FFL transfers - Has anyone had this problem?

[rwsmith]

Most everybody I know are glad.....

Most everybody I know are glad to do transfers. It's easy money for them. One really small outfit I use, you come in and fill out the computer program for about 5 minutes, pay $25 and walk out with your gun.

 

[7shooter]

I was chewed out by a LGS owner when I came to pick up a used 3 inch Model 10 that he had earlier agreed to do the transfer for. He was ranting about how I should have bought it from him. I replied that his store had agreed to do the transfer but in any event if he had another 3 inch Model 10 I would be more than happy to buy that one also.

I later had to discipline his adult son ( I didn't know it was his son till later ) for unsafe gun handling at a guest day at a range where I am a volunteer RSO. The son flew into a tantrum and I had to bring in the chief RSO to back me up. I thought the kid was about to throw himself on the ground and start kicking or maybe hold his breath till I relented and let him stand in front of the firing line and point his pistol back at us.

I won't step in the door of that place again and I am not shy about telling people why.

 

[TTSH]

Massachusetts is different from the free states in a lot of unfortunate ways.

Most of my business is concentrated in a small handful of favorite shops although I do like to spread my business around when I can. But try to get any of them to do an incoming transfer and I get every excuse in the book why it can't be done. And the biggest excuse of all, directly or indirectly, is our "lists", including the EOPS list and the double-top-secret unpublished AG's list. The thing is that fear of the lists is used as an excuse even when the gun is on the EOPS list and complies with the AG's regs. The dealer will tell you that they "don't want to take a chance" or that it "isn't worth their trouble" or that they "can't be sure that it really complies"... etc., etc., etc.

Often, they will recommend that you visit a competing dealer with a "reputation for doing transfers", but then you call them and you get the same BS excuses. Just a waste of time.

Bottom line is that our MA dealers collectively hate to do incoming transfers. They want you to buy from their stock (or order through them) so they can get all the profit. They will even try to sell you on a different gun that they have in stock before they will even talk about doing an incoming transfer.

You almost need to have an FFL relative or friend or some other sort of personal or business relationship with a dealer before he or she will actually do an incoming transfer for you without a huge song and dance. I find it very discouraging.

 

[Biggfoot44]

* multiple rambling observations *

The situation can be different in Free America , from those jurisdictions with additional State Licensing for Dealers, and additional State procedures. Lots more paperwork for dealers , lots more time interacting with customer/ transferee , lots more paperwork to maintain and store , and need to provide secure storage for said firearms during the waits involved ( aka Gun Jail ). In one state , during the 2013 buying panic customers wiped out the entire instock inventory is a matter of days, so everything was transfered in. As sales volumes went up , the ( Gov't agency handling such matters) got slower and slower , until the waiting period of days , turned into multiple months. Dealers increasingly had to cut off accepting transfers because they had hundred , if not thousands of guns backed in in "Gun Jail" , and physically ran out of space to stack them.

*******

Quasi-average rate locally is $50. $35 is bargan , and $75 and even $100 is out there. And of course distance and convience have to factor in , and are probably more impportant than +/- 10 or 15 dollars.


************

Heck , I prefer to be able to have a prospective purchase live and in person in my hand. If a dealer has multiple examples , I have been known to examine several to select the best trigger/ fit overall. If one is interested reasonably common , currently produced firearms ( ie likely to physically be on local shelves) , you have to mentally factor transfer fees and shipping together with those low, low advertised prices from SGN or the internet. Somewhere +/- $100 would be the tipping point.

*************

Physical Gunstores , with a brick and mortar location , and physical inventory are Good Things. They can't pay the mortage/ rent , utility bills, fight with state and local gov'ts to open/ stay open , put cloths on his back , or food on his children's table for free. Or by $20 transfers.

Maving a decent selection of mdse in stock requires a cunck of capital , or expense of revolving floor plan.

And yes , I have multiple time purchased guns that I didn't know I wanted , until I actually handled them .

 

[Biggfoot44]

And as TTSH was posting while I was tapping away :

In "Other than Free America" , lots of ( Unconstitutional , illogical, etc ) regulations as to what is/ isn't legal are vague , and open to interpetation. Initital interpation by FFL , vague and contradictory advisories from ( Gov't agency handling such matters ), and have been know to retroactivly change their minds and retrive items from purchasers , and discipline the dealers. So lots of dealers ( and out of state distributors ) will make a rational decision that discression is a better business practice than valor. ( Related coRolery - few people prudently volunter to become a test case.)

********

From Dealers rational basis - best outcome is make a sale from existing inventory ( or consignment guns). Second best is "Let me order it for you" .

Leastwise "Dealer" who activly persue buying and selling firearms as a primary business. Established "other" business with firearms as minor sideline , or retired guys looking to get out of the house , and don't really need to make any money can be different.

 

[629shooter]

Like others, I like older/non- ILS S&Ws. They are hard to find locally and my "regular" LGS knows this so, there is no problem.

The owner always says, "keep 'em coming." So, he obviously doesn't mind transfers.

If I want to purchase something new, I'll go to him first and, get a price. If the price is fair and, it usually is, I'll buy or order through them. If not I'll find it elsewhere. Also, I'm not the kind of guy that "dickers" when the price is fair. Some folks need to remember that others need to eat too.

 

[Arik]

Has anyone ever had any problems with their FFL being upset because you didn't buy a gun from them instead of buying one online?

I run into that sometimes. They ask what gun I bought and how much I paid for it. They are sometimes un-cooperative in sending their license promptly. I've had one refuse to give me a copy of his license so I could send it with the money order like the seller asked. I've had another insist he speak to the seller on the phone before he sent his license.

Is all of this normal? I can only guess it's because they wish they had the sale.

Not for me it's not. None of my lGSs do f hat sort of thing. If you ask for their FFL they'll promptly go and get it for you. No interrogations. Occasionally a friendly salesman will be curious if he shares the same interests in specific firearms as I do. When the gun or rifle does come in they sometimes ask but again it's more of chit-chat/curiosity then anything else. This particular lgs gets a lot of my money and if they want to complain about one purchase it would mean that they would loose all my business. I think that to complain and be hostile to outside orders is financial suicide.

I'm also not shy about ordering stuff that they already have for sale in their store. If I bought it online that means the deal was A LOT better than they had. For instance, right now HK has a $200 rebate on handguns. I'd be crazy to buy from the store if I can save $200

 

[Dstyles75]

If an FFL doesn't "like" to do transfers on items he may sell himself, then instead of giving customers grief (which, in turn, will give his business a bad reputation) he shouldn't advertise that he does transfers!

EXACTLY! I always call and ask if they do transfers. "Yea, no problem." Then after I won or bought the gun the problems start.

 

[cloud]

Called a lgs about a transfer last week. .He said no problem than asked what kind of gun it was. Than asked me If I would tell him how much I paid because he had one in stock that he could sell me. When I told him how much I paid he was in disbelieve said he could not even get one for that price.

 

[glowe]

However, after that *** that Washington just passed, it looks like I may be doing FFL Transfers as I-594 has castrated my C&R License. (Now you are either a dealer as defined in 18 USC 923(a) or you are nobody.

So sorry to hear this - and the SWCA is going to WA next year?? Anyway, it sure seems like something that will be challenged in the courts, since the same records and backgrounds are checked by the BATF for either FFL or FFL03, before issuing a license. Besides, FFL03s have to follow the same rules and laws as FFLs.

. . . would have thought I would never recommend this - but you are not too far from Oregon??

 

[just jim]

I can't remember the last gun I bought from a stocking dealer. I stay out of the shops and if I want something I look to a gunshow or a private sale. I like the older guns, the new products just don't do it for me the way it used to. Was a time I lived in the gun stores, haven't been in one for months.

I do have a store that has a gunsmith that I hit about once a month but I never buy anything new manufacture. Like most stores he has his favorite people he offers the good stuff to. Something good walks through the door and it isn't first come first serve, they call their preferred customer list. No sense in going in to shop when all the good stuff goes to the stores buddies.

 

[Brian41]

I've done transfers at my LGS with no problems but it's been for older S&W revolvers they don't have. They are though real interested in seeing what I bought.
It probably helps though that I've bought a lot of guns from them and my safe. They know what I like and have my cell number and will call if they get something in I'll like. I have also bought some 1911s new from them and probably paid a little more than I could have gotten it elsewhere. I also buy my ammunition from them too at times as they stock .41 mag, .44 special and will sell me 22lr they get in but hold for regular customers.
I also have traded guns there and sold some outright to them as well. My being a good customer makes them happy and they don't mind a transfer and at a reasonable price for their efforts.

 

[dean sr.]

"Is all of this normal? I can only guess it's because they wish they had the sale".

Here they ask for the purchase price because they charge state sales tax after the fact. Their FFL "service" is also a profit center so they can add additional fees as they see fit. In other words, yes, they wanted to make the original sale.

 

[mickeyblueyes]

The local gun stores here really hate doing on line transfers. So much so that one popular store charges $100. for it the rest charge $55.

Two local FFL s that just do transfers and sell ammo charge $25.

 

[KevinCH]

This right here is why FFLs don't like to do transfers. They spend all the money on inventory and overhead. Then you come in, utilize their inventory for free and spend your money elsewhere. Why should they help you when you won't do anything in return?

If we don't spend money at their store, then it won't be there for us to fondle those guns we're interested in. Then how will you buy your gun on-line?

Couldn't agree with this more, & I won't do it. If one of, or "the" LGS is way over-priced, I won't take their time up by having them wait on me for a sale I absolutely know isn't going to happen. If they are truly not competitive, there will be another store that is.

That said, I buy all my new guns from a brick-and-mortar gun store. If I do my homework, calculate an on-line price to include shipping & transfer fees, I've always been able to buy OTD locally for about 10% more, sometimes less. I'm willing to pay that for the walk in convenience, the personal attention, & the ability to handle the merchandise. There is no way these folks can operate at the same cost as someone working out of their basement after they come home from their day job.

For used guns, I have no issue buying on-line & I have an FFL that does my transfers for $20. After a couple of transactions, he emailed me a copy of his FFL & I have it on file to use but I ALWAYS notify him of any purchase. That works great for when I get to go back to my home state & visit my "used to be LGS", & find something I want to purchase.

Once the small, independent shops go under & competition is eliminated, the remaining stores will be able to charge whatever they want for a transfer - if accepting them at all. I can see the day when transfers are $100+.

 

[deadin]

since the same records and backgrounds are checked by the BATF for either FFL01 or FFL03

Gary,
Not quite. I checked with BATF in DC and was told that the only differences between the check for a FFL01 and a FFL03 is that the 01 has to submit fingerprints and a picture.
My CPL has my fingerprints and my DL and Military ID card have my picture. (Among other places, I'm sure....)

 

[Florida Guy]

My lgs probably has the best deal in town.
He has no problem doing online transfers, and charges only $10 to do so.
However, if you spend $20 or more on anything in the store at the time of transfer, the transfer is FREE.
I do have to pay the $5 for the phone call.
And the owner is a very friendly guy, and always greets me by my first name.

 

[MrTrolleyguy]

I have had these problems numerous times. I ran a thread on it....the shop owners are jealous of the business being done online. It is that simple.

I heard a bunch of guys jump in to try to stick up for the dealers. Over time I realized that they too were often dealers working this forum, Gunbroker and some may have had their own brick & mortar establishments.


I have one FFL that receives all my purchases. There have been more than 25 this year. He is happy to have the business.

When I do local purchases I do that at the shop three blocks from my house. They are a neighborhood landmark. Over 40 years in business. I hang out there once or twice a week and buy from them often. I will not ship a gun to them however. They don't want the business really. I am okay with that.

Sadly these two brothers are retiring near the end of the year. The store will stay open but it will not be the same. I will miss them.

Joe




Can you spot the "New York Reload N Frame Appendix Carry" on this guy?

Better not mess with him. He looks dangerous to me.











To be honest, he is a good friend and a great guy.

 

[steamloco76]

My primary FFL is a pretty busy, well stocked shop who will order anything customers want. His rule on incoming firearm transfers, used gun for regular customer $25, new gun for regular customer IF you gave him a chance to order and he couldn't get it $25, $35 for a gun he can get if you beat his price by more than $75. Any new guns people just order are $50 to receive and transfer. Pretty fair in my book, as given the chance he can get 90% of the guns people ask for within the week at prices which are competitive.

 

[webley green]

A few years ago I asked the gunshop attached to the range we were going to at the time about receiving a handgun I wanted to buy. He said - Depends on which handgun you are buying. I replied a SW Model 67. He said Okay, that would be no problem, glad to do it. He said that if it was a Glock or something else he regularly carried the answer would have been no but an old Smith and Wesson revolver, no problem.