tripledipper
Member
In some states "acting in concert" allows a person to be as guilty as the one who actually committed the crime. In certain circles, this whole drama would be dismissed as "nora nora". Adios, Troy.
Cop Killer finally gets Justice
- Thread starter Waltherman
- Start date
I didn't mean that would have been involved in the murder of the police officer - They would be responsible for the execution of an *innocent* man by lying in a capitol crime trial. Seems to me that that's murder.
I'd also like to be clear that I don't think that ANYONE involved in carrying out a lawful order is guilty of anything - Only those that lied during the trial.
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James Byrd's killer was executed in Texas. I wonder if the folks against the death penalty feel the same way about him?
http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/21/justice/texas-dragging-death-execution/index.html?iref=allsearch
http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/21/justice/texas-dragging-death-execution/index.html?iref=allsearch
Steve in Vermont
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Thanks for posting this Redlevel. Most of the people arguing against the death penalty use cases like this by blurring, ignoring and manipulating facts years after the offense. Numerous people have looked at this case after the conviction and reached the same conclusion. He was guilty.
I live in Atlanta and have followed this case for some time and even though there was no direct concrete evidence there was enough for a jury to convict him...Davis was envolved in another shooting that night and the shell casings from that shooting and the officers matched so I believe they got the right man and he got what was coming to him even if it is 20 years too late giving people like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson TV face time to play the race card.....
But here is the problem I have with the death penalty, it doesn't seem to be handed out equally across the board because people like Wayne Williams (the Atlanta child murderer) is still alive and will live in jail the rest of his life and if anyone should have been exterminated it is him....
Jeffrey Dahmer should have gotten the death penalty but got life in prison but thank God another con took him out and we are still hearing from Charles Manson who should also be dead way before now...
Personally I think leathal injection is way too easy of a way out and the death penalty doesn't prevent future crime at all... Clayton County deputy Rick Daly was shot and killed by a 16 year old kid here recently and that punk wasn't thinking about getting a needle when he pulled the trigger on officer Daly...
I really think the absolute worst punishment would be what Eric Robert Rudolph got...If I knew that I had to be in a 8 x 10 cell 23 hours a day forever and have no hope of ever seeing another sun up without bars in front of it THAT would be much worse than a little needle stick and go nighty night to me...
But here is the problem I have with the death penalty, it doesn't seem to be handed out equally across the board because people like Wayne Williams (the Atlanta child murderer) is still alive and will live in jail the rest of his life and if anyone should have been exterminated it is him....
Jeffrey Dahmer should have gotten the death penalty but got life in prison but thank God another con took him out and we are still hearing from Charles Manson who should also be dead way before now...
Personally I think leathal injection is way too easy of a way out and the death penalty doesn't prevent future crime at all... Clayton County deputy Rick Daly was shot and killed by a 16 year old kid here recently and that punk wasn't thinking about getting a needle when he pulled the trigger on officer Daly...
I really think the absolute worst punishment would be what Eric Robert Rudolph got...If I knew that I had to be in a 8 x 10 cell 23 hours a day forever and have no hope of ever seeing another sun up without bars in front of it THAT would be much worse than a little needle stick and go nighty night to me...
geoff40
Member
I think the death penalty should be revised in all 50 States.
1. No death penalty allowed when there is only circumstantial evidence in the specific case. The burden of proof must be higher than that. Scott Peterson, in California, is an example of a recent case where there is circumstantial evidence only, yet he got a death sentence. In his case (california) everyone knows he will never be executed, but the sentence he got is still wrong. IMO anyway.
2. After someone is given a death sentence, an independent review of the entire case should be required, done within 1 year by an unbiased, all citizen board, to see if they agree with the penalty, or if they think it is inappropriate for any reason with the particular case. This board could be chosen, seated, and paid for pretty much like our jury system is used. Neither the defense or the prosecution can participate in board selection, it is done independently of the biases of either side.
3. If the board finds circumstances they don't like, they have the power to commute the sentence to life without parole. Period. End of story.
4. If they find nothing object to, that the laws have been adhered to all the way through, sentence is to be carried out within 30 days of their decision. No more 20+ years of waiting for justice.
1. No death penalty allowed when there is only circumstantial evidence in the specific case. The burden of proof must be higher than that. Scott Peterson, in California, is an example of a recent case where there is circumstantial evidence only, yet he got a death sentence. In his case (california) everyone knows he will never be executed, but the sentence he got is still wrong. IMO anyway.
2. After someone is given a death sentence, an independent review of the entire case should be required, done within 1 year by an unbiased, all citizen board, to see if they agree with the penalty, or if they think it is inappropriate for any reason with the particular case. This board could be chosen, seated, and paid for pretty much like our jury system is used. Neither the defense or the prosecution can participate in board selection, it is done independently of the biases of either side.
3. If the board finds circumstances they don't like, they have the power to commute the sentence to life without parole. Period. End of story.
4. If they find nothing object to, that the laws have been adhered to all the way through, sentence is to be carried out within 30 days of their decision. No more 20+ years of waiting for justice.
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Armyphotog
Member
Well, I'm 3rd generation law enforcement, and I just don't know. After 22 years, I don't see that a little more time would have made that much difference to make sure that JUSTICE (whatever that means these days?) was truly done.
Dennis The B
US Veteran
1. Not every murder case has direct evidence. Circumstantial evidence means that each bit of evidence, taken in its entirety, adds up to guilt. Guilt in any criminal matter requires guilt beyond reasonable doubt, not all doubt.
2. The appeals process, through state and Federal courts is what's accomplished in most every capital murder case in states which have the death penalty. What you are proposing is a complete shortcut of the judicial process. Most states have a mandatory appeal in capital cases.
3. Just what makes some "panel" any less biased than the prosecutor or someone associated with the trial? The prosecutor, judge, defense attorney, and accused went through a public trial. I don't know how you can assume the "panel" will be more thorough than the trial and evidentiary process. To toss out a jury's verdict, would be the ultimate injustice, just to satisfy some "unbiased all citizen board". Just what do you think the jury is?
4. It's not the fault of anyone, except the process, that these appeals take so long. The trial attorneys seldom handle appeals. So, the appeals attorney(s) have to review everything that was presented at trial, while preparing the mandatory appeals. Appeals courts are overwhelmed with cases. Even during appeals, errors and omissions from the trial may or may not, be included/excluded.
We have the worst judicial system in the world, except for every other country.
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Duke426
Member
One less pimple on the posterior of society - make that two less as the same thing applies to the lowlife in Texas.
sigp220.45
US Veteran
Saint Troy shot someone else earlier that night, and was convicted of that shooting. The casings recovered in that shooting matched the casing recovered at the scene of the officer's murder.
Plenty of reliable witnesses put him there, shooting the officer in the face.
This case has been appealed all the way up to the Supreme Court. All found he had a fair trial with plenty of evidence of guilt.
Recanted witness testimony is common, and given appropriate weight on appeal.
He did it, he's dead. God Bless the family of Mark MacPhail, who was only trying to keep a homeless guy from being beaten to death.
Plenty of reliable witnesses put him there, shooting the officer in the face.
This case has been appealed all the way up to the Supreme Court. All found he had a fair trial with plenty of evidence of guilt.
Recanted witness testimony is common, and given appropriate weight on appeal.
He did it, he's dead. God Bless the family of Mark MacPhail, who was only trying to keep a homeless guy from being beaten to death.
No. He was entirely responsible for his own crimes. He was a grown man and not a minor child when he committed the crimes of which he was accused and for which he was convicted. The assumed/suppose or actual failure(s) of his parents or the problems of his family of origin are not relevant to his conviction. Doubtless those matters were brought in at sentencing, but carried no weight either in the initial decision or subsequent review. Justice was served.
I read somewheres that Australia, (i think); will try and DIS prove a persons guilt after they have been sentenced to death. If they dont find anything, he's toast, if they do he's re sentenced.
Secondly, I for one was raised to obey the laws of our land, either written or verbal. Officer Mcfail represented the law and his orders should have been followed. To act in an aggressive manner toward a person of the law attempting to restore order and safety is a crime in itself, in my book, and lends vorasity to the guilt of the defendant.
Secondly, I for one was raised to obey the laws of our land, either written or verbal. Officer Mcfail represented the law and his orders should have been followed. To act in an aggressive manner toward a person of the law attempting to restore order and safety is a crime in itself, in my book, and lends vorasity to the guilt of the defendant.
Armyphotog
Member
Maybe the media needs to be on trial. I've been reading some more of the comments and this is the first time I've heard about any other shooting earlier in the night, prior to the police officer getting shot. Why hasn't the media presented a complete picture? I don't see how anybody can form an "informed" opinion when facts are withheld by the press.
geoff40
Member
If you do a little digging on the web and look up "wrongful executions in the USA" you will find some interesting reading. I don't profess all of what you'll see is true, but I think a good portion of it is, some of it is absolutely true. It is very disturbing stuff, accepting the execution of just 1 innocent for any reason morally wrong. Beyond reasonable doubt is not enough when it comes to taking a life in the name of justice.
I repeat I am not anti death penalty at all, quite to the contrary.
That's my opinion. You don't have to like it.
I repeat I am not anti death penalty at all, quite to the contrary.
That's my opinion. You don't have to like it.
mac2
Member
Off thread, but what I find ironic especially given the way the Soviets were, is the fact that Russia has all but got rid of the DP and working towards total abolition, whilst the US seems to be moving in the opposite direction.
mac2
Member
Australia got rid of the DP in the 60s
It must be remembered that those cleared by DNA were likely involved and only had the fortune to be the one caught. I have told this before but I worked a case a many years back where a man raped and killed a lady. Eyewitnesses and finger identified a subject and finger prints in and aorund the home matched his. He was tried, convicted and sentenced to die. After years of proclaiming innocence, his DNA was matched against that found on the deceased. He was released from prison. It was a fact he was there at the time the crimes were committed but the rape was not done by him. DNA freed a man that was there and took part in the crime. Now anti DP folks point to his case and others to show we execute the wrong people.
In the case at hand, the jury heard the evidence and found him guilty. In his final statements, he said he was not the killer and did not have THE gun. That tells me he knew who killed the officer and that he just was not the shooter. Fair enough. He was there, he took part so he should have got executed.
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