* * Ebola Discussion

ladder13 said:
They have less than no clue. This whole thing is a bad dream. Is the head of the CDC a veterinarian?
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Most everything he says simply makes no sense at all, or has already been proven wrong or untrue. I don't know about being a veterinarian. Pugsters vet could handle this situation better.
 
eyegots2no said:
I think it is odd still that a person on the "watch" or "self-monitor" would travel at all.

Those people who have been around Duncan do not need to travel as if everything is ok---Nor do they need to go to Central Market and sneeze on my tomatoes---and---their kids should stay home.
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Duncan's personal contacts should all be coming into the clear this weekend. So far, zero infections among associates.

There seems to be some confusion as to what health care workers were initially told as to the need to self monitor. It seems various levels of "authority" did not communicate well each other. A lot seems to have gone wrong at the local level and not just Federal.

The CDC was truthful apparently about spread. None of the people on Patrick Sawyers flight to Nigeria, where he was violently ill, got sick. No one on Duncan's flights got sick. None of the people who hugged him at the airport, or even cared for him sick at home got sick. None of the casual contacts of the Spanish nurse got sick. Dr. Brantley s wife and family have not gotten sick.

No one properly cared for in the United States has even died from Ebola. (Due to misdiagnosis and lost days, as well as what we are learning about the Dallas hospital, I would question whether Mr. Duncan got what could be termed proper care.)
 
GatorFarmer said:
No one properly cared for in the United States has even died from Ebola. (Due to misdiagnosis and lost days, as well as what we are learning about the Dallas hospital, I would question whether Mr. Duncan got what could be termed proper care.)
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Did you see the price tag on that care?
It's over a half mil.
Considering that all they can do is treat symptoms, keep em hydrated and give transfusions, seems to me that there is a huge amount of workload to rack up that bill.

Also, I know Omahas bio containment unit can handle two patients. Yet they have been kept to a single patient at a time.

taken as indicators, Im thinking that the track record will take a hit as soon as the 14 bed national capacity is exceeded.

Dallas Presb has offered evidence of what happens when care must leave these sparse resources.

Higher mortality and spread rate.
 
Do you think that all of those precautions (even if used incorrectly) the isolation room, and the extra staff needed to care for this one patient are free? Think about that, the patient has to be in a negative pressure room, ideally with an "airlock" door. Then there is the cost of all of the isolation equipment, much of which can't be reused.

Not to mention how much it's costing to haul that stuff away and incinerate it.

Dallas Presbyterian is likely to eat most or all of that and of course Duncan's family may well sue over their malpractice.

Gator Farmer has this pretty well nailed. There is a lot of panic over a not very contagious disease. I'm far more worried about the flu and the Enterovirus that is spreading among young kids. That's already killed two kids that I'm aware of.


venomballistics said:
Did you see the price tag on that care?
It's over a half mil.
Considering that all they can do is treat symptoms, keep em hydrated and give transfusions, seems to me that there is a huge amount of workload to rack up that bill.
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It most certainly is NOT free.
It is, however, the price paid to bat 1000 as our bio containment units have.




GaryS said:
Do you think that all of those precautions (even if used incorrectly) the isolation room, and the extra staff needed to care for this one patient are free? Think about that, the patient has to be in a negative pressure room, ideally with an "airlock" door. Then there is the cost of all of the isolation equipment, much of which can't be reused.

Not to mention how much it's costing to haul that stuff away and incinerate it.

Dallas Presbyterian is likely to eat most or all of that and of course Duncan's family may well sue over their malpractice.

Gator Farmer has this pretty well nailed. There is a lot of panic over a not very contagious disease. I'm far more worried about the flu and the Enterovirus that is spreading among young kids. That's already killed two kids that I'm aware of.
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This just keeps getting better every day, why it's no wonder why every day I read the news I get this warm fuzzy feeling that those in charge really know what they're doing and not lying to us or talking out of both sides of their mouths! ;)
 
GaryS said:
It's a valid question, but not related to your original suggestion. Which was to forbid anyone from going to or leaving Texas to be on the safe side.
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This is the dizzying argument the director of CDC presented when asked about quarenteen for west Africa. Can't do it because we couldn't do it so we won't do it because we haven't done it so it can't be done.....
I say:
It can be done and it does work, refusal to accept restriction of travel as a method of containment is akin to denying abstainence as an effective method of birth control.

Shutting down Texas is a bad idea because the financial blow to the rest of the United States would hurt Massachusetts, Connecticut and New York severely.
Then where would we be?

edit: nothing we can do about it now, since the disease has arrived. We just get to "lie back and take it." Sort of like gun control.
 
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Old TexMex said:
This is the dizzying argument the director of CDC presented when asked about quarenteen for west Africa. Can't do it because we couldn't do it so we won't do it because we haven't done it so it can't be done.....
I say:
It can be done and it does work, refusal to accept restriction of travel as a method of containment is akin to denying abstainence as an effective method of birth control.

Shutting down Texas is a bad idea because the financial blow to the rest of the United States would hurt Massachusetts, Connecticut and New York severely.
Then where would we be?

edit: nothing we can do about it now, since the disease has arrived. We just get to "lie back and take it." Sort of like gun control.
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even if you overlooked the financial impact, locking down the whole of Texas is impossible.
Air ports and roads might be easy enough, but that never stopped Bubba and his 4X4, sneaking out offroad.

With the second nurse traveling to Ohio, it seems fairly obvious that many just won't play by any rules.
 
But now since it has been spread they need to get their heads unstuck and get it contained at all cost with criminal charges going against willingly traveling with the disease or the thought of it.
Liberia needs to be isolated and the illustrious president needs to rescind sending in our troops. Anyone going in to assist does so at their own risk and medical supplies are air dropped.
That should just be for starters! :rolleyes:
 
I am likely going to be black listed here by some folks, so be it.
I think too many of you are spending too much time paying too much attention to what is being said on the news. There is no such thing as honest news and that is especially true with a story like this. Medical authorities are making statements which are getting immediately twisted out of context, followed by the usual overdose of analysis by self-proclaimed medical experts who are not, let alone the stupid comments, opinions, conjecture, and speculation being made by too many talking heads. Sophistry always stands tall when stuff that can cause a good panic happens. Just because someone is a doctor and gets on TV to discuss Ebola doesn't mean they have a clue what they're talking about. Are they a non-practicing radiologist discussing the ins and outs of brain surgery? Or a former OB-GYN who last practiced a decade ago who is now some network's "expert" on virology and immunology? Again, who says they are experts? The other talking heads on the same network? I thought so.
Even in the face of a disease like this one, confidentiality rules. There is far more going on behind the scenes and in treatment than any of us know about. There is far more not being said than is.

From the day it was first identified, long ago now, it was only a matter of time before Ebola got to the USA. That's because of the world as a society, not because of this country, or our lax laws. It's the way the whole entire world functions as a whole. Should we all wall off our borders and give up all our freedoms because of viruses? If so, we're about 5 billion years too late for that. The other strains of Ebola will get here too, sooner or later. It's inevitable. And in another generation or 2, maybe sooner, new viruses we have never heard of will be the ones that frighten Earth's inhabitants. These viruses will evolve just as they have all along.

I think based on what I am seeing and what little has been said before this outbreak even happened, that our medical scientists have been all along, and are now working very hard on treatment therapy and a vaccine, and that it's likely just over the horizon. It should not be lost on anyone here that the CDC saved the lives of the first 2 American doctors it treated at it's facility. Both of who arrived in an advanced stage of the disease. Chance? Coincidence? I doubt it. They're still not telling us anything about how they did it.
You do realize, that pretty much all of the local hospitals and clinics that are trying to treat Ebola patients in Africa have dirt floors and no running water, right? Pretty much just tents with a few cots and maybe a nurse?

The big screw up occured at Presbyterian in Dallas, they are the ones primarily responsible for more than doubling the number of cases in our country. Not ineptitude by the CDC or other Federal agencies. It has been stated several times that Presbyterian did not follow Ebola precaution protocol, in more than 1 way, a statement which a lot of people seem to be missing the point of.
 
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venomballistics said:
with one dead, two confirmed infected, nope ...
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Just look at all the effort and attention to deal with just one infected person with all the resources we have here. Now think what our troops will be up against dropping them in a third world cesspool of Ebola with tens of thousands of cases.
 
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ChattanoogaPhil said:
Just look at all the effort and attention to deal with just one infected person with all resources we have here. Now think what are troops will be up against dropping them in a third world cesspool of Ebola with tens of thousands of cases.
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some just are gluttons for punishment.
just wish it wasn't on our dime
 
What is the rationale for giving an anti biotic for a viral disease?


GA 1911 said:
I just attended an Ebola session in Atlanta.

The virus is very aggressive and makes a healthy body to remove what it can. The body will try to remove 16 liters of fluid every day via diarrhea. This is what kills them.

The antibiotic will work if you keep fluids in your body. 16 liters = 4 1/2 gallons of Gatorade every day. Just drink fluids until the docs tell you to stop.
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