So I'm a relatively new shooter. I purchased a 9mm Shield at the beginning of the year and I've been going to the range regularly (once or twice a month). I've been watching numerous training videos such as Magpul Dynamics: Art of the Dynamic Handgun with Chris Costa and Travis Haley. I know that's not considered formal training, but hey, whatever works. The reason for my purchase was for self defense. I'm 23 years old and I am a pizza delivery driver and after hearing of a local robbery in which the driver actually fired her weapon and successfully neutralized the threat, I decided it was time for me to follow suit. I applied for and received my concealed carry permit and I've carried every day for the past 9 months. I also have a full size M&P 9mm on layaway. Anyway, there's some background information on me. In every single video, instructional article, thread post, magazine article, etc. I've read that the correct sight picture is front sight, front sight, front sight. Everything should be blurry except for that front sight. However, that does not work for me. I don't know why or how I started doing this, but I focus on the target. Everything is blurry except for the target. That's just the way my eyes see things. I've talked to and shot with my father-in-law who is a police officer and he says that whatever works for me that I should just keep doing what I'm doing. And it does work for me. I hit what I'm aiming for and I'm accurate. From all of the things I've learned about firearms, I've picked up the fact that pretty much everything is based on personal preference. I'm just wondering if that is one of those things that is personal preference or if it's cemented-in-concrete-law when it comes to shooting.
Correct sight picture.
- Thread starter drewjames91
- Start date
Register to hide this ad
Hang-Fire Hank
Member
PRACTICE
Drew: If you'll be shooting within...say...12' & the attacker's moving toward you, then you won't have time to bring the pistol up to eye height to find the front sight. See the target, point the pistol at center mass, & FIRE to stop the attack. Important, however, that you PRACTICE that kind of "point shooting". For some (maybe you), it comes natural. Others don't have a natural feel for where the pistol is pointing when held down low. As someone pointed out in a different thread, HITTING the attacker on the 1st & if necessary the 2nd shot is CRUCIAL!
Hitting a smaller object &/or at a farther distance generally requires more accuracy and THEN seeing the front sight becomes very important. Practice both & force yourself to see that front sight for a distant shot. If it's blurry, consult an optometrist. You may be far-sighted & need corrective glasses
Hank M.
NRA Pistol Instructor
Drew: If you'll be shooting within...say...12' & the attacker's moving toward you, then you won't have time to bring the pistol up to eye height to find the front sight. See the target, point the pistol at center mass, & FIRE to stop the attack. Important, however, that you PRACTICE that kind of "point shooting". For some (maybe you), it comes natural. Others don't have a natural feel for where the pistol is pointing when held down low. As someone pointed out in a different thread, HITTING the attacker on the 1st & if necessary the 2nd shot is CRUCIAL!
Hitting a smaller object &/or at a farther distance generally requires more accuracy and THEN seeing the front sight becomes very important. Practice both & force yourself to see that front sight for a distant shot. If it's blurry, consult an optometrist. You may be far-sighted & need corrective glasses
Hank M.
NRA Pistol Instructor
scooter123
Member
If you do some digging on Target Focused Shooting you'll find that there is actually a counter to that Front Sight Focus nonsense. Yeah, I did say Nonsense. The problem with focusing on the front sight is that it causes you to follow the front sight during recoil. As a result you have to re-acquire your sighting point on your target after every shot, which costs TIME. In addition it also means that you won't focus your vision on the exact same point on the target and that degrades accuracy.
With Target Focused Shooting your gaze remains fixed on your target and as soon as the sights come into acceptable alignment you can then release another shot. If you check with competitors in shooting sports such as IDPA you'll find that the ones who do really well tend to be Target Focused shooters and if you check with local PD Firearms Training Officers you will find the same technique being taught. Because while it may seem less accurate when done properly it can result in a higher rate of fire with very little loss in accuracy.
Yeah, I'm a Target Focused Shooter. Have been since I lost the ability to focus on handgun sights. Back in 2008 when I was taking a class taught by a local PD Firearms Instructor I told him I couldn't focus in handgun sights at the start of the class and his reply was that was a good thing. Because what he taught was Target Focused and I wouldn't have any bad habits to break. I finished that class with a .39 second split while holding a 5 inch group at 30 yards, which the instructor declared was "perfectly adequate".
With Target Focused Shooting your gaze remains fixed on your target and as soon as the sights come into acceptable alignment you can then release another shot. If you check with competitors in shooting sports such as IDPA you'll find that the ones who do really well tend to be Target Focused shooters and if you check with local PD Firearms Training Officers you will find the same technique being taught. Because while it may seem less accurate when done properly it can result in a higher rate of fire with very little loss in accuracy.
Yeah, I'm a Target Focused Shooter. Have been since I lost the ability to focus on handgun sights. Back in 2008 when I was taking a class taught by a local PD Firearms Instructor I told him I couldn't focus in handgun sights at the start of the class and his reply was that was a good thing. Because what he taught was Target Focused and I wouldn't have any bad habits to break. I finished that class with a .39 second split while holding a 5 inch group at 30 yards, which the instructor declared was "perfectly adequate".
Cbollo
Member
I've heard all kinds of different things on how to aim a handgun. I'm right handed, and have always focused on aiming with my right eye and gun sights. I have an army buddy that swears by aiming with his off eye(he is R handed and aims with his left eye), which just doesn't feel right to me. Recently, I have been trying to use both. Focusing on the target with my left eye while keeping the gun sights superimposed over the target with my right. Not sure if its worth messing with, but I just started trying it out and it seems to work pretty well
Ranger17
Member
I only have a couple years shooting experience so didn't come into the game with habits good or bad. As the high % of my practice times have been at indoor ranges (most at a 10yd max) I've learned to do pretty well focusing on the front site.
Note that as a grandpa i also have 'old man eyes' lol and have to wear progressive bifocals (plus with add'l corrections for double vision). They definitely for me are either clear on the site or on the target.
But using the front site at these range/SD distances is good for me; i will be curious though when i get out on some family property and let some ammo fly at longer distances
(say to 25 yds) if i'll stick with front site or have to focus on the target.
Note that as a grandpa i also have 'old man eyes' lol and have to wear progressive bifocals (plus with add'l corrections for double vision). They definitely for me are either clear on the site or on the target.
But using the front site at these range/SD distances is good for me; i will be curious though when i get out on some family property and let some ammo fly at longer distances
(say to 25 yds) if i'll stick with front site or have to focus on the target.
You can focus on the front sight, but it takes training. The thing is throughout your life you have been throwing balls, i.e. baseballs, basketballs and footballs and looking at where you want the ball to end up. Shooting a handgun at any distance over 7 yds. requires you to look at the front sight to get reliable hits, as long as you have great trigger control (the gun doesn't move when the trigger is being manipulated). From 0-7 yards you can focus on the target and "point shoot" as long as you have great trigger control. So for self-defense, you should learn to shoot at longer distances than 7 yds. to develop great trigger control (errors show up at greater distances). You should also learn to draw and shoot (using an empty gun and dry firing is good for this). Always double check your firearm for empty for every dry firing training session. So the answer is, Yes you can learn to focus on the front sight and yes it is essential for shooting at distances greater than 7 yds. and shooting with the sights at greater distances will help you learn great trigger control. Learning to shoot a handgun well requires effort over an extended period of time.
V0OBWxZS16
Member
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2015
- Messages
- 504
- Reaction score
- 310
Focusing on the target instead of the front sight is a very common mistake. It's very easy to do and stress and reactive targets increase the temptation to do so. I've missed enough on falling steel during matches to prove that.
As soon as you are able please take a basic handgun course, if you haven't already, and then a defensive handgun course from a quality local firm or instructor. Follow up with low light handgun since you'll be delivering a lot after dark.* For practice at home, off the top of my head, I'm going to recommend dry firing against a blank wall so there's nothing to distract you from focusing on the front sight and trigger pull.
Your statement that you "I hit what I'm aiming for and I'm accurate" is useless. What hit percentage against what size targets at what ranges? The human body is not homogeneous and in self-defense much of it is of low value as a target for bullets. The high-value targets (vital organs) capable of causing rapid physical incapacitation are small relative to the size of the human torso. Using the sights will increase your accuracy significantly, which increases the chances of hitting something useful, which reduces the amount of time the assailant(s) have to harm you. Obviously, if you are forced to shoot from retention you take whatever hits you get.
* If you don't already have one get a good "tactical" flashlight and carry spare batteries with you.
As soon as you are able please take a basic handgun course, if you haven't already, and then a defensive handgun course from a quality local firm or instructor. Follow up with low light handgun since you'll be delivering a lot after dark.* For practice at home, off the top of my head, I'm going to recommend dry firing against a blank wall so there's nothing to distract you from focusing on the front sight and trigger pull.
Your statement that you "I hit what I'm aiming for and I'm accurate" is useless. What hit percentage against what size targets at what ranges? The human body is not homogeneous and in self-defense much of it is of low value as a target for bullets. The high-value targets (vital organs) capable of causing rapid physical incapacitation are small relative to the size of the human torso. Using the sights will increase your accuracy significantly, which increases the chances of hitting something useful, which reduces the amount of time the assailant(s) have to harm you. Obviously, if you are forced to shoot from retention you take whatever hits you get.
* If you don't already have one get a good "tactical" flashlight and carry spare batteries with you.
I see this like learning to hit a baseball. For most of us, the best way to become a good hitter is to learn how to swing the bat and see the ball in the classic tried and true method before you start switching hands and trying to drop a bunt down the third base line. Take your time and learn get the sight picture down and get repeatable shots on target before you start shooting with one hand and behind your back! You will never regret that you mastered the basics but you might regret it if you don't! Good luck!
Grey.Ghost
Member
My suggestion is to practice both. The more you practice both sight pictures the more likely you will be to apply the correct method to the proper circumstance. At short distances, and for self defense purposes, you will likely find yourself using the target focus. At longer distances, in competition, or at short distances where absolute dead nuts accuracy is required, you'll find yourself front sight focusing.
Once you are proficient with the basic principles of sight alignment and sight picture, you should switch your point of focus to the target IMO. I've been shooting iron sights with both eyes open for about 10 years now.
The target is clear while the sights are fuzzy......hasn't hurt my accuracy and it helps with speed shooting and multiple targets.
Good luck!!
The target is clear while the sights are fuzzy......hasn't hurt my accuracy and it helps with speed shooting and multiple targets.
Good luck!!
Target shooting and defensive shooting only have a couple things in common How you use the sights are not the same if your life is on the line at close ranges .
When shooting for group size when young and my eyes worked well all black sights were fine and I could move my focus quickly from sights to target , sorta? but shooting bvowling pins at 100 yards was doable .
As I get older an eyes don't adjust from close to distant with out tri-focals and a small green fiber optic is my front sight is my choice and shooting small groups is a thang of the past !
Defensive shooting is different , more of a look over the sights then on to the target and shoot , What I always considered aimed point shooting or a flash over the sights to see that the pistol is centered on the target in general and shoot your drills that way . Your not shooting a tight group but can be placed tight enough and can work with practice out to 12 yards for me for defensive needs .
Found this last week .
This video is from a Gunsite Academy instructor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fEE5GB-nu4
When shooting for group size when young and my eyes worked well all black sights were fine and I could move my focus quickly from sights to target , sorta? but shooting bvowling pins at 100 yards was doable .
As I get older an eyes don't adjust from close to distant with out tri-focals and a small green fiber optic is my front sight is my choice and shooting small groups is a thang of the past !
Defensive shooting is different , more of a look over the sights then on to the target and shoot , What I always considered aimed point shooting or a flash over the sights to see that the pistol is centered on the target in general and shoot your drills that way . Your not shooting a tight group but can be placed tight enough and can work with practice out to 12 yards for me for defensive needs .
Found this last week .
This video is from a Gunsite Academy instructor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fEE5GB-nu4
Goblin
Member
Welcome to the forum, and I salute your steps to protect yourself. You'll likely find out how much fun recreational shooting can be.
walkin' trails
Member
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2006
- Messages
- 1,173
- Reaction score
- 548
Drew,
Get yourself a copy of Andy Stanford's "Surgical Speed Shooting". Chapter 5 is on aiming and describes a target-focused shooting, but using the basic alignment of sights to index the pistol. I am an instructor and will start out new or poor pistol shooters with the fundamentals, which include proper sight alignment and picture (front sight focus) because I believe that they are the foundation to understanding how to properly shoot a handgun; but the fact of the matter is that the point shooting techniques have been used in combat successfully long before the training shift to modern technique. I am in the same boat as some of these other posters who are striving to find a happy medium between pistol sights and optical correction. My personal experience is currently leading me to more highly visible front sights backed by more subdued rears. Another author to study is the late Jim Cirillo, who flavored his instruction and writing with some exceptionally detailed recollections of real world deadly force encounters as an NYPD detective back in the 1960s. Jim was already an experienced shooter and one if his messages was that training will take over - if you are in the mindset to take training seriously in the first place. I would recommend that when you can, to take a basic pistol class followed by something more advanced. Be receptive to the tools the live instructors are offering, and then look for a good instructor who teaches target-focused shooting.
Get yourself a copy of Andy Stanford's "Surgical Speed Shooting". Chapter 5 is on aiming and describes a target-focused shooting, but using the basic alignment of sights to index the pistol. I am an instructor and will start out new or poor pistol shooters with the fundamentals, which include proper sight alignment and picture (front sight focus) because I believe that they are the foundation to understanding how to properly shoot a handgun; but the fact of the matter is that the point shooting techniques have been used in combat successfully long before the training shift to modern technique. I am in the same boat as some of these other posters who are striving to find a happy medium between pistol sights and optical correction. My personal experience is currently leading me to more highly visible front sights backed by more subdued rears. Another author to study is the late Jim Cirillo, who flavored his instruction and writing with some exceptionally detailed recollections of real world deadly force encounters as an NYPD detective back in the 1960s. Jim was already an experienced shooter and one if his messages was that training will take over - if you are in the mindset to take training seriously in the first place. I would recommend that when you can, to take a basic pistol class followed by something more advanced. Be receptive to the tools the live instructors are offering, and then look for a good instructor who teaches target-focused shooting.
Last edited:
blackhorse2010
Member
If you can keep your controlled pairs in a hand span sized group out to 20 yards you should be fine.
Although there are different sighting methods, there is no one perfect method for everyone due to physical limitations or whatever.
Hand span sized groups are a comfortable balance between accuracy and speed.
If your pairs are touching, speed things up.
If the group gets too big, slow down.
Although there are different sighting methods, there is no one perfect method for everyone due to physical limitations or whatever.
Hand span sized groups are a comfortable balance between accuracy and speed.
If your pairs are touching, speed things up.
If the group gets too big, slow down.
I need a dot optic to that now at 25 yards but I can still place all my rounds in a hand size target with my wifes 4.25 core and rmr as quickly as the slide settles an good control allows . That's like running steel plates ! But with open sites it would be more dumb luck to shot anything close to a group . Why I train as I do .
JMichaelTX
Member
Welcome to the forum from Texas. Just every so often here at home a pizza delivery person is robbed and sometimes assaulted and I always wondered why they do not carry a pistol to protect themselves.
It seems as though you have got many good suggestions as to sight pattern and different ways to sight your pistol. No use in me saying anything else along those lines. I commend you for getting your conceal carry license and good luck.
It seems as though you have got many good suggestions as to sight pattern and different ways to sight your pistol. No use in me saying anything else along those lines. I commend you for getting your conceal carry license and good luck.
