. The old site went into detail about their ammo being within SAAMI spec pressure. I'm not sure why they felt the neeed to drop that info, unless they figured everyone would know that by now, or were trying to save space. If you call Tim Sundles, he will still tell you that though.

There really does seem to be more confusion now, about their ammo, than there used to be with the old site.

 

[conchmariner]

Originally posted by reerc:
I read on the internet - so it must be true - that the Buffalo Bore ammo is actually too hot for the ultra lightweight KelTecs; that the punishment the rounds deliver the little pistols will cause them to self-destruct. When I read that, I swapped the BB I had in my KelTec P3AT for Double Tap.

I've read that all the mouse gun makers are saying this, at least for .380, although Gunblast has tested BB in the Ruger LCP and the MRI Micro Desert Eagle with no problems. Don't know how many rounds he used.

 

[flop-shank]

Originally posted by reerc:
I read on the internet - so it must be true - that the Buffalo Bore ammo is actually too hot for the ultra lightweight KelTecs; that the punishment the rounds deliver the little pistols will cause them to self-destruct. When I read that, I swapped the BB I had in my KelTec P3AT for Double Tap.

I did more than read about it on the internet, I tested the ammo and I posted my results here. Buffalo bore .380 +P Gold Dots are too much for a P3AT. One more shot would have seriously damaged my gun since the takedown pin had popped halfway out before I finished the first full magazine.

As far as recoil goes, as OKFC05 once pointed out to me, The powder type and charge weight will have a effect on recoil. Depending on the gun and ammo used, it is possible to get less recoil from the faster of two equal bullets, or to gain significantly more recoil for modest gains in velocity.

 

[kubi85]

another thing good about Buffalo Bore Ammo in these days of ammo shortages is every time I order from them I get my ammo. I'm getting another 300 rounds of 357, 125 grain heavy on 4/16.

 

[Hoptob]

Gun4Fun,

Did you by any chance ask Tim if his 38spl+P is loaded to SAAMI or CIP limit? I know that CIP does not define 38+P standard but people often refer to CIP 38spl limit as +P.

I looked through his old and new sites and some of his posts on THR. He talks about loading "to the very top of the caliber limit" about "ammo being safe in +P revolvers" etc. But I never saw him stating that his 38spl+P loads were at or under 20K psi.

Difference between SAAMI and CIP limits is small and I don't think it has much of any implication on the safety of his ammo. The reason I am asking is that I am trying to duplicate his load and it is easier to do under slightly higher CIP limit.

Mike

 

[Hoptob]

Okay, since there is no response, I take it we do not know if BB uses CIP or SAAMI standard for 38 special.

 

[photoman]

Originally posted by Hoptob:
Okay, since there is no response, I take it we do not know if BB uses CIP or SAAMI standard for 38 special.

In the past, they have claimed SAAMI standards. Being they are not a member of SAAMI, who knows? I'm not calling the guy a liar, just saying no way to know without independent testing.

Frankly... I'm getting bored with the subject. I have BB ammo in the locker and would use it without any worries.