Gen 3’s are Coming back !

[MattyD380]

I think the hammers and the triggers were already MIM by late 3rd gen production. Not sure what else was--if anything.

Maybe you could do the sear as MIM? I think the levers could definitely be done as MIM. Maybe the extractor? Maybe the trigger bar/bow (whatever)? Mag release... certain pins and plungers... seems like those could be done in MIM.

Seems like maybe the slide-stop would still need to be steel... but who knows.

 

[Trooper224]

I think the hammers and the triggers were already MIM by late 3rd gen production. Not sure what else was--if anything.

Maybe you could do the sear as MIM? I think the levers could definitely be done as MIM. Maybe the extractor? Maybe the trigger bar/bow (whatever)? Mag release... certain pins and plungers... seems like those could be done in MIM.

Seems like maybe the slide-stop would still need to be steel... but who knows.

The hammer, sear and trigger were MIM. The slide stop can be and often is on other brand guns. I don't know if it ever was on the later 3rd gens, but I wouldn't be surprised. Extractors, never. That's been tried by other companies with negative results.

 

[GaryS]

My son has a Remington 870 with a MIM extractor. We were out shooting one day and the gun stopped ejecting shells. The hook on the extractor snapped off.

When I bought the replacement I spent a few more dollars at Brownells for the "police" steel version. Well worth it.

The hammer, sear and trigger were MIM. The slide stop can be and often is on other brand guns. I don't know if it ever was on the later 3rd gens, but I wouldn't be surprised. Extractors, never. That's been tried by other companies with negative results.

 

[stansdds]

My son has a Remington 870 with a MIM extractor. We were out shooting one day and the gun stopped ejecting shells. The hook on the extractor snapped off.

When I bought the replacement I spent a few more dollars at Brownells for the "police" steel version. Well worth it.

MIM is good for a lot of parts, but not all parts, and MIM parts must be properly molded and heat treated in order to be durable.

 

[BAM-BAM]

A thread that in the end is.............. we just have to wait and see!!

 

[MattyD380]

I think HK uses MIM extractors. But I think they're designed from the ground up to be MIM.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

A couple of thoughts about comments people made in this thread.

I'm reasonably sure that the last production runs of 3rd Gens were machined on CNC machines. On the last tour i went on in 2012 all of the old machines were gone and the guide said that S&W had over 100 CNC machines in Springfield.

It's possible that the older equipment had been moved to Houlton since 3rd Gen production was moved there at some point. My 3914DOA was built in Houlton and has a 2015 date on the box.

I only found out about the metal frame M&P in this this thread. Are those frames forged or are they cast? I assume that they are forged, but I also assume that ths CSX frame is forged.

IF some iteration of the 3rd Gen is reintroduced I would expect it would be the smaller guns geared to personal protection, not larger frame guns intended fo the LE market.


If I were to take my existing inventory of 3rd Gens to the range at the rate of one a week it would take almost three months to gr through them all. So, any new guns would have to fill the extremely small niche i have left. A 4553 would be an example.

Per your last paragraph.......I'm not gonna tell ya how long it would take to that with my S&W's.

 

[4506517]

Lolololololololol.........

All wishful thinking.

 

[GaryS]

I didn't include my revolvers.

Per your last paragraph.......I'm not gonna tell ya how long it would take to that with my S&W's.

 

[Poohgyrr]

An alloy framed 4 1/4" TDA in 45ACP, fitting existing 1911 holsters, 12/13 rounds per mag, would be terrific. Single action could also work.

I expect changes from the 3rd Gen models. Wait and see.

 

[Moo Moo]

1st Generation = 2 digit Model Numbers eg. 39
2nd Generation = 3 digit model numbers eg. 439
3rd Generation = 4 digit model numbers eg. 3904

Any future 4th Generation guns are at least going to have to be 5 digit. How confusing is that going to be.............. 39004?

In my amateur opinion, it would have to be something in 9mm first to test the waters. Something modelled along the lines of the 4006 CHP's. Cut for a Red-dot with 4"and 5" barrels. Colt took their time with the re-launch of their Snake gun Double action revolvers. If it is to actually happen, these are just my thoughts. After all, people are still buying full size metal TDA Beretta 92's, Sig P226's, and CZ75's.

 

[Big Lou]

Well....what about a polymer frame full size model 915?

 

[stansdds]

I see no point in creating polymer receiver 3rd gen style pistols. I'm not even certain it could be done from an engineering standpoint. At best what you might end up with would be a stainless receiver with a baked on plastic coating.

 

[kbm6893]

I see no point in creating polymer receiver 3rd gen style pistols. I'm not even certain it could be done from an engineering standpoint. At best what you might end up with would be a stainless receiver with a baked on plastic coating.

Why couldn't it be done? Sig did it with the 2022. CZ did it with the P07. Beretta did it with the PX4. I'd be fine with a polymer framed 3913 or CS9.

 

[stansdds]

Why couldn't it be done? Sig did it with the 2022. CZ did it with the P07. Beretta did it with the PX4. I'd be fine with a polymer framed 3913 or CS9.

I expect it would need a different barrel locking system, one that did not utilize cams on either side of the barrel and cam blocks on the inside of the receiver, those cam blocks have to absorb quite a bit of impact energy when the slide and barrel move rearward during recoil. It would probably also need a different system for the hammer pin, disconnector, ejector, and firing pin safety levers, something more like a self-contained insert that would fit into the receiver as I doubt it would be possible to make a polymer duplicate of the original style receiver and maintain durability. Now it's not really a third gen pistol, it is a fourth gen with only a few parts interchangeable with third gen pistols.

 

[Frank Black]

An alloy framed 4 1/4" TDA in 45ACP, fitting existing 1911 holsters, 12/13 rounds per mag, would be terrific.

Sounds like a prescription for a hybrid 4566-ish slide mated to a 6900-ish double-stack aluminum frame (?). … Possibly looking somewhat like a 3rd Gen version of Sig's now-discontinued .45acp P227, which was a 10-rd double-stack pistol, but maybe without a railed frame to keep weight and bulk to a minimum (?).

 

[kbm6893]

I expect it would need a different barrel locking system, one that did not utilize cams on either side of the barrel and cam blocks on the inside of the receiver, those cam blocks have to absorb quite a bit of impact energy when the slide and barrel move rearward during recoil. It would probably also need a different system for the hammer pin, disconnector, ejector, and firing pin safety levers, something more like a self-contained insert that would fit into the receiver as I doubt it would be possible to make a polymer duplicate of the original style receiver and maintain durability. Now it's not really a third gen pistol, it is a fourth gen with only a few parts interchangeable with third gen pistols.

I'm no engineer but I imagine they could replicate the steel or alloy frame with one in polymer.

But either way, I'd like a TDA or even a DAO pistol the size of a 3913 or 3953 again. Polymer would be ok by me. I just hope they would take the original mags.

 

[Dino1]

Well....what about a polymer frame full size model 915?

That is just so wrong, totally goes against the concept of what the Gen1,2,3 pistol is about. We are talking about one of the best pistols ever built and you want to destroy it with plastic parts. That in my opinion is not even a viable option. Gen 3's were the best of the best.

Just build it to the original spec and still have a top grade firearm that will last a lifetime. Why destroy a good thing. The Gen 3 was way ahead of it's time and comparable pistols cost upwards of 2K today.

That's something I would expect a Glock fanboi to say.

Plastic.... No way.

 

[toddstang]

My safe has a bunch of plastic pistols.

I'm sick of plastic pistols.

Been spending more than I should on 3rd gen Smiths and at this point I'd be happy to spend +$ on a 4th gen Smith.
My collection of 3rd gens started too late to get them cheap but to the nay sayers I say "Nothing costs too much for those willing to spend the cash to get what they want."
I work for a living and I save for toys that I really like/want.

 

[kbm6893]

My safe has a bunch of plastic pistols.

I'm sick of plastic pistols.

Been spending more than I should on 3rd gen Smiths and at this point I'd be happy to spend +$ on a 4th gen Smith.
My collection of 3rd gens started too late to get them cheap but to the nay sayers I say "Nothing costs too much for those willing to spend the cash to get what they want."
I work for a living and I save for toys that I really like/want.

I'll always prefer metal to plastic as far as pride of ownership, but plastic is lighter so that's what I carry. An alloy framed pistol is close enough to plastic so I'd happily carry one, and sometimes do. But my Shield Plus holds more ammo than my 3953. But if they ever engineered a 3913 to hold 10 rounds without a change in size like they did with the Shield to the Shield Plus, I would own one right away and never carry plastic again. I will just always be more comfortable carrying and handling a hammer fired gun over a striker.

That being said, I splurge on myself every now and then, but I'm not gonna be taken advantage of, either. The days of cheap 3rd Gen's are over but I'm not gonna pay $750 for a used one, either, unless it was a 4506 or a 1006. 5906's are going for north of $700 on GB. I'll make do with the 8 3rd Gen's I have.