E. Howard Hunt's take on JFK assination-Comments welcome

Autonomous said:
Whomever was behind the assassination of JFK was capable of putting out the smokescreen of endless theories and disinformation that have muddied the waters to this day. This suggests organization and resources.
Who benefitted from the deed? Some who benefitted could be patsies, just part of the distraction. The actual shooters could be manipulated patsies too.
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I'm glad you mentioned this because it reminds me of a phrase I learned recently. "Limited Hangout". This is when the Alphabet Boys intentionally leak real details about their secret activities, mixed with just enough lies to throw you off the scent. By beating the press to the story and controlling the salacious details, the public's curiosity (or sense of outrage) is satisfied, and the story can blow over. If anyone learns any new details as time goes by, the public won't believe it (or won't care). The story has already been told.
A humorous fictional example of this is the movie "Men in Black". The government intentionally leaks all the details about aliens visiting Earth to the tabloids. No reputable news agency would touch the story after that.
 
LBJ did it. Simple.

And, yes, the USSS had an AR-15 in Dealy Plaza that day. It was actually photographed. There was a photo of the motorcade speeding away to Parkland after the deed. I the SS follow-up car (a Cadillac convertible) you can see the muzzle of the rifle pointing upwards with its trademark triangular front sight assembly.

But no, it was LBJ that had that hired out.

Sent from my SM-G990U using Tapatalk
 
As my mother said after Oswald's death was announced, "Now we'll never know." The most valid critique of the Warren Commission Report is that it took the place of a trial, but it was not conducted in an adversarial manner, no one to represent Oswald, challenge witnesses or evidence, easy to blame someone who is already dead, allow hearsay, etc. Then there's the Magic Bullet. The same thing happened with the Peers Commission that "investigated" My Lai-placed the heaviest blame on 5 officers who were already dead.
I joke that my ideal hitman would be someone like me-way above average intelligence and education, well read, someone who does his homework, investigates carefully, when it comes to nefarious or questionable activties has a good sense of the risks involved, understands his adversaries and does not underestimate them. Is a good shot, understands how firearms actually work, what they can and cannot do, etc.
 
At least at present, the two most popular assassination conspiracy theories are said to involve LBJ and the CIA as being the principal actors. But they are far from the only ones.
 
pharmer said:
I have been to the site. It is a much shorter distance than the TV portrays. Hitting a moving target with a surplus 6.5 Carcano is another matter, possible but quite the feat. Joe
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Is it a difficult feat because the target is moving or because of using a 6.5 Carcano?
 
I had a teacher in high school that was a secret service agent for LBJ. He always said you can never talk about a sitting or ex-president. He would also say the president of the united states is the most powerful man in the world. Since LBJ was deceased when he was my teacher he had some amazing stories. A little know fact, on the day JFK was murdered Charles Harrelson was also in Dallas. Charles was convicted of killing Judge John Wood, a Federal Judge in San Antonio. If the name sounds familiar he was the father of Woody Harrelson, Woody's mother? Diane Lou Oswald, you cannot make that up.
 
I don't have either an opinion on the matter, nor a strong interest in the subject. While I generally snicker at conspiracy theories-especially really complex ones, those with some interest could look at a couple of books:

Mortal Error by Bonar Menninger

The JFK Assassination Dissected by Dr. Cyril Wecht, eminent forensic pathologist.

In re post 15: The AR was a competitor in the Light Rifle program for the DOD. Remington (won the cartridge design competition) and Winchester were the others in the running. IIRC, the program was on hold after adoption of the M14, but there was at least limited production of full auto versions as Test and Evaluation samples for military/LEA contracts. Also probable semi-auto production for civilian sales. SAC also purchased a bunch for their air base defense units prior to formal adoption by the DOD. So, the guns were out there.

WAY off topic-sort of: so many commentators/spokes critters on those shows involving aliens have hair dos straight from Babylon 5. Can't recall the race/species name, but they made the Borgias look like good neighbors. Are they trying to feel "special"? Feel estranged from the rest of us?
 
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WR Moore said:
WAY off topic-sort of: so many commentators/spokes critters on those shows involving aliens have hair dos straight from Babylon 5. Can't recall the race/species name, but they made the Borgias look like good neighbors. Are they trying to feel "special"? Feel estranged from the rest of us?
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That was the Centauri. The hair do's in the royal court got less wild when the mad Emperor Cartagia decided that shorter crests were in. One assumes that character was based on another mad emperor whose name also began with C, Caligula.
 
It always bothered me that the Defector- Loser - Marksman - unskilled Laborer who owns a mail order cheapie Rifle gets a job in a building on a traffic circle where all traffic slows down.
Way before you could possible know about the Prez visit.
But then he goes out to his Wife's location where his Rifle is stored and returns to Dallas with a long parcel.
Later a Strip Club Operator shoots him at the Police Station?
If you wrote a script like this it would trashed on the spot!
 
BigBoy99 said:
I read recently that it was a Secret Service agent which had an accidental discharge of the M16 rifle which fired the fatal bullet. The agent was in the car following Kennedy and when the first shot by Oswald was fired, he grabbed the rifle and is so doing fired the fatal round. It seemed to be totally plausible to me.
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"Mortal Error" covers the work by ballistics expert Howard Donahue. It's very well done. Folks that call it unsubstantiated speculation miss the fact that it is the simplest and most plausible, and as far as I have found in 40 years of interest in the JFK assassination, the only theory that fully accounts for both all of the physical and witness evidence and all of the massive irregularities in the secret service actions after the shooting, the investigation, and the autopsy.

Colin McLaren, an Australian police detective, wrote "The Smoking Gu" from his police investigation perspective and came to the same conclusions.

In effect, you had a rookie Secret Service Agent you was in the car due to an unforeseen vacancy, who was carrying a just introduced to the secret service AR-15 using 55 gr soft point ammunition. He was sitting on the back of the rear seat of the convertible following Kennedy, he heard Oswald shoot, looked over his shoulder in Oswald's direction while bringing up the AR-15, slipped and pulled the trigger shooting Kennedy in the back of the head.

It explains:
- the cadence of the three shots fired;
- the witness reports of gunfire at street level;
- the witnesses who smelled gun powder at street level;
- the wound in Kennedy's head;
- the many small fragments in the X-ray of his head (when the low velocity FMJ round from the Carcano doesn't fragment);
- the Secret Service's refusal to allow an autopsy in Dallas;
- the bizarre Secret Service interference in the autopsy that did occur in MD;
- the suppression of evidence from the autopsy;
- the disappearance of Kennedy's brain (which prevented analysis of the fragments which would have matched the jacket material of the Remington made .223 round, and excluded the 6.5 Carcano ammunition in Oswald's possession;
- the call to Bobby Kennedy by the agent in charge stating "there has been an accident"; and
- the fact that Hickey was the only agent on scene who was never formally interviewed by anyone from the justice department, treasury department or warren commission.

Donahue did a superb job with the trajectory analysis based on the autopsy evidence and wound descriptions that were available, and the relative positions of the cars.

It also makes sense. The Kennedy assassination was tragic as it was, but for Kennedy to have died as a result of a ND by his own protection detail would have made it even more so.

Also at the immediate time it wasn't readily apparent that the other round that hit Kennedy would have also most likely been fatal by itself as it was equivalent to a C2 "hangman's fracture".

That's before we even get into the "how incredibly bad this makes the Secret Service look", even before the inevitable conspiracy/political coup theories would have popped up. Kennedy was a president who won by a very narrow margin in the popular vote, close enough that Nixon could have contested the election but declined to do so as it would have undermined confidence in our electoral process. Kennedy was also a president who was loved or hated with very little middle ground.

Covering up the ND by Hickey was a smart move from several perspectives.

And that cover up also explains why so many of the documents related to the assassination, investigation and autopsy are still classified 60 years after the accident. Releasing them now would still undermine confidence in the government and the secret service. Castro, the Soviets, the mob at the time, are all areas that are dead and buried and would otherwise pose no barrier to releasing the information after 50 years. But the secret service accidentally shooting Kennedy and the resulting cover up? That's still big news.
 
Unless you believe J. Edgar Hoover put one over on Earl Warren or the other way around, we have to accept the Warren Report as the most accurate rendition of the facts.
Both men had a lot of power and plenty of resources.
When Roosevelt interned the people of Japanese descent, Warren, who was Governor of California, was all for it. He and his cronies did fine out of it.
Hoover said the Nisei were American citizens; they had committed no crime; and they were being denied their Constitutional rights. He said this publicly, loudly, and often.
Hoover and Warren despised each other.
 
Conspiracies...conspiracies...

As old as mankind itself.

Like many unknown events throughout history, the amount of disinformation et. al. would render any truth revealed to be unbelievable and dismissed.

All of the principle players in this have answered for their crimes to a higher authority than any court on this earth.

Do I believe there was a plan to eliminate Kennedy? Yes.
Do I believe that it was done by our own government? Yes.
Is JFK dead? Yes.

Anything else at this point is another mystery that will never be resolved to anyones satisfaction. History is full of such mysteries. JFK isn't the first and it won't be the last.
 
Maybe we could get Jack Bauer and the CTU to investigate and find the moles?

Randy
PS.
All those those that really know are long ago dead.
 
I am no assassination conspiracy advocate and have no particular theories about who did what and when. But I have maintained an ongoing interest for two reasons. First, I was in Dallas when the assassination occurred, but on the opposite (east) end of downtown at the time. I had no idea that JFK was in town until after the fact. Second, during an earlier trip to Dallas I was once in Jack Ruby's Carousel Club, and even saw him there. That gives me a little closer connection to the events than most.
 
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DWalt said:
I am no assassination conspiracy advocate and have no particular theories about who did what and when. But I have maintained an ongoing interest for two reasons. First, I was in Dallas when the assassination occurred, but on the opposite (east) end of downtown at the time. I had no idea that JFK was in town until after the act. Second, at an earlier date I was once in Jack Ruby's Carousel Club, and even saw him there. That gives me a little closer connection to the events than most.
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Makes for good " bar talk " but I wouldn't call it a connection .. Now if Jack Ruby sat at your table and bought you a beer..
 
DWalt said:
I am no assassination conspiracy advocate and have no particular theories about who did what and when. But I have maintained an ongoing interest for two reasons. First, I was in Dallas when the assassination occurred, but on the opposite (east) end of downtown at the time. I had no idea that JFK was in town until after the act. Second, at an earlier date I was once in Jack Ruby's Carousel Club, and even saw him there. That gives me a little closer connection to the events than most.
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Based on the crackpot speculations and the credentials of most of the plot & subterfuge people, that connection makes you not only closer to the events than most, it qualifies you as a true maestro of the real happenings.
 
Have followed this thread for several days. Without going into specific detail I want to share what my Uncle told me about 10 years ago. He was a retired supervisory agent with the FBI and retired after 30 years in 1971 (1941-1971). He was a Russian specialist in the counter espionage section. He had worked counter espionage from WWII through the Cold War. He worked closely on the JFK assasination investigation. Never spoke about it until a family reunion couple of years before his death and I asked him if there was a conspiracy or did Oswald act alone. He response was no conspiracy, Oswald acted alone and was a real kook.

My uncle was a very smart man and old school FBI. I trust what he said.
 
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I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I knew a talented artist and sculptor who once claimed to have been part of a US Army "hit squad" that killed JFK. Did I believe it? Umm . . . not for a second.

He was, though (unknown to me at the time) an organized crime hit man who spent time in prison, escaped from prison taking the warden's wife with him, lived in hiding for years, and was eventually recaptured before dying in prison. You can google him if you wish - Randolph Franklin Dial. I knew him as Randolph Franklin. I guess he thought using Franklin as his last name would throw off whoever was looking for him at the time.

One particularly horrific part of his story is that his "associates" killed his ex wife on Christmas Eve to send him a message and left her body beneath the Christmas tree for their little daughter to find on Christmas morning.
 
I am with Howard Donahue when it comes to who fired the fatal shot that killed JFK. But I still don't know what to believe when it comes to why he was assassinated in first place. There are too many variables out there and the people who knew for a fact are probably all dead by now.
 
djohns6 said:
Makes for good " bar talk " but I wouldn't call it a connection .. Now if Jack Ruby sat at your table and bought you a beer..
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I only saw him, he was circulating among the customers. No beer, no conversation. I did not know who he was until he later became world famous. Another slight connection I had forgotten about. I was staying at a hotel less than a block from the Dallas police station where Oswald was shot. But I had already left town when that happened. That is another story.
 
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