Disappointed with S&W

[Watchdog]

S&W received my CORE on 12 March, when I called last monday they said it was completed and waiting shipping, would go out by the end of the week. Called today and was told it would hopefully ship by the end of the week. Not happy.

What were they going to do to the gun? You don't mention why you sent it in to them. Just curious.

 

[Rastoff]

Ok, I own a performance auto shop and mail order business.

Since you refuse to answer the question I asked, let me ask another. When I customer brings you a car to be worked on, what do you tell them the delivery time will be? Do you just tell them, "Park it over there and we'll get to it when we get to it"?

You keep telling me that I don't understand, but I do. I have been a project manager for test aircraft. I have worked on projects that took a month and some that have taken years. I absolutely understand how different resources/suppliers/offices work together (or not) and how they all affect the length of any project.

For one project my boss asked me when it would be done. I made the mistake of saying, "If we have no problems, it could be done at the end of September, but my experience tells me it will be more like the end of November." I should have just told him the November date because as soon as he heard September, that's what he wanted. I told him, right to his face, that it wouldn't happen because nothing is problem free. He didn't care and of course the project wasn't done until the end of November.

What I've learned is that there are three dates/times that can be given to an expectant customer:

• The problem free date. This is the date the product/project will be finished if the stars align and everything goes right. This is unrealistic and almost always results in an unhappy customer.
• The guaranteed date. This is the date you are 100% sure you can deliver by. This is ingenuous and far longer than necessary. If a customer want's his car repainted this date would be the end of the year. Giving this date usually results in lost business because, unless you're offering something unique, who wants to wait that long?
• The realistically buffered date. This is the best date because it includes some extra time built in to cover issues you know you'll have, but isn't so far out they'll go somewhere else. Sick employees, late parts, accidents during the process, etc. are all things that happen in any business.

I'm still curious to know how long a customer should wait beyond the promised delivery date. What is a reasonable time? I get that things happen, but to just tell a customer to wait forever is not acceptable. I agree that calling every day isn't acceptable either, but there has to be some balance.

 

[turbo38gn]

I have no promised completion time for most of the work I do, it is custom and parts are just not readily available for the model car I specialize in. If you try to pin me down for a finish date, unless it is a job that I can absolutely guarantee, I won't guarantee, if that doesn't work for you or Bergy... you are welcome to go elsewhere. I have never been disrespectful to a customer Bergy...... but I will respond in like fashion when pushed hard enough. We do quality work, it takes time, if you don't have the time, move on. You get more than you pay for when we work on your car. Bergy, you twisted my post into something it was not.

Bergy said:
I dont know you but I dont like your attitude and I'm glad you don't work on my vehicles. If I am paying you for a service I expect it to be done in a timely manner and done right. I understand that things come up but they can be handled in a professional manner. If you responded to me as you say you do we would have a few choice words. Remember without us customers you wouldn't be in buisness. I work hard for my money and spend it wisely. I expect good service when I pay good money for it.

And I don't care for yours, you sound like the guy that I would prefer not to do business with, some people forget.... I work hard for my money too, I give my customers 110% and with respect. My main objective in my business is to give my customer more than they pay for and the best value for their dollar. Where you came up with your assessment from what I said is beyond me.. I always treat my customers in a professional manner, I also expect the same from them, when that doesn't occur.... well, things happen.

Not sure I answered Rastoff.... but if I didn't ..... you decide what you can live with, I'll decide what I can live with and we all live with the consequences. Under the present atmosphere, our expectation for a timetable obviously needs to be reevaluated. And for the record... I didn't refuse to answer your question, maybe you d=couldn't decipher the message... I love my new V-rod...

 

[bjb4242]

The OP is right to be unhappy. This is business. When you tell someone you're going to deliver something by a certain date you do it. And if for some reason you weren't able to, you apologize and make the situation right ASAP. You don't cop an attitude; you won't last long in my line of work.

 

[Maddmax]

After I retired from my real job, I decided it might be fun to work part time at a LGS.

I can not count the times I've had a customer come in and say, ' I ordered a firearm , or sent it back for repairs, a month or two ago. What's going on ?! Why haven't I got it ?! '

So, I spend a half hour tracking down the paper work and what's going on. Just to find out it has actually been a week and a half ago. Not a month or so ago like the customer said.

One of the reasons I do not work at the LGS anymore. Got tired of dealing with PITA customers.

Who ever came up with the saying ' the customer is always right ' obviously never worked in retail or the LGS.

AND Heaven forbid,gun sales have gone through the roof over the past couple of years. Everyone thinks they should be first. I've delt with the public most of my life and there's a good percent of people that are "know-it-alls" and think they should ALWAYS be taken care of first. Could be everytime you call in "they" have to dig your item out to check on what's going on and then you get put on the back of the list...

People that keep calling in and bugging them are only slowing things up for everyone else...

 

[turbo38gn]

The OP is right to be unhappy. This is business. When you tell someone you're going to deliver something by a certain date you do it. And if for some reason you weren't able to, you apologize and make the situation right ASAP. You don't cop an attitude; you won't last long in my line of work.

whose copping an attitude...

 

[Maddmax]

The OP is right to be unhappy. This is business. When you tell someone you're going to deliver something by a certain date you do it.

And if for some reason you weren't able to, you apologize and make the situation right ASAP.

Then there's the people that EXPECT a freebe when things don't quite go right... Free mags... Should just be happy they pick up the shipping.

 

[rwsmith]

This is the very reason..

The issue, at least for me, isn't the shipping time, it's the false notification. If they say they're going to ship this week, then they should ship this week. The backlog of work has been around for months. It's not difficult to gauge the amount of stuff they have to ship and how long it will take. If they had said, "It's done, but we won't be able to ship until two weeks from now" I could deal with that. But, when they say, "We'll ship later this week" and it's not done, yes, I have an issue with that.

Correct me if I'm wrong steve462x0, but I believe it's the false info more than anything else.

This is one reason I'm not in business to sell, though I have procured tons of equipment. I can't bring myself to tell somebody something that I know isn't true and just keep putting people off. It seems that if you have that attitude you go broke quick.

 

[tat2dchad]

This is so pointless. Guy A. Wants to hear someone agree with him. Guy B. Well it doesnt matter what he says no matter how honest or accurate that answer is. Nownill just sit back and giggle at the frustration of the Op.

 

[bjb4242]

whose copping an attitude... [/QUOTE

I don't understand why my post upset you. If you're going to tell someone you're going to do something, then you should do it. That shouldn't be controversial.

 

[bjb4242]

Then there's the people that EXPECT a freebe when things don't quite go right... Free mags... Should just be happy they pick up the shipping.

I agree with you.

 

[thardgrave]

After reading all of these very interesting comments, I will offer one more....when folks really have no idea when something they are working on will be ready for a customer, they should just state that....we don't know and please don't ask us. That might not be the answer that many are looking for, but at least it is not a false promise or one based on hope alone. I happen to agree that one of the worst business policies you can have is to over promise and then under deliver. Maybe some of you that run your business that way take comfort in it, but the rest of us do not.....that is the issue here, and as long as S&W is overworked and back logged they might as well own up to it....call a spade a spade!

 

[turbo38gn]

whose copping an attitude... [/QUOTE

I don't understand why my post upset you. If you're going to tell someone you're going to do something, then you should do it. That shouldn't be controversial.

Not upset, maybe a little annoyed with the tone being set. If we say we're going to do something, we should... but, and I mean a big butt... there is so much to the dynamics of this, my ADHD does not allow me to respond the way I would like to... It's ok, for you to feel as you do... I just feel differently since I have been in similar situations from where I stand. I just see things different. Posters tend to embellish a little, I don't always believe what one person interprets as we don't have the benefit of hearing 2 sides of the story, then, and only then can we make a clear decision of right or wrong. Just because it's written on the internet, doesn't make it 100% true...

 

[asnpdirtezw]

Love reading through things like this, honestly. I work for Apple, i specifically do the labor on fixing computers. Sometimes i will end up with a call or customer coming in to our store wondering when it will be done. I tell them "I have submitted the request for the part, i will update the notes that you have called and put in a ticket for escalation, they normally do overnight shipping in these cases but to be safe i would expect the item to ship by the end of this week" sometimes it doesnt, but since i am not at the place that does the shipping i do not say. "i guarantee the item will ship by the end of the week" and i highly doubt S&W did that to you, if they say. "i expect it will ship by the end of this week" Then they along with you have the expectation that the item will ship by the end of the week.

 

[turbo38gn]

Love reading through things like this, honestly. I work for Apple, i specifically do the labor on fixing computers. Sometimes i will end up with a call or customer coming in to our store wondering when it will be done. I tell them "I have submitted the request for the part, i will update the notes that you have called and put in a ticket for escalation, they normally do overnight shipping in these cases but to be safe i would expect the item to ship by the end of this week" sometimes it doesnt, but since i am not at the place that does the shipping i do not say. "i guarantee the item will ship by the end of the week" and i highly doubt S&W did that to you, if they say. "i expect it will ship by the end of this week" Then they along with you have the expectation that the item will ship by the end of the week.

Excellent response... exactly what I wanted to say.. but couldn't come up with the right words!!!

 

[vipermd]

IMPORTANT: I spoke to SW Customer service today and came away with some enlightening information. If you read above I started my com with them about march 1/ 2014, I have been told that it is repaired and ready to ship, twice! I called today and it is still ready to ship. They have instituted an overhaul of their systems that has some bugs in it. They are down to 2 days for sending a repair tag- plan for instant, there are items " in shipping" that are not shipped because the system will not let them do what needs to be done to ship. They do not want mine or any one's gun, but it is not working correctly at this time. So when he said to me or any one it is ready to ship, he was not lying, just unable to do something out of his control. It is improving, and no one wants it done more than CS & S&W, they do not get paid if orders are not sent, custom work not done or paid. ( I suggested that they get the "o" team to solve the problem !!! ) I have dealt with for over 30 yrs and they have always been very helpful ( except during clinton debacle ). They are trying to get it right, faster, better, maybe it could have been done at a time when demand was not that high, but they started and could not stop the changeover after a bad person does something wrong!! I also did confirm that they will expedite LEO DUTY gun repairs. So a few answers of why things are not smooth. Be Safe,

 

[Edmo]

I've got a 642 at S&W for repairs and it ended up being a replacement. I asked to have them send me a 640 Pro Series gun instead and paid the difference.

I'm at week two into the process and the CS guy was honest and realistic with me when I made the deal. He said it would be somewhere between two weeks and two months to get the replacement out to me. Just like everyone I want it now, but I can work with his level of honesty.

I think if the OP's CS guy had been this open/accurate/honest we wouldn't be posting to this thread.

I guess the S&W workers are kinda busy right now processing the guns coming back from the Texas DPS order! Bazinga!!

Hopefully I will have a well made and nicely assembled 640 Pro in my grubby hands by the time month two rolls around (that's 6 weeks from now, but nobody's counting). I truly expect nothing less.

Edmo

 

[sunflake]

I sure hope my new shield 9mm has no issues in its life. S&W customer service sounds like a huge PITA! You don't have issues like I have been reading with some other manufactures. Just stand behind the product. Under promise and over deliver it's not that hard!

 

[Rastoff]

You don't have issues like I have been reading with some other manufactures. Just stand behind the product. Under promise and over deliver it's not that hard!

If you read the other manufacturer forums like this one, you'll find all these same issues with just about every manufacturer. S&W is normally very good. I think the massive rise in sales due to the popularity of the Shield has taxed their production and repair facilities to the max.

While I agree that these things can be fixed, I'm not ready to drop S&W because they have had a few bumps. Apparently they have a new system. I hope they can work out the kinks and get back on track.

 

[sunflake]

Yeah me either. It's a shame these things happen at all!