Bulged cylinders on .357 K frames?

[1sailor]

Was at my local gunsmiths the other day picking up my rifle and mentioned to him that I will soon be in the market for either a 6" m66 or a 6" m19. He immediately jumped in to warn me to be warry of bulged cylinders. I know those guns weren't intended to use a steady diet of .357's and I can understand how it could happen but I never heard of it being a major issue. Is this something you guys run into a lot? Maybe being in the repair business it's something he's run into over the years. In any event, should I be concerned about it. Because I live in BFE I will likely get mine online so it's hard to inspect the gun ahead of time.

 

[Camster]

I suppose that it could happen with handloads,but I haven't heard of that being a common issue,or an issue at all.I would be more concerned with the possibility of a split forcing cone.

 

[1sailor]

Luckily, many problems that could be encountered would be obvious to the seller or there would be no way he could not see it if asked. Pictures might even show a lot of stuff. But bulged cylinders is something a seller might not even know about if he took the gun in trade. I'm guessing the gunsmith didn't mean a football shaped cylinder as much as being bulged enough to cause difficult extraction.

 

[H Richard]

I've been handling S&W's of all calibers for over 30 years, and I have yet to see a "bulged" cylinder. Maybe I've just been lucky, but I don't think this is a common occurrence.

 

[Dpris]

Never seen one.
Factory loads would virtually never cause it, absent metallurgy abnormalities in the gun or an inadvertent powder overload in the round.

Quite possible in handloads if somebody wasn't paying attention.
Denis

 

[Sebago Son]

"... I know those guns weren't intended to use a steady diet of .357's ...."

How do you know that? Did you read that somewhere?

The comments made to you are sheepdip from a know-it-all wannabee.

The next time someone tells you the 66's (or 19's) "aren't tough enough", you show him the picture of this real world 66-2.

It's a PD trade in that has seen a DOCUMENTED 13,000 + rounds of Federal 125 JHP .357 rounds and untold amounts of handloads since I got in 1992.

It, nor any of the other 50-odd service 66's that I used to keep running for the local PD ever developed bulged cylinders, cracked forcing cones, or split barrels that are so talked about among the arm chair experts who's "best buddy's gun" had that problem.

Some people just can help themselves when given a chance to dump on K-Magnums.

 

[diamonback68]

Seems like your "gunsmith" either A.) Doesn't know what he's talking about or B.) Doesn't have what you want or where to get it, so is trying to steer you into something else.
Either way, I doubt he would be my gunsmith any longer.

 

[murphydog]

In general, barrels will bulge from a full load following a lodged bullet, but cylinders with big enough overloads usually blow wide open.

 

[1sailor]

Well actually, I did read it "somewhere". Not about bulged cylinders but that the K's weren't intended to run a steady diet of magnums. Might have been BS. Trouble is, it's not always easy to seperate the BS from fact. This is all good news to me of course. Problem with living in BFE is that the next closest smith is about 200 miles away. And to be fair, the guy did a very nice job of repairing my 111 year old Winchester. I doubt he was trying to sell me anything because one of the first things he tells anyone is that he doesn't buy or sell guns unless he's buying one for himself. Still I hate it when someone who shold know passes along bogus info.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

Never seen a bulged K-cylinder either. OR a busted forcing cone on a SS 66. Did crack the forcing cone on my 19 back in 1986. Rebarreled it and its still running......abeit a slower pace than then. And NO I don't shoot 38's in ANY of my .357's..........Thats what .38's are made for.

 

[Jack Flash]

I think the "not meant for a steady diet of .357" information may have originated in comments by some folks who wanted to be very cautious and conservative with their K-Frame .357s. Some folks want a gun to last forever, and there is nothing wrong with that. They are my favorite people to buy guns from.

You often hear folks say of the M19/M66 ".38 Special for practice, .357s for duty." This personal preference somehow morphed into a rule that some consider must be kept inviolate.

Ruger probably contributed to this when they engaged S&W in an ad war over the strength of the K-Frame magnums. That S&W came out with the M581/586/681/686, seem to validate this assertion.

I am pretty conservative with my guns, keeping my handloads in the light to medium range, but magnum revolvers shoot magnums and specials shoot specials.

 

[AABEN]

I thank the man was a colt man! I have a lot of S&W and never had one to do that or have I ever seen one.

 

[tops]

I think what most people are calling bulged cylinders are .357s that have had a lot of .38 spec. shot in them and .44 mag. that have had a lot of .44 spec. shot in them. I have even heard some so called gunsmiths say to not shoot .22 shorts because it would burn a ring in the chamber and then a long rifle wouldn't eject. The .22 short is doing the same thing as the spec. are doing in a mag. chamber. Larry

 

[Dennis The B]

There is documented evidence of eroded forcing cones, early end-shake development, and excessive flame cutting of the top strap in K frame .357 Magnums. These issues arose from the use of 125gr JHP loads in the 1970's. There were several police department armorers who attested to the conditions, and S&W replaced some Models 19/66 with N frames. The Kentucky State Police was among those departments which had the problem.

This is not to say that all K frames will have the problem. However, it was documented.

The K frame .357 Magnum was developed, at the time, with the 158gr load. When Winchester came out with the hotter 125gr JHP, the load (less recoil) became very popular. The K frame is marginal for using the .357 Magnum.

I own several K frame .357 Magnums, and I don't hesitate to run 125gr JHP's through them on occasion. However, I do prefer the 158gr JHP over the lighter bullets, but not because of any fear of the 125gr bullet.

 

[Sebago Son]

I think that you'll find that flame cutting, endshake and forcing cone erosion are all part of the game with hot, high intensity magnum rounds. The same complaint has been leveled against the 29, 57, 629, 58, 657 and in fact the 28 and 27 as well.

If anything these are issues of how any revolver works, not an indemnification of the K-Mags.

But set all of that aside. I ask, if there was some serious, terminal compatibility issues between the .357 and the K-frame, why did it take from 1955 until 1999 for the problem to "kill off" the Combat Magnum platform?

 

[Dpris]

It's quite true that the K-Frame .357s were NOT intended to be fired endlessly with full-bore magnum loads.
This was understood from Jordan (who practiced with .38s & carried .357s for serious purpoeses, as most of us did) on when he helped bring the first Model 19 about.

This is not Internet legend.
The K-Frame .357s were developed prior to the advent of the hotter 125s that came about in the '70s (which were hard on them), and even with the older 158s they were never expected to hold up indefinitely like the N-Frames pretty much did.
Denis

 

[Warren Sear]

I bought my first revolver, a new Model 19, a loading press, and a set of 357 Magnum dies in the spring of 1980, and started shooting my own handloads. Unfortunately, I was using the now infamous Speer loading manual and a ridiculous charge of Blue Dot. In short order it had bulged cylinders and a split forcing cone. S&W fixed it under warranty, but it was my fault, even though I was using a "listed load" from a credible (or so I thought at the time) publisher.

So, yes, split forcing cones and bulged cylinders do occur.

 

[Sebago Son]

... On that I am afraid we will have to respectfully disagree.

 

[M29since14]

Here is my experience:
bulged .357 cylinders = 1
cracked forcing cones = 1
bulged .22 Jet cylinders = 3

I have been around a lot more 19s and 66s than I have 53s. I'm sure I haven't seen as many guns as an S&W armorer or warranty repair gunsmith, but I have seen lots and lots of guns over 40-years of shooting revolvers.

I would not worry too much about that problem, but like anything else, it pays to spend some time and carefully check out any used gun you plan to buy. As someone said earlier, it will be hard to spot a slightly bulged cylinder without measuring tools.

 

[Nightowl]

A year or so ago I saw a 25-5 with a bulged cylinder. I would have thought that it would have blown the cylinder stop notch as well, but it didn't. The gun store owner told me the owner was known to shoot heavy loads in his Ruger. Probably shot some of these heavy Ruger only loads in the Smith and bulged the chamber.