Canted, over clocked barrels

What surprises me is the number of web threads about the barrel clocking issue. Everyone sends them back, but you would think enough of them had been returned that S&W would address the issue at the factory.

What surprises me is the number of people that don't look for this BEFORE paying for their firearm.

Even if it's internet sale, you can almost always contact the seller and request a picture facing the barrel. Buying from a LGS and discovering it after the fact is inexcusable.

This defect is pretty obvious, unlike an internal, non-visible one.
 
What surprises me is the number of people that don't look for this BEFORE paying for their firearm.

Even if it's internet sale, you can almost always contact the seller and request a picture facing the barrel. Buying from a LGS and discovering it after the fact is inexcusable.

This defect is pretty obvious, unlike an internal, non-visible one.
I own my mistakes. In my haste to get one I didn't notice. I take responsibility on my actions. Having a majority collection of semis and new to the revolver game I took certain things for granted. It's a learning curve for sure. However I won't let it ruin the new found love I have for revolvers. Next time I'll be better prepared
 
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Now don't laugh---I am asking a serious question here--I wonder where this gun would shoot too? and with that thought in mind, what did the "test fire", "collect the case" techy,do when he fired this gun?

Clearly S&W has a serious problem here, and clearly S&W does not care. They are letting the customer do the quality inspection for them. If we quit being customers, who is going to do this service for them?
 
I asked my buddy who owns a high volume LGS if they noticed a problem with timing of new 7 shot S&W revolvers. They said they rarely see a timing problem on the 6 shot and 8 shot S&Ws, but frequently see 7 shot Smiths with bad timing that they send back to the distributor for replacement. They said they see it surprisingly often lately.
ONE WOULD THINK THAT FACED WITH THIS VOLUME OF GUNS RETURNED FOR THE SAME ISSUE, THAT S&W WOULD MAKE A CONCERTED EFFORT TO PINPOINT THE EXACT SOURCE OF THE PROBLEM--A PERSON OR PERSONS, A MACHINE, LACK OF QC, WHATEVER--AND CORRECT IT. THAT WOULD SAVE EVERYONE A WHOLE LOT OF GRIEF. ONE OF OUR FORUM MEMBERS WITH KNOWLEDGE OF THE MANUFACTURING STEPS COULD VENTURE AN EDUCATED GUESS, I'M SURE. I HAVE TWO 7 SHOT 686s. TIMING APPEARS TO BE GOOD ON EACH……….
 
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The image of the 629 above illustrates a serious cant. However, I wonder what the actual rate of returns is, and what is the acceptable specification.

Face it, most of us on this forum are pretty particular when it comes to our guns and probably notice things that many others would not. Combine that with only reports of problems in the absence of satisfied reports, and you have an echo chamber.

I am not saying a cant is not a serious problem if found - and the 629 above is pretty severe - but I have a lot of revolvers from Smith, and none of them have a cant that I notice. Now, if I were to take a protractor and start measuring, would some be off "true north?" Maybe.

But my gut tells me the magnitude of the problem is not commensurate with the attention it receives.
 
I own my mistakes. In my haste to get one I didn't notice. I take responsibility on my actions. Having a majority collection of semis and new to the revolver game I took certain things for granted. It's a learning curve for sure. However I won't let it ruin the new found love I have for revolvers. Next time I'll be better prepared

No disrespect intended, at all.

If I had a dime for every time that I bought something, got home, looked at it and/or tired to use it and found something wrong…

I would be a wealthy man.

Like you, I only make that mistake once. I'm guessing that you will inspect your next revolver with a microscope :) And, the great thing about S&W is, they will make it right. And, the best part is that you got yourself a GREAT revolver that will give you many years of faithful service.

Be careful with revolvers… they are addicting. Another mistake that I am learning the hard way :)
 
Funny this thread came about. Saturday morning myself and a good friend drove about 230 miles one way to a very well stocked gun shop. I was after a 327-TRR8 or M&P R8-did not matter which one. Friend wanted a 986. They had 4 986's on hand. They had one in the display case and 3 in the vault. First 2 we looked at both had canted barrels and 1 of them the timing was off. The 3rd out of the vault was ok. They had 1 M&P R8 in the display case and 1 in the vault,looked this one over with a microscope and she was perfect.Shot the M&P yesterday and boy was it sweet! Hope to shoot friends 986 later this week.
 
Quick update: called S&W this morning to get it in for service. The guy who answered the phone was very polite. Had my shipping label in about 5 min. Got it boxed up and dropped it off at FedEx. Hopefully they are just as fast at the repair and sending back. I'll update more when it returns.
 
Sorry for those of you with the problem, but geez...another thing to worry about. I think I'll just ignore it. I hope I forget to check my own revolvers, but I probably won't :(
 
Their specs are.....

Their specs are +/- 5 degrees. If it's in that range it is 'in spec'. I think I could eyeball better than that. Of course it would be too expensive to put an indexing mark on the frame and barrel. I'm glad to hear of a lot of NON canted barrels. It seemed like an epidemic. I'm not knocking S&W either but if a quality gun manufacturer can't screw a barrel on straight, something is definitely WRONG!:(
 
I have bought well over a dozen new and used S&W revolvers over the last 6 months. Mostly new. I have not had any canted barrel issues. I have no doubt this problem exists, because forum members post here having this problem.

But think about it this way. People who have problems are the loudest. When someone here buys a new S&W revolver and the barrel is NOT canted, they don't write a post reporting their barrel is installed correctly. So we don't hear about that. We do here from the folks that have a problem. These posts are rare as well. I suspect the percentage of guns that leave the factory with a canted barrel is quite small. A fraction of 1%...something like 0.0001% is my guess.

This is not to say S&W does not have some serious QC problems. I have bought a total of five new 7-shot 357 L Frames over the last six months. Three of the five had bad timing and had to go back for repair. Not good. S&W fixed them quickly and shipping both ways, so no biggie. Just annyoing to have to send a brand new gun back for repair, and even more annoying to have to do it 3 times in a row in a two month period.

I asked my buddy who owns a high volume LGS if they noticed a problem with timing of new 7 shot S&W revolvers. They said they rarely see a timing problem on the 6 shot and 8 shot S&Ws, but frequently see 7 shot Smiths with bad timing that they send back to the distributor for replacement. They said they see it surprisingly often lately.

The timing or "carry up" drama with the seven shot models is there's very little engagement of the extractor periphery with the cylinder recess. There's only one driving surface! The rest of the "fingers" don't help move the cylinder along. There has to be some allowance (versus tolerance) between the two parts, but without backup, the one finger can easily push off a little and retard timing. Usually OK with cartridges in the cylinder.

I have also recently selected a 986. It was the display model and had some shop wear, but was the only one of 4 in stock that had decent timing and a reasonably clocked barrel. One was terrible on both counts! Paid more than what can be had on the internet, but at least it passed my inspection first. Worth the extra expense, methinks.
 
Their specs are +/- 5 degrees. If it's in that range it is 'in spec'. I think I could eyeball better than that. Of course it would be too expensive to put an indexing mark on the frame and barrel. I'm glad to hear of a lot of NON canted barrels. It seemed like an epidemic. I'm not knocking S&W either but if a quality gun manufacturer can't screw a barrel on straight, something is definitely WRONG!:(

Ugh, I hope you're wrong about the +/- 5 degrees being "in spec". I got a label from Smith first thing this morning, and dropped off the 640 at FedEx pretty soon after that. I did have a nice chat with the guy who answered their CS line, we talked range visits and general shooting for a bit, hopefully it's a good sign that the 640 will come back all straightened out as others have. He did tell me about canted barrels and tolerances, but I insisted that it wasn't good form to have a sight leaning to the left that should be straight up and down.
 
With that barrel on that 629 so badly over torqued I would of looked it over real good for a cracked frame .
 
Their specs are +/- 5 degrees. If it's in that range it is 'in spec'.

5-degrees is pretty gross. If that is indeed in "spec", then they have a serious quality problem. I think even a gun buying novice would see a 5-degree cant and wonder what is going on.
 
5-degrees is pretty gross. If that is indeed in "spec", then they have a serious quality problem. I think even a gun buying novice would see a 5-degree cant and wonder what is going on.
Well how about their specs for barrel/cylinder gap of up to .012 ?
 
I love my new 629. I make a post about it. Bought it brand new from my LGS in the 27th. Wish I had looked it over better but had I turned it away idk when I would have seen another one. Anyway I'm staying positive S&W will make it right.

I looked at almost a dozen new 629 Classics at various local LGS over a 2 year period in a vain attempt to purchase a new one. They all had canted barrels up to and including ones as bad as yours. I gave up and bought a used 629-3 on Gunbroker.

I ordered a model 63 with a 5 inch barrel just about the time they stopped offering that size. It took 3 months for my LGS found one, and when it came in the barrel was canted, the rear sight leaf was twisted to align with the front sight and the frame of the gun was not polished. I sent it S&W to correct these issues and the did.
 
I own my mistakes. In my haste to get one I didn't notice. I take responsibility on my actions. Having a majority collection of semis and new to the revolver game I took certain things for granted. It's a learning curve for sure. However I won't let it ruin the new found love I have for revolvers. Next time I'll be better prepared
I had never heard of the canted barrel until after I bought 2 or 3 revolvers. All of mine are okay. I cut my teeth on semis, too, and getting into revolvers has been fun but educational in a way I didn't expect.
 
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