Fun With Glocks, or Not

After my friend shot off his finger (Post #63) and I got rid of my G17 the only semi auto I have is a Ruger LCP w/an 8 lb. double action trigger, similar to my 340PD. The Taurus TCP .380 is going to a friend & the LCP will become my EDC.
 
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Walkingwolf said:
Dry fire practice is safe with a proper backstop, and only with a proper backstop. All safety rules should be followed. Drawing exercises should be done with a non firearm. With a non firearm there is no way for a gunshot wound, or property damage.
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I agree that with a simulated/plastic training tool you can't create any damage through ND. However, if the rules I posted earlier are followed, dry practice can be done with a real firearm.

As with anything with guns, there is a element of danger. We stress safety as much as we can. I take it to the extreme and get a lot of flack over that. Even so, I see a lot of value in dry practice with the gun you're going to carry. The weight, feel of the grip and feel of the trigger cannot be simulated. There are many things a person can do to make the gun safe. Some companies even sell dummy barrels just to take it to the next level.

If you keep the ammunition separate and NEVER take live ammo into the designated dry practice area, you'll be safe.
If you ALWAYS follow the 4 rules, you'll be safe.

Those are two enormous "ifs" and complacency gets us all at some time or another (see video in the OP). So, again, I don't disagree with what you said, I just think there is a time when it can be safe to use a real gun.
 
TomkinsSP said:
Bang, oops is simply tragic for everyone involved.

I certainly see the point of having a blue gun to practice disarming an assaliant, hand to hand, retention, securing a prisoner, searching a prisoner etc.

Blue guns are an approximation, perhaps a very good one, of the real thing, they are not made of the same composition, thier buttons and levers, triggers, hammers and slides do not move. If you (or the factory) put different than standard grips or sights on your weapon it will holster differently. The weapon may bind or snag or be very different holstering and unholstering because of greater or lessened friction. You need to know BEFORE you really need your firearm. S&W has manufactured six million M10s. But the only important one is the one in YOUR holster. It is the one you should be practicing your draw and fire from consealment, using snap caps of course.

Lots of people have been surpised when they heard boom upon pulling the trigger of a firearm they thought had an engaged safety. Lots of people have been shot by guns they thought were unloaded. Lots of people have died in automobiles 20 feet from a stop sign because they stopped and then proceeded thoughtlessly. People do stupid caca. Mechanical things, threshers, cars, airplanes, construction cranes, firearms are famously unforgiving of careless behavior. One must have ones brain engaged when doing potentially dangerous tasks.

I see why organizations love blue guns. And if you feel safer at home practicing with a blue gun that's great. But if Dave Dodobird thinks he can ignore safe firearm handling practices and still be safe because he only ever uses a blue gun, he isn't unless he also CCWs a blue gun.
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Why would 9 fingers want to pull the trigger in his living room. In an environment such as his there is no way he should of had anything to do with the trigger. Since there is no safety on a Glock that is a moot point, plus it would be the act of a moron to take the safety off in their living room to practice a draw.

What he did was reckless, and stupid, and should have never happened. He is lucky he is not facing charges for injuring someone as the officer who killed the librarian.
 
Not to be a jerk but...

If you never unholster your carry weapon except for maintenance, cleaning, storage, range use or SD, and always use a blue gun for non firing practice, do you have one or two holsters?

If you have one you are mixing a facimilie of your carry weapon with your carry holster, and handling a live weapon +1 time. So if you unload it when you unholster it, you are handling a live weapon EXACTLY THE SAME NUMBER OF TIMES.

If you use two holsters, then neither the gun nor the holster is the Real McCoy, and could be very different in several ways impacting the value of training/practice.

Yes, swapping live ammo for snap caps is a place where the inattentive could create havoc. But if one is not willing to be attentive when handling a live weapon, one could just as easily shoot himself swapping the blue gun in or out, and should perhaps rethink the wisdom of ever having a live weapon around.
 
Walkingwolf said:
Blue guns fit the exact same holsters that the gun they match.
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My point is that an XYZ 231 handgun has a brushed stainless steel slide and a glass filled nylon frame, in addition to the fact the trigger and slide move, it has buttons to release the slide and the magazine, they move. Maybe you put different sights or grips on your XYZ 231, maybe you smoothed out a rough edge or three. The blue gun is a different homogeneous piece of a different material than the real thing. How different, I don't know, but you can't do exactly the same things with a replica.

If you are practicing a technique less related to the characteristics of that individual firearm, say how to retain a weapon or fend off a blade attack the blue gun is perfect. If you are a policeman practicing returning your weapon to a holster in order to search a suspect, again perfect. If you are drawing YOUR M640 from concealment and in a single fluid motion acquiring and dry firing at a target, it's less than perfect. That's all I am saying.
 
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TomkinsSP said:
My point is that an XYZ 231 handgun has a brushed stainless steel slide and a glass filled nylon frame, in addition to the fact the trigger and slide move, it has buttons to release the slide and the magazine, they move. Maybe you put different sights or grips on your XYZ 231, maybe you smoothed out a rough edge or three. The blue gun is a different homogeneous piece of a different material than the real thing. How different, I don't know, but you can't do exactly the same things with a replica.

If you are practicing a technique less related to the characteristics of that individual firearm, say how to retain a weapon or fend off a blade attack the blue gun is perfect. If you are a policeman practicing returning your weapon to a holster in order to search a suspect, again perfect. If you are drawing YOUR M640 from concealment and in a single fluid motion acquiring and dry firing at a target, it's less than perfect. That's all I am saying.
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I would say shooting off a finger, or killing an innocent elderly woman is less than perfect. Or as the Chief of Fayetteville police making a complete fool of herself is also less than perfect.
 
Oh I like when he said: "I was a cop". Hmmm, that makes we experienced police officers wonder? A bit too young to retire, didn't say medically retired, nor did he say he retired. I wonder if this is a case of; 'resignation in lieu of.....' ???

When we hear "former" or "ex-cop" that usually indicates there was an underlying issue with his employment. Notice I said usually, not clumping everyone together like it's a bad thing. But, there usually is 'some reason'.
 
I knew a reserve deputy with a severed thumb, the sheriff's office would not hire him fulltime because of the thumb. He cut it off not respecting a lawn mower blade while the engine was running.

I suspect that during his recovery from shooting himself he was offered the opportunity to step down.
 
I have a Gen 1 Mdl 17 and have lost track of the number of rounds I have sent down range over the last 20+ years with this pistol. No mishaps of any kind..... period. I did try a 2 lb transfer bar in it once... it came out before I left the range..... dropped it in the trash as I went out the door.
The number one safety is between the ears. There are only excuses for an ND... there will never be a reason.
 
Hello, interesting, I’ve always been a 1911 and revolvers kind of guy, I never really cared for Glocks until the last few years that said I have carried a g19, a g23 is my nightstand gun and I just got a g30sf yesterday. But every time I put a Glock in my holster IWB or OWB my mind would go into panic mode! That’s the only time I fell it COULD go off ( clothes getting in the trigger guard).
Letting the path of least resistance kick in, I mostly carry a MP 9C or 40C with a thumb safety! My 1911 thumb Safety memory is alway there.
I think a lot of people collect S&W and carry a GLOCK, me included.
Semper paratus
 
TomkinsSP said:
Well if they carry the Glock appendix, one of the other two may be moot.
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BECAUSE, please be aware, carrying AIWB automatically means the gun can go off by itself while sitting in a Kydex holster. Really?

Make no mistake. Glocks are the only gun that can do this, and no amount of training, experience, or millions of draws and reholstering of AIWB carried Glocks can overcome the fact that a few idiots may have had NDs carrying Appendix, but no more in reality than careless, inexperienced idiots who have NDs carrying in other positions.

Truth filter: with proper training, holster and care, AIWB is absolutely just as safe as any other method of carry. In fact, because reholstering is so visible, and with a slight forward push of the hips while slowly and carefully reholstering (As should be done with all methods of carry) I am more confident that
A. I will not have an ND and
B. If I did have an ND, the bullet would not strike any part of body.

Knowledge is power. Not everyone can carry AIWB, but it is because they lack confidence (gained through actual training, experience and having the right equipment) and/or (lack of) body shape.

The generilzation that AIWB, especially with Glocks, is dangerous is based on emotion, not facts.

I carried deep appendix in Thunderwear for 21 years. I have carried various guns, including a Glock 19, FS M&P and a Shield AIWB in Kydex without fear. I am confident but careful. My finger is off the trigger when I draw (no holster retention device other than friction). I reholster thinking: clear path to holster; pointed away from me. Lots of practice with my unloaded guns.

Everyone has a right to their opinions and choices, but the majority of people who decry AIWB are fear mongers without personal experience. Those who have done it successfully still have a healthy respect for concealed carry in any position, but like me prefer it to any other position because done right, we believe it is actually safer.
 
Nothing against IWB (or thunderwear), not saying Glocks spontaneously fire. Just saying that if someone is an idiot, and would be prone to have a ND holstering or unholstering, one where they might shoot off thier pointer finger, that IWB (and thunderwear) offers another appendage...

I like J frames and OWB and green four door sedans. That does not mean I think people who like Glocks and IWB and red sports cars are wrong. Nor do I think most people who drive red sports cars are mouth breathing idiots. I think either a red sports car or a green four door sedan can kill you if you don't respect them.

But I do think Glocks like red sports cars are popular. And mouth breathing idiots who can't spell GUN buy them and then proceed to do idiot things like shoot themselves. Of course that is no more the Glock's fault than the red sports car's fault.
 
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I own one Glock, a Gen5 G19, and it's a wonderful pistol. Yes, I do pay close attention while carrying it and reholstering, but isn't that what we are supposed to do? Both of my Shields have the external safety, but I still treat them as if they don't. JMHO.
 
There are a good many people who are too incompetent to drive a sports care, especially with manual transmission.

While everybody who can afford it can buy a semi tractor trailer, not all people can safely drive one.
 
Walkingwolf said:
There are a good many people who are too incompetent to drive a sports care, especially with manual transmission.

While everybody who can afford it can buy a semi tractor trailer, not all people can safely drive one.
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John F Kennedy's son could afford to buy a very nice little airplane, apparently he did not know how to fly it.
 
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