Finish Reaming S&W 22LR and 22MRF(WMR)

[Big Cholla]

I have a couple of requests to run thru the procedure that I use when hand reaming 22 caliber cylinders for S&W revolvers. This works for me. Other pistolsmiths might use something different in technique:

I have a rotary head vise with one set of jaws padded with Brownells poly vise jaw liners. I use reamers for both calibers with the cutting shoulder for the rim of the cartridge built in to the reamer. Leave the ejector rod in place as well as the ejector star/extractor. Paint the surface of the ejector star with Dykem around each chamber. Paint the area recessed for the cartridge rim on each chamber with Dykem. I use the Red color because of a better contrast with blued parts and it also works well on stainless steel. I place 5 fired brass in 5 chambers. Then secure the cylinder horizontally in the padded vise pointed outward where you can stand with a good stance for pushing and place the cylinder at about the height of your pushing forearm when it is horizontal. Mount the reamer in a "T" handle that won't allow the reamer to turn in the handle. I use Mobil Cutting oil for both SS and steel cylinders. The couple of times I did aluminum cylinders, I used a cutting lubricant that is specific to aluminum. This job gets messy, so place old shop rags around, under and anyplace they need to be to catch cutting oil runoff. I use a thumb operated oil can for my cutting oil. Have a plastic bowl or cup to point the reamer into and oil it after you have oiled the chamber to be reamed. Every flute of the reamer must be oiled. Start the reamer in the chamber twisting to the right or clockwise. NEVER turn the reamer in reverse for any reason. Cut with constant pressure until shavings are visible at the mouth of the chamber or sooner if you wish. Ease off the pressure on the reamer and start pulling it backwards while continuing to turn clockwise. The reamer will resist the retraction for a few partial turns and then will come loose. Don't drag a cutting edge against any part of the mouth of the chamber. Clean the reamer and the chamber being cut. I use compressed air to clean both and a shop rag to catch the resultant chips and spray. You might use a common pistol patch mounted on a cleaning rod. Re-oil both chamber and reamer and repeat as necessary until the reamer's shoulder is getting close to the surface of the chamber/extractor that the cartridge rim rests against. Watch the Dykem color there closely while gently and slowly turning the reamer in. The instant you see a drag mark on that surface in the Dykem made by the reamer's shoulder stop pushing in and start pulling out. Again clean chamber and reamer. Turn the cylinder if necessary for the next chamber to be cut. Repeat these operations until all 6 chambers are reamed. I use a loaded factory cartridge that I paint with Dykem to identify it and to watch for burrs left inside the chamber for a "no-go gauge". After all chambers are cut, clean and dry with normal cleaning techniques. Then run the one 'no-go' cartridge into all chambers watching for complete seating of the cartridge. If in any chamber you note the cartridge not seating properly then re-ream that chamber being very gentle and careful. I have been known to load all 6 chambers with factory ammo and look carefully for any that are 'high'.

Note, it is of vital importance to almost surgically clean the reamer between uses. I know some smiths just wipe the reamer with a shop rag and then dip it into a jar of cutting oil. I have also seen some of their chambers left with a drag mark from a cutting chip having been left on the reamer. Don't cut the cartridge rim's seating surfaces of the cylinder/extractor any deeper than what they already are. Poor ignition and inaccuracy could result. When done disassemble the cylinder, taking out the extractor/ejector star. Clean everything and relube. Reassemble and place back into your handgun.

This job can be done by a precision machinist on precision equipment using a line bore procedure. It is time consuming and therefore expensive. I have never found an absolute necessity for doing it that way. I have never had a S&W 22LR or a 22 MRF shoot worse and most shot more accurate and one M 617 shot extremely more accurate after this cylinder chamber reaming to 22 MRF.

Of late, I have been reaming 22 LR cylinders for M 617s out to 22 MRF for a conversion caliber/cylinder. I have found the resulting accuracy for 22 MRF shooting thru 22 LR barrels to be startling good. I now have two M 617s one with 4" bbl./6 shot and one with 6" bbl./6 shot. I found an extra cylinder for both and after fitting to the frame reamed them both to 22 MRF. Both when shooting the 22 MRF are at least as accurate as the original 22LR and the 6" is more accurate.

If anyone has a specific question, please PM me and I will try to explain/answer as best I can. ............BC

 

[tomcatt51]

I do and have been doing the same thing for the 22LR cylinders. I use Brownells' Do-Drill cutting oil. It works fine on stainless, carbon steel or aluminum cylinders. Great surface finish with no "polishing" needed. I also use the Manson revolver specific reamer for 22LR as it pilots in the chamber throat. It is definitely important to NOT cut the rim recesses deeper. If in doubt, stop a little short. This is not a difficult process.

Glad to see this finally being accepted as a "good idea" (it is) instead of the flaming I routinely got when first discussing reaming the chambers...

 

[stu1ritter]

pre-snip
Glad to see this finally being accepted as a "good idea" (it is) instead of the flaming I routinely got when first discussing reaming the chambers...

tomcatt51, anyone who would flame you for advocating reaming the cylinders on any S&W .22 obviously DOES NOT OWN a S&W .22 revolver of any sort. They have to be reamed, otherwise you can't get the empty cases out without pounding. I suppose a couple have slipped through manufacturing with accurately cut charge holes, but I doubt it. :~)

 

[50150me]

S&W cylinder reaming 22LR

I have (2) M317 revolvers, my wife's and one for my 90 yr old mother. I messed with them for a wile and found they would only digest Federal ammo with out seizing up. After obtaining a CCW I wanted to carry one but found this little revolver getting worse. Worse meaning the empties could not be ejected unless you beat them out (with harm to your palm).
I sent one to S&W, they replaced the cylinder and that solved the problem. (Just sent the other one back) I had suspected that it was a cylinder problem.
Sounds like it is not just the M317 that has this problem. You would think S&W would recognize this problem. I thought about reaming out the cylinders, but I do not have the smith skills that some of you have displayed. Thanks for your posts.

 

[Fuddham]

Who's chamber reamer are you using for the 22lr?

Thanks
Scott

 

[Big Cholla]

Both of my 22 caliber reamers came from Brownell's. The 22 LR is their catalog no. 513-051-220 marked, "22 LR Finisher Reamer". The 22 MRF is just marked, "22 WMRF Finisher". I no longer have the original packaging. I do not know which reamer manufacturer made either one, but both have given me excellent results. ....... For easiest accomplishment of the desired results in these cylinder re-reamings, it is my opinion that the best design reamer is that with the rim cutting shoulder built in. Reamers are available without that feature, but one immediately comes up square against the problem of how to measure where to stop reaming....and to do that uniformly in all chambers. The shouldered reamer gives that indication to one easily.

 

[tomcatt51]

Both of my 22 caliber reamers came from Brownell's. The 22 LR is their catalog no. 513-051-220 marked, "22 LR Finisher Reamer".

That's the same reamer I have. It's the Manson "revolver specific" (means it pilots off the cylinders' chambers' throat) finish reamer. It's a SAAMI spec reamer which makes it a "sport" chamber not a "match" chamber.

 

[vigil617]

Thanks for the tutorial, Big Cholla. It appears I'm going to need to ream my K22's charge holes, so I'm off to Brownell's to get a reamer now. With your guidance here, I feel very comfortable taking this on myself, and since I plan to own a few more .22LR revolvers in the future, my reamer will pay for itself. Thanks again.

 

[03Fatboy]

I have wanted to do this for some time. Thanks for the information, it is most welcome

 

[vigil617]

Just a follow-up, Big Cholla, on finish reaming the charge holes in my K22 Combat Masterpiece. The job is now done, with positive results, though what I discovered in the process was not exactly what I had expected -- in a good way.

I followed your setup instructions carefully, and the job was easy as pie. Part of the reason for that, though, was that my charge holes apparently were close enough to size that in a couple of them, the reamer dropped in to the point of the recesses, without my even needing to turn it. On the others, the reamer would drop in with about 3/8" of flutes remaining for the cut up to the "step" for the recess cutter. A few easy turns of the reamer -- that did not appear to remove any chips, so they must have been microscopic if present at all -- and I had finished my cut.

I used a couple of different makes of new rounds as "go-no go" gauges, and they all dropped in perfectly, so I figured all was well. I was able to confirm that today at the range, shooting about 70 or so rounds of CCI Mini-Mags without any problems with sticking as I had had before.

While the spent casings wouldn't exactly "slide right out," just a little pressure on the ejector rod end with my finger would pop all six out easily.

I'm calling this a success. Thanks much for the good description of how to go about this job. Really, the hardest part of it was getting the stuff together to do it with: buying the reamer from Brownells, finding a source for a small quantity of cutting fluid (I used Tap Magic, available at most all industrial supply stores, in a can about the size of a deck of cards), and finding a tap wrench handle that would hold the reamer securely enough since it has a flat only on one side of the round shank. (As it turned out, the four-jaw one I found was able to hold the reamer tightly enough since there was so very little material being cut out.)

One more bit of advice to echo what Big Cholla said: concentrate on what you're doing, and avoid the natural tendency to want to reverse the direction of the reamer when extracting from the hole! (I admit, I lost concentration while things were going so well, and made a couple of backwards turns on one hole before catching myself and turning the correct way. )

Turning the reamer in a clockwise direction is correct; you just have to remember to keep doing that while lifting it back out of the hole.

 

[H Richard]

That's basically the same procedure I use, with the cylinder in the padded vise pointing slightly down so the cutting oil drains out. I remove the cutter several times and clean while cutting each chamber. I did start using a cold blue on the chambers after reaming. I just cleaned them well with brake/parts cleaner and took a Q-Tip dunked in cold blue to paint the chambers. Then follow regular cold bluing procedures.

 

[Shall Not Be Infringed]

I have a couple of requests to run thru the procedure that I use when hand reaming 22 caliber cylinders for S&W revolvers. This works for me. Other pistolsmiths might use something different in technique:

I have a rotary head vise with one set of jaws padded with Brownells poly vise jaw liners. I use reamers for both calibers with the cutting shoulder for the rim of the cartridge built in to the reamer. Leave the ejector rod in place as well as the ejector star/extractor. Paint the surface of the ejector star with Dykem around each chamber. Paint the area recessed for the cartridge rim on each chamber with Dykem. I use the Red color because of a better contrast with blued parts and it also works well on stainless steel. I place 5 or 9 fired brass in 5 or 9 chambers. Then secure the cylinder horizontally in the padded vise pointed outward where you can stand with a good stance for pushing and place the cylinder at about the height of your pushing forearm when it is horizontal. Mount the reamer in a "T" handle that won't allow the reamer to turn in the handle. I use Mobil Cutting oil for both SS and steel cylinders. The couple of times I did aluminum cylinders, I used a cutting lubricant that is specific to aluminum. This job gets messy, so place old shop rags around, under and anyplace they need to be to catch cutting oil runoff. I use a thumb operated oil can for my cutting oil. Have a plastic bowl or cup to point the reamer into and oil it after you have oiled the chamber to be reamed. Every flute of the reamer must be oiled. Start the reamer in the chamber twisting to the right or clockwise. NEVER turn the reamer in reverse for any reason. Cut with constant pressure until shavings are visible at the mouth of the chamber or sooner if you wish. Ease off the pressure on the reamer and start pulling it backwards while continuing to turn clockwise. The reamer will resist the retraction for a few partial turns and then will come loose. Don't drag a cutting edge against any part of the mouth of the chamber. Clean the reamer and the chamber being cut. I use compressed air to clean both and a shop rag to catch the resultant chips and spray. You might use a common pistol patch mounted on a cleaning rod. Re-oil both chamber and reamer and repeat as necessary until the reamer's shoulder is getting close to the surface of the chamber/extractor that the cartridge rim rests against. Watch the Dykem color there closely while gently and slowly turning the reamer in. The instant you see a drag mark on that surface in the Dykem made by the reamer's shoulder stop pushing in and start pulling out. Again clean chamber and reamer. Turn the cylinder if necessary for the next chamber to be cut. Repeat these operations until all 6 or all 10 chambers are reamed. I use a loaded factory cartridge that I paint with Dykem to identify it and to watch for burrs left inside the chamber for a "no-go gauge". After all chambers are cut, clean and dry with normal cleaning techniques. Then run the one 'no-go' cartridge into all chambers watching for complete seating of the cartridge. If in any chamber you note the cartridge not seating properly then re-ream that chamber being very gentle and careful. I have been known to load all 6 or 10 chambers with factory ammo and look carefully for any that are 'high'.

Note, it is of vital importance to almost surgically clean the reamer between uses. I know some smiths just wipe the reamer with a shop rag and then dip it into a jar of cutting oil. I have also seen some of their chambers left with a drag mark from a cutting chip having been left on the reamer. Don't cut the cartridge rim's seating surfaces of the cylinder/extractor any deeper than what they already are. Poor ignition and inaccuracy could result. When done disassemble the cylinder, taking out the extractor/ejector star. Clean everything and relube. Reassemble and place back into your handgun.

This job can be done by a precision machinist on precision equipment using a line bore procedure. It is time consuming and therefore expensive. I have never found an absolute necessity for doing it that way. I have never had a S&W 22LR or a 22 MRF shoot worse and most shot more accurate and one M 617 shot extremely more accurate after this cylinder chamber reaming.

Of late, I have been reaming 22 LR cylinders for M 617s out to 22 MRF for a conversion caliber/cylinder. I have found the resulting accuracy for 22 MRF shooting thru 22 LR barrels to be startling good. I now have two M 617s one with 4" bbl./6 shot and one with 6" bbl./10 shot. I found an extra cylinder for both and after fitting to the frame reamed them both to 22 MRF. Both when shooting the 22 MRF are at least as accurate as the original 22LR and the 6" is more accurate.

If anyone has a specific question, please PM me and I will try to explain/answer as best I can. ............BC

I just ordered a 6" 617 and an extra 10 round cylinder just for this purpose. I think a 10 round 22 WinMag K-frame would be an awesome varmint pistol. I bought an extra ten round cylinder so I can leave one 22lr and ream the other to 22 WMR. I figured throwing in the 22lr cylinder prior to heading to the range would make for cheap plinking fun. Then, after the range, clean it up, drop in the 22 WMR cylinder, load 'er up with Hornady Critical Defense rounds, and put her in the bathroom hiding spot (I have a hand gun stashed in every room of the house except for one of my bathrooms).

Since .22 WinMag isn't exactly considered a renowned defense round, I eventually plan on building a 4" .327 Mag using a 617 frame, barrel, and 6 round cylinder. At that point, that gun will probably take the bathroom hiding spot, and the 22 WinMag will become just a plinking/varmint gun. Id buy a 632, but J-frames aren't my cup of tea...because they don't fit my hands very well.

I like the 617 platform, because it's as close to a blank as you can easily get. With a bit of machine work, one can turn it into one of numerous chambers that a stainless k-frame can easily withstand.

Anyway... Thanks for this thread, because all it did was stoke my already-raging desire for a 10 round 22 WinMag. Smith and Wesson misses the boat on a lot of chambers. I'd still love for them to make version of the Taurus Raging Judge. The Governor is cute and all, but nothing says "wrong house, mother f***er" quite like an X-frame-size .410/45LC/.454 Casull.

The funny thing... I never even really liked revolvers until I had fired a buddy's 6" 686 two years ago. I was instantly bit with the bug.

 

[BC38]

What is the pressure comparison between the 22WMR and 22LR? Obviously this reaming has proven safe in a S&W, but what about other brands. Say a High Standard double nine for example? Would it be safe to do the same thing?

 

[steelslaver]

The problem with building a 327 or any.other center fire on a rim fire frame is the firing pin location. I plan to build one at some.point myself. I will start with something like a model 14 frame and use a 22 cylinder. So me worry about lining a barrel for a.32 magnum. I will do it by threading a life of 312 barrel and making the original barrel into a shroud that fits over the large or insert in front of the frame

 

[Shall Not Be Infringed]

The problem with building a 327 or any.other center fire on a rim fire frame is the firing pin location. I plan to build one at some.point myself. I will start with something like a model 14 frame and use a 22 cylinder. So me worry about lining a barrel for a.32 magnum. I will do it by threading a life of 312 barrel and making the original barrel into a shroud that fits over the large or insert in front of the frame

Yeah... I typed that wrong. I'm actually using a model 66 stainless centerfire k-frame for the 327 mag...not a 617 rimfire. Just using a 617 cylinder and barrel. I actually got a steal of a deal on an m-66 (divorce sale ftw) a few month ago, and since I already have an L-frame 686+, I don't really need another 357 mag, and I don't have a 327 mag...so the m-66 has a new purpose.

 

[buckyjames1]

Decided to give this a whirl and am at a dilemma, by no means and expert but an eager beaver to learn:

Project:
617 10 round want to ream to .22WMR. I have reamed/honed .357mag, .22LR, have all the tools but here is my problem with the 617 10shot cylinder,

1. I reamed to the extractor face (with spent cartridges in holes to better secure star) and each cylinder hole felt good and accepted the .22WMR round but as I loaded each successive cylinder, the rounds began to stair step up in depth, as in the rounds would not seat at level with the rim of the next round it.

2. I thought, well ..maybe needs to go alittle deeper, so I repeated ream on each cylinder, again...individual round would seat but successive rounds would stair step up in seating depth.

3. Since I judged the cylinder trashed, I decided to remove extractor and "Go Big" just to see. Again same result but less pronounced.

4. I then tried reaming alittle from the star/extractor and...well that was a learning experience...its trashed.

Perhaps the 10 round cylinder does not have enough space/gap for the rim of the bigger .22mag in between cylinders or I am doing it wrong. Or perhaps I just need to go deeper into the cylinder?

I am not giving up, just wondering if anyone has done this to a 10rd 617 cylinder as opposed to a 6rd.

 

[Big Cholla]

You are right, the 10 round cylinder does not have enough space between chambers to be reamed to 22 mag and than have the rims fit next to each other with random cartridges out of the box. I made a mistake on my op back in '15. Sorry to have mislead you. The 6 round cylinder is the only one that lends itself to be rechambered.

I recently posted about doing some research on the diameters of various manufacturer's 22 Mag. I found that about 20 to 25% of Federal 22 Mag is small enough to allow a ten shot rechamber job to 22 Mag. to work. But, That would involve purchase of a lot of Federal 22 Mags and then measuring and separating out the smaller ones. I wasn't willing to do that so, junked the research. I also then figured out that one could rechamber every other chamber to 22 Mag and have a handgun that shot 22 Mag, 22 LR, etc. for the ten rounds.

I found that CCI 22 Mags had the largest rim diameter of five manufacturers.

 

[buckyjames1]

Ok...kewl, I don't sucks quite as much as I thought.
Isn't a total waste, I reamed my Ruger convertible and will probably do my NAA PUG as well. Gained alittle experience so all is not lost.

I just measured diameter of some .22mag: .291 +/- depending on manufacture, .22LR were various but .266 +/-

Is fitting/timing a 6 shot do-able for my original 10 shot?

 

[Toyman]

Big Cholla did 2 of my S&W a model 17 and model 18, both were very tight. I took to range and fired 60 rounds through each and a great difference in extractor. If you do it your self go slow and plenty of oil.

 

[Big Cholla]

Yes, BUT.....

Ok...kewl, I don't sucks quite as much as I thought.
Isn't a total waste, I reamed my Ruger convertible and will probably do my NAA PUG as well. Gained alittle experience so all is not lost.

I just measured diameter of some .22mag: .291 +/- depending on manufacture, .22LR were various but .266 +/-

Is fitting/timing a 6 shot do-able for my original 10 shot?

Yes, but it is going to require the changing of a couple of internal parts. Then you won't be able to go back to the original 10 shot cylinder without again changing those parts.

And, I'm sure that you know about the change in engineering on the extractor star design. S&W started out with the old faithful design when introducing the M 617 and then changed mid dash number to the newer design. On these cylinder swaps, replace "like" with "like" unless you want to overhaul the internals again.......