Telecaster
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If the gun just "went off," they should arrest the gun.
Dancing FBI agent in custody
- Thread starter Rpg
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nachogrande
Member
BETS ON THE VICTIMS APPEARANCE AT TRIAL?
Wheelchair, neck brace, seeing eye dog, a gaggle of poor/dirty looking waifs in tattered clothes?
Wheelchair, neck brace, seeing eye dog, a gaggle of poor/dirty looking waifs in tattered clothes?
Hillbilly77
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BETS ON THE VICTIMS APPEARANCE AT TRIAL?
Wheelchair, neck brace, seeing eye dog, a gaggle of poor/dirty looking waifs in tattered clothes?
How is any heat suddenly on the victim like he's pulling a scam?
He got shot due to the agent's negligence. He deserves restitution.
kwselke
Member
How is any heat suddenly on the victim like he's pulling a scam?
He got shot due to the agent's negligence. He deserves restitution.
He is quoted as saying that he does not want to ruin the agent's life and that he would like a call from him. He absolutely deserves free medical treatment including rehab if needed, lost wages if any, and a substantial award for his pain, suffering, and inconvenience. The bar is giving him free drinks for life. I bet he avoids dance night in the future. Oh yes, he should get a free new pair of pants to replace the ones with the hole and blood.
jag312
Member
I'm waiting for the blood alcohol result. I am surprised that the agant's blood sample wasn't put at the head of the line. Or that the agent wasn't told to blow into a Breathalyzer to get imme4diate results.
Chief Wiggums
Member
Good bye to the FBI career
hello private security
hello private security
venomballistics
Member
correct ... meanwhile, the dude that took a round in this is likely limited to fields that do not require standing or walking.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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He has only himself to blame.
Jack Flash
Member
I have been mulling this over for days and I have come to that conclusion as well.
If he had been a Mall Security Guard, everyone would be laughing at him and saying he should be banned from owning firearms. But he's not a Mall Cop, he's an FBI Agent, and should be held to a much higher standard. Drinking and clowning around in a crowded bar all while armed and obviously impaired doesn't meet the standard.
No schadenfreude here, I just hope he finds a good job he is suited to and has a productive life, after making restitution for his egregious behavior.
TomkinsSP
Member
As others have said, I see no criminal intent. As someone who has not done a backflip since age 12 or so, I don't see doing backflips as negligence. As someone who handles firearms I DO see picking up a firearm by its trigger to be negligent.
Negligent not criminal.
IIRC in ancient Rome they sewed corrupt public officials into burlap bags and drown them in the Tiber.
Negligent not criminal.
IIRC in ancient Rome they sewed corrupt public officials into burlap bags and drown them in the Tiber.
venomballistics
Member
if driving down a highway, you opt to search the glovebox for a CD you think you have, your now unattended vehicle crosses the median and plows into a busload of kids, are they less dead for the lack of malicious intent?
Inattentive driving is on the books.
if we were taking bets on whether or not he was intoxicated, odds are in favor of those betting he was. Here, one state over to the east, it's zero tolerance.
not a drop if if you carry. CO is probably similar.
Actions DO HAVE consequences. Much to do with appearances, the FBI doesn't need (another) black eye about now. Stick a fork in the guy, he's done. I kinda feel sorry him.Anyone here NEVER do anything stupid, raise your hand.
Frantically Waving Hands!!!
I do try not to drink and act stupid when I'm packing a loaded weapon though. The video indicates that he must have been pretty well lit, to be dancing FOR everyone else, alone. College Cheerleader perhaps???
TomkinsSP
Member
I intentionally avoided the issue of alcohol use. I don't know if it was a factor. Under the law of NY intent to drink alcohol was transferred as intent if you caused harm while intoxicated.
There was a sad case near here a couple years back, driver reached down for something. Ran over a mother on a bicycle. I think he accepted a plea deal for 15 years.
Something tells me we may be looking at even more rollmark warnings to come, Danger:No break dancing,backflips,summersalts, or any acrobatic maneuvers induced by alcohol,music or bravado.
Gonna need longer slldes or internal dance lock designs
Gonna need longer slldes or internal dance lock designs
FBI is declining to comment on this one. Really?? Naturally, their reason is "to protect the integrity of the investigation."
Okay. I'll buy that. But, bottom line is, they got a real black eye with this incident and with everything else that has been heaped on their plate lately, discretion is obviously much better than opening their mouth and admitting that one of their agents really goofed up. It'll be interesting to see how this one plays out.
Okay. I'll buy that. But, bottom line is, they got a real black eye with this incident and with everything else that has been heaped on their plate lately, discretion is obviously much better than opening their mouth and admitting that one of their agents really goofed up. It'll be interesting to see how this one plays out.
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Texas Star
US Veteran
Why was another patron filming him as this happened? He was probably already making a fool of himself while drunk in public.
If I was on the jury, I might still buy a plea that the Glock (if it was a Glock, std. FBI issue) discharged because the impact of falling on the hard floor may have dislodged something in that striker-fired system.
We don't KNOW that he even touched the trigger as he picked up the gun.
I do think the agent needs a new career. I'm just not sure that the discharge was all his fault.
If I was on the jury, I might still buy a plea that the Glock (if it was a Glock, std. FBI issue) discharged because the impact of falling on the hard floor may have dislodged something in that striker-fired system.
We don't KNOW that he even touched the trigger as he picked up the gun.
I do think the agent needs a new career. I'm just not sure that the discharge was all his fault.
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Absalom
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
I don't want make light of a serious situation, but .... yeah, I guess I do ...
I'd put those pants in a frame under glass, hole and bloodstains and all, and hang them on the wall in my den. And decades down the road the grandchildren will point them out to their friends and talk about the pants grandpa wore when he got shot in a gunbattle with the FBI
And there we have it. The inherent distrust of Glocks due to a complete misunderstanding of the operating system. He pressed the trigger. No other way that pistol can fire . . .
TomkinsSP
Member
Zere ist much mistrust of zee Glock. Zee Glock ist nicht ein danger! Zee Glock does not schoot people in zere faces. Zee Glock ist ein nice Austrian pistol. It does not vant zu take over zee welt. Just equip zee Polezi in Poland, Norway, France, Greece, Russia, Amerika...
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For those above who are concerned about the lack of "criminal intent", the Colorado law under which the young man is charged does not require any intent whatsoever.
This is the relevant language from their statute "He recklessly cause[d] serious bodily injury to another person by means of a deadly weapon".
The elements of the offense are simple:
1. Recklessness (Check*),
2. Serious bodily injury to a person (Check*), and
3. Deadly weapon (Check).
That's it. Doesn't matter if it was accidental or intentional. If all of the above elements were present, it's a felony punishable by serious prison time. Having said that, I predict he will be allowed to plea to a lesser degree of assault or an offense involving unlawful discharge of a firearm. Maybe not. It all depends on the prosecutor and with the video it looks like a slam dunk case.
* It goes without saying that a defense attorney can argue that the agent's actions don't meet the accepted legal definition of recklessness, and that the victim's injuries are not "serious". I'm just pointing out what the law says. The agent is innocent until proven guilty.
This is the relevant language from their statute "He recklessly cause[d] serious bodily injury to another person by means of a deadly weapon".
The elements of the offense are simple:
1. Recklessness (Check*),
2. Serious bodily injury to a person (Check*), and
3. Deadly weapon (Check).
That's it. Doesn't matter if it was accidental or intentional. If all of the above elements were present, it's a felony punishable by serious prison time. Having said that, I predict he will be allowed to plea to a lesser degree of assault or an offense involving unlawful discharge of a firearm. Maybe not. It all depends on the prosecutor and with the video it looks like a slam dunk case.
* It goes without saying that a defense attorney can argue that the agent's actions don't meet the accepted legal definition of recklessness, and that the victim's injuries are not "serious". I'm just pointing out what the law says. The agent is innocent until proven guilty.
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Harbinger_of_lead
Member
One thing he is clearly guilty of: Felony STUPID.
If that was jonny q public 6 months in lock up. guaranteed.
$100 says he does not spend a single day in DOC custody. Special treatment for the special people.
If that was jonny q public 6 months in lock up. guaranteed.
$100 says he does not spend a single day in DOC custody. Special treatment for the special people.
kamloops67
Member
But who's responsible for making that crappy holster with the inadequate retention system ?
Can't have your gun falling out every time you do a back flip
Can't have your gun falling out every time you do a back flip
Texas Star
US Veteran
Last I read, most French police used SIG's with selective SA/DA systems. As do many American police. Never heard of Russians using Glocks, but guess they may, some of them. British and many Aussie cops do use Glocks. But, so what? They don't usually know much about pistols, anyway.
And I zhink "Polizei" ist spelled zis vay. Absalom will know.
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I'll take that bet. He's been arrested. That counts as a day served. As for your latter statement, otherwise normal people who run afoul of the law handle the entire situation more professionally, regardless of their position. They hire a good lawyer, they post property as bail to get out, and they show up for court. Your aspersions are misplaced . . .
Protected One
Member
Does anyone know if he had been drinking?
If so, does the FBI allow agents -- even "off-duty" agents to drink?
If so, does the FBI allow agents -- even "off-duty" agents to drink?
But who's responsible for making that crappy holster with the inadequate retention system ?
Can't have your gun falling out every time you do a back flip
Exactly. What if he were fighting with a perp and the holster allowed the gun to fall out during a scuffle. It is actually the holster manufacturers fault and since they probably have deep pockets too will most likely be added into the lawsuit.
venomballistics
Member
I will mention intoxication as it has a fair amount of probability. On the same token I try to leave the subject as a possibility rather than a certainty until a lab report decides this.
I really hope probability is supported and he was drunk. if the FBI hired on someone like that when sober ... my last shred of faith in humanity is doomed
kwselke
Member
The blood alcohol test results have not been made public. My guess is if he had a two drink level he'll be toast.
I seen 'em get DNA results back quicker than this,,,True!, just watch TV!
Simply put,,An incredibly dopey act for an armed off duty LEO to be engaged in.
Common sense says not to place yourself in that situation.
Common sense can leave you in certain surroundings, but you are still responsible for your actions.
Simply put,,An incredibly dopey act for an armed off duty LEO to be engaged in.
Common sense says not to place yourself in that situation.
Common sense can leave you in certain surroundings, but you are still responsible for your actions.
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