Garand prices all over the map?

[LVSteve]

A coworker inherited a Garand recently. I've yet to see it to get details but I thought I would do some initial research on prices. I am in no way a Garand expert so I've been using comments from various boards as to what is desirable and collectible.

Good grief, after an hour going through recent sales on Proxibid I didn't know if I was batting or pitching. Here's just some of the goings-on.

Honest looking (lots of good pictures) WWII SA example. Matching wood with a few dings, $850. Seemed like a good baseline.

Next auction had two welded receiver mixmasters in multicolored wood and they went for $950. WTH??? The Fulton Armory site would consider those very expensive wall hangers.

Then there was a H&R with just two pictures that sold to an onsite buyer for $1600!!! Bidding war in the room?

I did notice a few trends and if the experts would pass comment I'd be very grateful.

Anything with Winchester on it fetches more money.

Post Korean war builds seem to go cheap.

LMC barreled guns attract money.

Rebarreled guns either fetch crazy money or can barely be given away. Some aftermarket barrels are clearly preferred to others, and the Vietnam era rebuilds don't generate much interest.

All comment welcome!!

 

[jack the toad]

Having owned maybe 10+ M1's (mostly DCM/CMP), I can say that this thread should be interesting. Currently, I'm down to 2 (late WW2 and prewar). The war-time appears to be all SA, including the original 1945 barrel which measure a tight 3 on TE/MW.

 

[mauser9]

Interesting indeed! I don't own one but I have heard Garands are very popular among shooters/collectors lately. The prices sure reflect it. In fact many milsurps fetching big money lately. I won't even mention k98ks as prices have really skyrocketed. Seems like most milsurps have contracted "mauseritis.

 

[NYlakesider]

I too have seen prices all over the place. Heard horror stories of parts guns and Bubba specials. I do not claim to know much about Garands, so decided to stay away.

Just recently I was in a LGS and bought a new MIA. Yes its .308 instead of 06 and has a detachable mag but it satisfied my cravings for a MI, I can trust what its parts are and for a fact its very accurate. Not much chance of getting a MI thumb with that rifle!

 

[vonn]

CMP 850.00 mostly sold out but field grade

 

[cmansguns]

You will need a LOT more info

I've been an avid Milsurp collector for more years than I've been a S&W accumulator/collector and when it comes to M1's...they are even a little tougher than 1903 A3 Springfield.

First and foremost is forget even looking at pricing (either asking or closed auctions)....there are too many variables....and even the best and most honest of the adds cannot even begin to touch on all the parts, the various OEM's, the proof marks (hidden and obvious).

Do what you are doing....some research AFTER you have actually gotten the best description possible and pictures if you can't see it in person of the M1 your thinking about.

Get some decent reading material: The M1 Garand, or the M1 Garand: Post World War II, by Scott Duff. There are many other excellent books out there dealing specifically with M1 and its variations.

2. Unless you are willing to START at $4000 forget about all numbers matching, original dated bbl, op rod, trigger housing, cartouched original wood, M1 Garands, either WWII (Springfield/Winchester) or Korean War (H&R, Int'l Harvester Co.).

3. If you do spot one of the above and it is in decent condition, and up for less than $2000......its a fake, or at minimum a mixmaster of all kinds of parts and wood...which is OK if you want a shooter.

4. M1 original WWII are getting quite scarce. Older collectors/shooters like myself have either passed on, or moved into different facets of firearms and their treasures are gobbled up quite rapidly. Some states have enacted 10 round mag limits on rifles...so the en-bloc 8 round Garand clip still fits.

You are right....the Winchester early WWII, known as "Winny One" among collectors is a top of the line desire. For real time pricing get on Scott Duffs website...he is a master of Garands, published author, expert rebuilder, and Seller of Garands.

Almost every expert in M1's agrees that at least 95% of surviving Garands have been through either US Army Armory rebuilds (the official program ended in 1967), or DCM (now CMP) overhauls with best parts from several rifles were used with new barrels, new wood sometimes, new parkerization jobs, etc. These are known as mixmasters but are right now pretty highly sought after due to their really decent TE and ME readings if done by Army Depots, or CMP personnel.

My final take is if you are interested and have between $1500 - $2000 then look for a very good condition army depot overhaul from a reputable seller, buy some extra en-bloc clips, purchase ammo made for the Garand (not ALL 30-06 is good for a Garand), and hit the 200 yard range with steel plates...and you'll be amazed at the accuracy of this almost 90 year old rifle!

Mine is a IHC (postage stamp) rebuilt by the Red River Army Depot in January 1966, equipped with SA bbl (dated 1965), IHC trigger group, and Box P (one side open) furniture.

Good luck and here's hoping that your M1 when you see it turns out to have been issued to Gen'l George P. hisself!

 

[Mike 139]

Value is in proportion to grade... Collector grade and National Match are at the top...followed by Correct grade, than Service.as long as it’s accompanied by paperwork.

You can call CMP and they can search the serial to ascertain if it went thru rCMP, or DCM....not all the records from DCM are complete, but it’ll cost $25.00:to find out.

Replacement barrels put on during re-build are fine, as all ammunition ,with the exception of. 30 Carbine was corrosive primed until the early 50s.

LMR, Line Manufacturing, Rifle in Alabama produced very accurate barrels and in HRA and IHC Rifles were original..HRA also produced their own barrels.....The mid- sixties SA produced barrels were of excellent quality and also very accurate. The receiver leg/ Stock is frequently stamped by the re-build facility.

A lot of Garands were sent to Denmark...The Danes replaced the Barrels as needed with their own, marked VAR....I had one on my JCG Rifle and it consistently shot in the mid- 400s @ 200 yds. using Danish AMA surplus...

Value depends on condition and original parts, Muzzle and Throat erosion readings on a gauge....checking wear patterns and differences in the finish....a lot of fake/ reproduction stamps, especially on WW2 stocks, and people looking to separate you from your money.

General Patton described the M1 Garand as “The greatest battle implement ever devised”....

 

[Bullet Bob]

But I doubt the good general had to hump one very far.

 

[deadin]

OK, How about a Danish mixmaster with a VAR barrel??

 

[SRG]

Just like collecting Smith's, with Garands the devils in the details.

Consider trying to figure a fair price for a K Frame .38 Special. What era is it from? Is it a run of the mill model or some rare/desirable variation? Is it original or rebuilt/refinished. Are you looking for a collector gun of a shooter?? Big difference in price from an nice original 2" Pre-War M&P and a refinished 1970's vintage 4" Model 10 with after market grips.

 

[Faulkner]

Like several others posting here I've been wheeling and dealing and collecting USGI firearms now for about 30 years. I favor M1 carbines but I have owned a fair share of M1 rifles and M1903's through the years and currently own several of the nicest ones I've acquired.

If you're going to dilly-dally in USGI firearms blindly you can easily loose your wallet, but that does not mean that you have to fork out a fortune either. I ALWAYS tell people who come to me for input and advice that they should do their own research, not on-line, but using two or three of the many books on the subject that are available. Heck, if you're willing to fork out a grand or more for a USGI firearm, spending 50 or 60 bucks for a good reference book is a wise investment.

LVSteve, you spotted one thing pretty quickly though, the Winchester name (in both M1 rifles and M1 carbines) seem to bring a better price all other things being equal. Why? The branding of the Winchester name. I.B.M. and Rock-Ola carbines generally bring a better price too yet there's not a lick of difference with regard to quality or shootability between any of the USGI carbines, same for Garands.

Lastly, I've bought all of my USGI firearms face to face. A few at gun shows (sometimes in the parking lot going to or from my car), a few more at estate sales, and the rest by word of mouth. I won't buy one unless I can hold it in my hands and inspect it first, and yes I may have missed some nice ones on-line, but I've never gotten stuck with a mis-represented overpriced on-line auction either. I have walked away from several after holding them in my hands and could tell they weren't up to my standards for the price.

My final advice, get a reference book or two . . . did I say that already?

 

[Mrnurse]

Been a DCM/CMP guy from 1982 on. Still got my 1 a life time Garand. in 2004 to 2006 I gought about 24 rifles from CMP Alabama, Price from 295 to 495...the SG back then were flat MINT HR/SA post ww2 rifles. I sold most off years later to pay Bills for my Kids College. A clean HR all matching brings 1600 to 2000, Nuts in my world as optics are a challenge other then a scout mount (which I have on my SA). Got rid of most my M1a's and Garands, I need optics... a AR10 Platform will out shoot them all day.

 

[Zarr]

FWIW: When I was interested in learning more about the Garands, I hung out on the CMP Forum. You will learn a lot about the M1 in the Garand section of that forum, including what books to read/stay away from. The help I received there is similar the the expert advice on this forum. In fact, I'd be willing to bet much of that advice was given by some of the same collectors on this S&W Forum. Good luck!

 

[Igiveup]

My wife and I each got one from the DCM/CMP (don't remember which) from the Anniston arsenal. The cost was $165. Both SA, one has been sold and the other is still in the box it arrived in. I think it is a 1965 rebuild. I will shoot it one of these days.

 

[rwsmith]

I thought Garands.....

...were averaging around $1200 in good condition.

I'm more interested in M1 Carbines, but I doubt at this stage I would get one. Garands are so front heavy they wear me out shooting them offhand.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Going back to the period 2001 to 2006 or so, I made a point of purchasing every M1 rifle I was allowed by CMP rules, which varied from year to year. I ended up with SA, Winchester, International Harvester, and Harrington & Richardson rifles, as well as a couple of Danish returns. These were all "luck of the draw" purchases, next one off the pallet shipped to fill the order, and prices ranged from about $400 to $500 each.

Best shooter has been one of the Danish returns, a 1941 SA completely rebuilt by the Danes with VAR-crown barrel and new stock serial numbered to the receiver.

Probably most interesting to me is a "Win-13" series, Winchester receiver numbered in the range of serial numbers duplicated by Springfield Armory during WW2 production. 1952 Korea-era rebuild with SA barrel and a few mismatched parts.

Probably the rarest is the International Harvester, with original barrel and otherwise correct overall. Only the trigger group was mismatched, and one of my other buys had the IH trigger group, so "voila"!

Prettiest is the HRA, original barrel and a very light colored birchwood stock correct for the period, and 90%-plus condition.

All of them were "service" grade rifles, nothing particularly special about them at the time of ordering. However, today they are all extremely desirable collector pieces, especially with the CMP certificate of authenticity as provenance showing they came directly to me from the US Army Depot in Anniston, Alabama.

I also caught several of the last of the Springfield rifles, M1903 and 03/A3, about 2004 or so. Many of these spent decades in ROTC units or ceremonial use (VFW, American Legion, etc), but one appears to be nearly as-issued condition (1942 Remington 03/A3). None were priced over $400 or so when I purchased them, and a couple of the M1903's were less than $300 at the time (low serial numbers, not recommended for firing due to receiver heat treatment methods of the time).

I consider all of these rifles to be historic artifacts. I also consider them to be part of my retirement fund! I would be surprised if I couldn't double my money on any one of them!

No, they are not for sale.

 

[cgt4570]

I think my mixed-master with post-war barrel CMP SA 400,000 range SN originally produced in Oct '41 (Pre-WW2) cost me like $275 at Anniston several years ago. It would sell for 3-4 times that today. I also picked up a nice Inland carbine in the 400,000s, a 1903 and a 1903A3 back when they were available. A fellow gun club member scored an awesome 1898 .30-40 Krag that came from a VFW honor guard around the same time.

 

[LVSteve]

I'm beginning to think that I'm not the kind of milsurp collector who would be welcome on the CMP forum. For starters, if the army rebuilt your Garand with mixed parts, those parts contribute to its history, so don't go "fixing" it. I also don't buy into the Winchester mystique. I didn't buy into it with the M1917 and P14 rifles I own, so why should I with the Garand. As for which refurb facility a gun went through, my concern for a rat's patootie applies.

I'm just after a representative of the type in working order. I talked myself out of just such a gun a few years ago, and now I'm regretting it given the way the market has gone, and not just because of the price. The more I read about the M1 "scene", the more I am reminded of an old biker saying. "You can slide further on BS than you can on gravel".

Whatever, I shall go and look at this gun, gather what info I can and decide whether to buy it. If not, I shall give what advice I can on pricing should they decide to sell it.

Thanks to all for the advice and insight.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

I really liked going to the CMP store in Annisto, AL.. Back when the racks were full of garands, carbines and 03 Springfields. Then they had all the Greek 30/06 HXP ammo you could want. We always came back with a trunk full. Sadly carbines are gone and Garands are severely limited and all the HXP is gone.

 

[LVSteve]

OK, How about a Danish mixmaster with a VAR barrel??

This is a perfect example of a polarizing gun in Garand circles.

Some will say: "Mixed parts! Foreign barrel!!! Import marks!!! Oh, the horror".

By contrast the shooter crowd love 'em.

Me: "Does it work and is the stock solid?"