CCW/CDL, practice & training

[fredj338]

1. Just the CCW class, practice at least once a month
2. Just the CCW, rarely practice.
3. Just the CCW, practice more than once a month.
4. Advanced training, practice at least once a month.
5. Advanced training, rarely practice.
6. Advanced training, practice more than once a month.
LEO can also answer he poll. Thx!

 

[e3mrk]

My Kid's and I make a day of it at the Range(My Kid's are all over 21 and still like to hang with Dad). Plus I get a lot of free Brass.

 

[Grayfox]

7. Other
I shoot IDPA.

 

[Rastoff]

Advanced training and lots of practice. I also teach the same.

People say that you will default to your level of training when under stress. That's not exactly correct. You'll default to whatever you practice. You may have good training, but if you don't practice it, you'll have little to default to and it may be some bad habit.

Neither does practice make perfect. Only perfect practice can make perfect.

So, find a good training class. Pay close attention and take notes. Then practice what you're taught not what you think you learned. The practice does not need to be extreme. It just needs the right motions. Dry practice is really important.

 

[RobzGuns]

Advanced training and monthly Practical Shooting matches.
The outdoor range I use lets me use the 'CHL Bay' to practice shooting on the move, from concealment and other 'non-standard' positions.

 

[Protected One]

Neither does practice make perfect. Only perfect practice can make perfect.

Or put another way: Pratice makes permanent, so make sure you practice the right things. [a lesson from golf]

 

[bhayles]

Neither does practice make perfect. Only perfect practice can make perfect.

Extended quote:

Practice doesn't make perfect. Practice makes PERMANENT. Perfect practice makes perfect.

 

[Rastoff]

Or put another way: Pratice makes permanent, so make sure you practice the right things. [a lesson from golf]

Golf or not, I like this. Well said.

 

[fredj338]

7. Other
I shoot IDPA.

I consider that practice if shot with your carry gear.

I am sort of amazed that 265+ have looked at this & only 29 voted?? I am not sure how to read into those numbers. The points made training & practice are very valid. I wanted to see how many think that the basic ccw class was enough, & it's not, & if those with advanced training & rarely practice think that's enough, & it's not.

I instruct & compete. Shooting skills degrade rather rapidly. IME, you need to have meaningful practice once a month JUST to hold onto what you have. If you want to improve, that needs to move to once a week. Shooting at rocks & cans isn't going to get it done either. The practice has to be meaningful, with a touch of stress if possible. Training w/o practice is almost useless. You'll know what to do but not have the skills to do it.
For me, IDPA is a great practice format. Shoot it the way you want, regardless of the score or timer. Use the gear you want, as long as it's safe. The club I shoot allows just about anything for a local club match, as long as it's safe. So LEO or civ ccw, get out & shoot your gear. It's not likely you'll ever be involved in a shooting, but if it does happen, you'll only get that one chance to win.

 

[Rastoff]

I am sort of amazed that 265+ have looked at this & only 29 voted?? I am not sure how to read into those numbers.

Nothing to read into. This is the nature of a poll on a forum like this. The thing about any poll is that any non-response tells you nothing. Maybe they just didn't feel like it. Maybe they're on a phone and it's too small to see or make a selection. Maybe they don't agree with the choices. Who knows? You can't make any assumptions because people didn't vote.

All you can do is use the actual data you did collect.

 

[Rastoff]

I just did a real quick comparison between posts and views. What I discovered didn't surprise me. On average there are 3% posts to 97% views. The older a thread gets, the lower the percentage of posts is.

Yeah, the number of votes vs views in this case doesn't surprise me at all. Actually the vote rate of 11% is much better than the average post rate.

 

[tops]

I consider that practice if shot with your carry gear.

I am sort of amazed that 265+ have looked at this & only 29 voted?

Shooting at rocks & cans isn't going to get it done either.
.

I didn't vote because you didn't list my practice. I use a .22 because it is cheaper than real bullets. The trigger pulls the same on my M34 as it does on my M36. A M17 is the same as a M19. There isn't a .22 instead of my M27 or M29 so I just have to fake it. I like to shoot rocks and cans and to me it's just another kind of target. In the summer I ride around the edge of fields and shoot the leaves on weeds so there is not a mess to clean up. I also use B34 targets. About 1/2 of my shooting is elbow bent from the hip at up to 20 feet. I usually shoot 5 or 10 boxes of .22s and 1 box of real bullets a week. It may not be practice but it keeps me amused. Larry

 

[fredj338]

I didn't vote because you didn't list my practice. I use a .22 because it is cheaper than real bullets. The trigger pulls the same on my M34 as it does on my M36. A M17 is the same as a M19. There isn't a .22 instead of my M27 or M29 so I just have to fake it. I like to shoot rocks and cans and to me it's just another kind of target. In the summer I ride around the edge of fields and shoot the leaves on weeds so there is not a mess to clean up. I also use B34 targets. About 1/2 of my shooting is elbow bent from the hip at up to 20 feet. I usually shoot 5 or 10 boxes of .22s and 1 box of real bullets a week. It may not be practice but it keeps me amused. Larry

I didn't define practice, that is for you to determine.
Many that carry, including LE, rarely or NEVER practice. That is kinda of scary considering the consequence of carrying a gun for SD. Not unlike learning to drive, then never driving, then getting tossed into LA traffic.

 

[fredj338]

Nothing to read into. This is the nature of a poll on a forum like this. The thing about any poll is that any non-response tells you nothing. Maybe they just didn't feel like it. Maybe they're on a phone and it's too small to see or make a selection. Maybe they don't agree with the choices. Who knows? You can't make any assumptions because people didn't vote.

All you can do is use the actual data you did collect.

Why I said I wasn't sure what it meant. You are right, many will enter a post then not care to or about the responses.

 

[Rastoff]

I didn't vote because you didn't list my practice. I use a .22 because it is cheaper than real bullets.

First of all, .22s are real bullets. They still kill. Secondly, any trigger time is good practice as long as you're using the proper technique.

In fact, I'm a huge fan of dry practice. The best shooters in the world all do dry practice a lot. So, using a .22 is just as good as anything else. Yes, they're cheaper so, you can shoot more. Don't sell yourself short.

 

[mc5aw]

Anyone voting #2 should rethink their respective abilities with minimal practice.

 

[fredj338]

Anyone voting #2 should rethink their respective abilities with minimal practice.

OR #5 for that matter. Training w/o practice is almost pointless. You'll never develop your skills enough to take advantage of the training.
My point of this poll was to get those that don't get training or don't practice, thinking about reevaluatING that stance. I am happy to see about 50% so far taking ccw serious enough to devote the necessary time & $$ to being better than competent.

 

[Rastoff]

Any training without regular practice to follow it up is marginal at best.

 

[fredj338]

First of all, .22s are real bullets. They still kill. Secondly, any trigger time is good practice as long as you're using the proper technique.

In fact, I'm a huge fan of dry practice. The best shooters in the world all do dry practice a lot. So, using a .22 is just as good as anything else. Yes, they're cheaper so, you can shoot more. Don't sell yourself short.

Dry practice only gets you so far though. It improves your gun handling skills, but you can only replicate recoil & transitions with live ammo. So at some point, you have to get to the range & put rounds on something.

 

[Rastoff]

Dry practice only gets you so far though. It improves your gun handling skills, but you can only replicate recoil & transitions with live ammo. So at some point, you have to get to the range & put rounds on something.

You'll get no argument from me on that score. Live fire is a must.

My point about dry practice is that most don't do it at all. People are under the illusion that live fire is the only way to practice. I hear all the time, "It's too expensive to shoot that much." Yes, shooting is expensive. Even so, you don't have to shoot 100 rounds every week to remain proficient. 15 minutes of dry practice every other day, combined with 50 rounds a month at the range should be enough to keep you sharp.

Also, I would suggest a different practice regimen. I think it is more effective to shoot...
100 rounds once a month than 600 every six months.
Better yet is 2 magazines a week rather than 100 rounds a month.
15 minutes of dry practice three times a week is better than 2 hours once a month.

By breaking your practice sessions down into short chunks, they become more effective. They also become easier to do and you'll be less likely to put them off.

 

[fredj338]

I agree Rastoff, but I don't even think you need even 15min a day of dry fire. 5min doing presentations & mag changes a day is plenty. Then shoot every week if possible. You are correct, 100rds a week is better than 400rds a month, especially if you break it down to meaningful practice. I am amazed, for instance, how many shooters at our club will tell me they have never fired their weapon weak hand only or shot while on the move. I know something like IDPA is not training, but take your training & go shoot an IDPA match, it is great practice.

 

[throwin' copper]

I go to a carbine and/or pistol class once a month. It's NOT a high end/expensive class the likes of Travis Haley, Larry Vickers, Pat Rogers, Kyle Lamb, etc conduct though. We do carbine to pistol transitions, shooting while moving toward a cover, and engaging multiple targets...FUN...and I do my best to practice at the range at least twice a month. I don't do competitions.

 

[GerSan69]

I'm only retired 7 months, so I haven't figured out yet what I'd be training for.

 

[fredj338]

I'm only retired 7 months, so I haven't figured out yet what I'd be training for.

If you had decent handgun training, then you have been trained. For the vast majority of civ ccw, they have had zero training. A ccw class is like zero +1, not much.

 

[mc5aw]

One area of training and practice that is significantly overlooked/ignored is unholstering and reholstering a concealed firearm. Easy at the range ... much more difficult under duress.

 

[bhayles]

I'm only retired 7 months, so I haven't figured out yet what I'd be training for.

Zombies. Don't you watch "The Undead" or whatever its called? My teenager recently brought this danger to my attention...

 

[Smoke]

I’ve discussed my situation on this forum numerous times.
Finances are such that I can’t really afford to go to the range except for training events. My church pays for professional training for security volunteers roughly every other month.

When I can’t get to the range I do dry fire drills with a Laser Lyte trainer at least once a week and I have seen my marksmanship skill improve noticeably since I started doing it.

 

[Rastoff]

I agree Rastoff, but I don't even think you need even 15min a day of dry fire. 5min doing presentations & mag changes a day is plenty.

Certainly. This is why I said only a few times a week.

Any practice is better than no practice as long as it's performed properly.

 

[GerSan69]

If you had decent handgun training, then you have been trained. For the vast majority of civ ccw, they have had zero training. A ccw class is like zero +1, not much.

35 years' worth of quarterly qualifications, in-service classes, entire weeks of shooting, etc, etc. I don't feel under-trained, don't think there's such a thing as over-trained.... I'm just in that post-retirement limbo, that's all.

 

[fredj338]

35 years' worth of quarterly qualifications, in-service classes, entire weeks of shooting, etc, etc. I don't feel under-trained, don't think there's such a thing as over-trained.... I'm just in that post-retirement limbo, that's all.

Compare your exp with the guy that takes a 4hr class, 50rds & is now in public thinking they are competent to carry. Right now the poll is pretty evenly split between the serious ccw, probably capable of defending themselves, & the person carrying a gun as a placebo to self defense.
I hope the other 50% take notice, go take at least one advanced handgun class. For the trained that rarely practice, you are only slightly above the others. Good training is invaluable, but you need the skill set to follow thru with it.