Getting an old war horse back into action- S&W 1917 D.A 45

[B_Wilki01]

Hey all! New member here, figured I should come to the source for knowledge beyond my levels!

Backstory:
I got my moms okay to repair my pawpaw's 1 and only handgun he ever had during his life. I never really got to know him unfortunately due to cancer taking him when I was young, but according to my mom he adored me.

My mom learned how to shoot handguns on this at age 6! He had this thing with him everywhere, I believe it rode around in the original WW1/WW2 era holster too, which I think we still have. When he died it was left to my mom. Only problem was, his brother decided that he wanted it and took it. After some convincing, he gave it back, but it has issues.

Based on the SN: 64493 it was made/shipped to the US Army in June 1918.

Issues:
I believe it suffers from a common issue on these 1917's with a bulged barrel. It is about 1 inch down around the back of where it ways D.A 45, right behind the 5. It has also never been apart to my knowledge, seeing as how it is over 100 years old at this point, it's probably pretty rough inside. Good news is, the timing, lockup, endshake, etc. all seem to be very good still, but could use a little tuning.

What I am wanting to do:
I would really like to get a barrel put on it, preferably a stock replacement one and get it tuned if it even really needs it. Being an N frame it probably won't need much. Does anyone have a source on a good example of a barrel? If so, how much roughly would it cost to have a gunsmith look at it/work on it?
I have never had this type of work done before. Being 26, I have taken S&Ws, Rugers, and my 2020 Python down to polish up internals, but that's the extent on my "work".

Thanks for reading, hope I can make my pawpaw proud in getting his gun back going! I know if it was shootable I'd have probably learned how to shoot it at age 6 too!

 

[Baxter6551]

First off, welcome to the Forum and a great family heirloom.
From your photos I see no evidence of a bulged barrel. The rear section between the frame and the lettering is a taper. I would hesitate to replace anyways as the barrel should be serial numbered underneath where the ejector rod sits. The number should match the rest of the serial numbered parts (frame, cylinder and underneath / backside of the ejector star).
Here is a photo of that area on my 1917 commercial for comparison.
You are missing the lanyard loop at the bottom of the frame which are not hard to find.

 

[B_Wilki01]

Glad to be here! Looking down the barrel with a light I can see where it has this odd looking spot. Ran a patch down it a while ago to keep the barrel lubricated for storage and feels like it should, then it gets really easy, almost like there is nothing, then it grabs again.

 

[Baxter6551]

Give the bore a good cleaning with some solvent and a brass brush and try the clean patch test again after that. See if it is any smoother. The odd looking spot could be corrosion or rust ? I know it's very hard to get a photo of the bore. I'm sure others will be along to give their opinions.

 

[Markpixs]

Always the reminder to shoot it first for function/POA-POI test with 230g. rounds. Great family history and not sure i'd change the barrel unless absolutely necessary. Won't group like a model 14 or Gold Cup but minute of man is the design. I have a Remington Nylon 66 I bought cheap due to bulged barrel, at 25yds it's as good as any of its siblings.

 

[Riposte1]

Hey all! New member here, figured I should come to the source for knowledge beyond my levels!

Backstory:
I got my moms okay to repair my pawpaw's 1 and only handgun he ever had during his life. I never really got to know him unfortunately due to cancer taking him when I was young, but according to my mom he adored me.

My mom learned how to shoot handguns on this at age 6! He had this thing with him everywhere, I believe it rode around in the original WW1/WW2 era holster too, which I think we still have. When he died it was left to my mom. Only problem was, his brother decided that he wanted it and took it. After some convincing, he gave it back, but it has issues.

Based on the SN: 64493 it was made/shipped to the US Army in June 1918.

Issues:
I believe it suffers from a common issue on these 1917's with a bulged barrel. It is about 1 inch down around the back of where it ways D.A 45, right behind the 5. It has also never been apart to my knowledge, seeing as how it is over 100 years old at this point, it's probably pretty rough inside. Good news is, the timing, lockup, endshake, etc. all seem to be very good still, but could use a little tuning.

What I am wanting to do:
I would really like to get a barrel put on it, preferably a stock replacement one and get it tuned if it even really needs it. Being an N frame it probably won't need much. Does anyone have a source on a good example of a barrel? If so, how much roughly would it cost to have a gunsmith look at it/work on it?
I have never had this type of work done before. Being 26, I have taken S&Ws, Rugers, and my 2020 Python down to polish up internals, but that's the extent on my "work".

Thanks for reading, hope I can make my pawpaw proud in getting his gun back going! I know if it was shootable I'd have probably learned how to shoot it at age 6 too!

I would shoot it to see how it does. I cannot see any bulge either. I have a 1903 Springfield that has a ring and slight bulge in the middle of the barrel - I have three new in the wrapper '03 barrels and intended to replace the barrel but I shot it - it shot a "one hole" group at 100 yards so I just left it alone!

That is one fine heirloom you have there!

Riposte

 

[Baxter6551]

And to add to posts #4 & 5, you need moon clips to be able to eject the empty cases. You can shoot loose .45 acp ammo but will need a pencil or similar to poke out each fired case from the cylinder. You can also shoot .45 auto rim - those will eject. Here is a link to websites:

Google Search

 

[SgtDog0311]

Good advice here. Mine comes from the single-shot BPCR world, so lots of cast bullets, leading and even a bulged barrel in one 140+ yr old Ballard.

A wire brush wrapped tight with bronze wool followed be a lead-away patch (Birchwood or other) will make sure you don't have a spot of stubborn lead in there where you see the spot that looks odd.

I have a Ballard that a tight patch free-falls about an 1 to an 1 1/2", 5 inches from the muzzle. Enough to distinctly feel but not enough to loose the bullet-spin with rifling or impact accuracy so you'd notice.

If anyone restored the surface I'd want assurances they knew what they were doing so as not to round off edges or dish out screw holes.

I would probable clean it up good and leave as-is. Especially if it shot acceptable accuracy.

 

[stansdds]

Pretty sure I can see the bulge, but the 45 ACP is a pretty low pressure round and the barrel is not subject to nearly as much pressure as the cylinder, so I'd test fire it and see if it really is a problem. I'm guessing it will be just fine with plated and jacketed bullets, cast or swaged lead might be a different story.

 

[austintexas]

I would shoot it before any work was done, If the bulge is back at the start of the barrel there is still 5 inches of good barrel left to stabilize the bullet. Bulged barrels are not the end of the world. Give it a good cleaning and keep it as your grandfather had it. I have my Dads 1911a1 Military Colt that is a mixmaster and have resisted correcting it since 1968.
SWCA 892

 

[B_Wilki01]

I do remember shooting it for function testing not too long ago. It shot well at 7 yards, no insane groupings but not a shotgun shooting bird shot at 100 yards either. No key holing or anything. Concern I have is shooting 230 grain FMJ brass case factory ammo and it finally giving out at that point and injuring me or someone else. Took some better pictures of the problem site too.

 

[Nightowl]

Run your thumb and forefinger along each side of the barrel and you will be able to feel it if there is a bulge in the barrel. You can feel it a lot easier than you can see it. There is a lot of folks on here who have shot bulged barrels and they have shot just fine. Some do not, of course. Note that the rifling is shallow on these as they are designed to shoot jacketed standard ACP hardball military ammunition and the cylinder throats are most likely .454 plus, all of which makes lead bullets less likely to be as accurate as jacketed ammo.

 

[B_Wilki01]

I got the guts to take it apart, after some oil/PB Blaster soaking on it overnight and today, it came apart without issue! No marring of the gun or the screws, although they had to be scraped out due to all the gunk. Used to taking down more modern smiths so the 4 screws on it was odd to me a little

Internals look very good, although worn. I believe it can clean up very well!

 

[KEN L]

Even if there is a slight bulge. I would not replace the barrel. It's not a major issue. It won't affect the functioning of the gun and is totally safe to shoot. Since your gun is a family heirloom, I would keep it original. The barrel is numbered to the gun. Please don't ever refinish it. Clean it up, keep it lightly oiled and don't store it in the holster. It's a great piece of history and will always be a fond remembrance of your mom and Paw Paw.

 

[DETROIT]

It looks good, even if there is a slight bulge early in the barrel the bullet has plenty of barrel left to stabilize it. I would install new springs and leave it as is.. the only thing I might consider doing is boiling the frame and cylinder to convert any rust that's on it.

 

[DETROIT]

This is a good thread to read, well just about every rescue this guy does is worth reading. https://smith-wessonforum.com/threads/homesmith-trainwreck-the-rustbucket.736040/

 

[stansdds]

Concern I have is shooting 230 grain FMJ brass case factory ammo and it finally giving out at that point and injuring me or someone else.

It is unlikely that the barrel will fail when using most factory ammo. The most common 230 grain FMJ loads these days are loaded on the light side, typically producing only 800-830 fps from a M1911. Real GI ammo could produce 850-875 fps in a M1911.

 

[shil]

Clean it well, preserve it, and enjoy owning it. Don't mess with it otherwise. The gun's nearing 100 years old. If the barrel is indeed bulged, it would be interesting to learn the cause, but that's probably lost to the ages.

 

[Protocall_Design]

The cylinder will blow up long before the barrel goes, unless there is an obstruction. That's already happened, and it only bulged the barrel a little bit. See how it shoots as is, it might be OK. If not, then you can worry about finding a barrel. It's as safe to shoot as any normal gun of that vintage.

 

[tkelley3]

And to add to posts #4 & 5, you need moon clips to be able to eject the empty cases. You can shoot loose .45 acp ammo but will need a pencil or similar to poke out each fired case from the cylinder. You can also shoot .45 auto rim - those will eject. Here is a link to websites:

Google Search

I really suggest Half Moon Clips. Full Moon Clips seem hard to get out.