venomballistics
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Solution ....
Out shoot the blowhard
Out shoot the blowhard
Getting vibed at the Range.
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the ringo kid
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Are you really suggesting that a young man with what may be a loaded weapon in his hand threaten to whip an older man who has a loaded weapon with himDoes this sound like a potential recipe for disaster or what
?
Around here, that's called a "Mexican Standoff."
We have recently came across the issue of "range rudeness" at my local club. Some people just have the reputation for being a little short with others, and some just don't suffer fools lightly. Suprisingly the few guys that have the reputation for rudeness are some of the nicest guys once you get to know them but still have a slightly crusty edge to them which I prefer over light in the loafers any day of the week.
Some of the guys are very sensitive to one of our rules requiring all firearms in a case to be uncased at the shooting line with the case pointed downrange and the action open or immediately opened upon the case being opened. About a year ago a new guy with an AR pulled his rifle off the shooting line and slapped it down in its case behind the firing line at the loading bench and for whatever the reason it fired and missed a few guys shooting at the line by a mere couple of feet. The guys that were narrowly missed of course went ballistic and the "shooter" shamefacedly removed himself from the premises and probably will never show his face again.
The common term we use for those overzealous rules people is "range nazi" and oddly whenever the occaison seems right to them they will bend the rules to suit the situation. I spend at least three days a week at the range and am there rarely less than a full 8 hour day. I don't go out of my way to enforce a rule unless I see what I consider a definite safety problem and then I try to be as diplomatic as possible but have found that it is far better to bring the infraction to the attention of a bonifide range officer in order to remove myself from the possibility of being considered rude.
Its so much easier to walk over and tell a guy that the club would appreciate it very much if you left your action open at all times unless actively shooting and in the case of a magazine fed rifle or pistol magazine out. I've had guys tell me the bolt won't stay open and I show them how to use a spent cartridge to block the bolt in the open position and advise them on getting one of those bright orange gizmos that were made for that purpose...there is no substitute for safety, everybody wants to go home to their families after having a good day at the range.
Some of the guys are very sensitive to one of our rules requiring all firearms in a case to be uncased at the shooting line with the case pointed downrange and the action open or immediately opened upon the case being opened. About a year ago a new guy with an AR pulled his rifle off the shooting line and slapped it down in its case behind the firing line at the loading bench and for whatever the reason it fired and missed a few guys shooting at the line by a mere couple of feet. The guys that were narrowly missed of course went ballistic and the "shooter" shamefacedly removed himself from the premises and probably will never show his face again.
The common term we use for those overzealous rules people is "range nazi" and oddly whenever the occaison seems right to them they will bend the rules to suit the situation. I spend at least three days a week at the range and am there rarely less than a full 8 hour day. I don't go out of my way to enforce a rule unless I see what I consider a definite safety problem and then I try to be as diplomatic as possible but have found that it is far better to bring the infraction to the attention of a bonifide range officer in order to remove myself from the possibility of being considered rude.
Its so much easier to walk over and tell a guy that the club would appreciate it very much if you left your action open at all times unless actively shooting and in the case of a magazine fed rifle or pistol magazine out. I've had guys tell me the bolt won't stay open and I show them how to use a spent cartridge to block the bolt in the open position and advise them on getting one of those bright orange gizmos that were made for that purpose...there is no substitute for safety, everybody wants to go home to their families after having a good day at the range.
the ringo kid
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That actually happened to me about 15 years ago when I was walking into The Sharpshooter indoor range here in town. The guy who said it only got a non-committed glare from me and I walked in. As I knew one or two guys working there at the time, they both noticed I unwittingly met the guy known as: "The Complainer." In other words--I wasnt his first "victim."
My case was also locked as well as my ammo--was in a separate ammo can along with unloaded magazines. No way I can think of that the weapon could fire anything that was not in it=or touching it. Oh and if anyone wants to ask/ yes, the ammo can was in the left hand the pistol case was in my right.
First I want to point out for those who didn’t catch it that the OP has stated that he didn’t “muzzle” anyone.
Had it been me I would have told the guy “I don’t think I did anything unsafe can you please tell me what you saw?” that way there’s no question what the issue was and if it wasn’t an issue I’d just go about my business and ignore him.
As for starting fights when you know both parties are armed, I’m sorry but there’s no other word for that but stupid
Had it been me I would have told the guy “I don’t think I did anything unsafe can you please tell me what you saw?” that way there’s no question what the issue was and if it wasn’t an issue I’d just go about my business and ignore him.
As for starting fights when you know both parties are armed, I’m sorry but there’s no other word for that but stupid
DoubleAdobe
Member
Yeah, kind of a self-cancelling sitch.
Vulcan Bob
Member
This is precisely why I sometimes do not comment about stupid and or potentially unsafe behavior by others on the range unless it is really unsafe. Just yesterday I was at the range at the first 25 yard bench sighting in a new .44 Mag load and here he comes, Mr. I do what I want when I want (had other run ins with this one), he sets up to my left at the 12 yard bench. Another fellow and I cease fire and tell him we are clear and if he wants he can go down range and set targets he may. So far so good, after he sets his targets and is back at the bench after the resume fireing call, I load up and commence to fire a five shot string and sure enough after my third shot, Mr. "I do" wanders down range to about five yards from his target, now if I was to continue to shoot my bullets would be whizzing by him about ten feet to his right, maybe he thinks its safe but I know its not. So I unloaded and made safe and went down to the other fellow (a nice older fellow) and we chatted a bit till the offender left. Now why did I not inform him that what he did was unsafe?, I could just tell from his demeanor that he would not understand what the fuss was about and it more than likely would have turned ugly. This was at a unsupervised Sportsman's club range. Sometimes you just have to bite your lip and either leave or remove yourself from the situation.
UncaGrunny
US Veteran
Feeling the irony here...
To the OP, you did right... the range is no place to get in a confrontation if it's at all avoidable - - something your outspoken critic would do well to remember.
Don't let it bother you overmuch, & don't let it wreck your day. Just be careful of your own safe behavior and steer clear of overzealous idiots.
Every social group has its 'hall monitor' types, who are just not happy unless they are telling someone else what to do or criticizing what others are doing. Thankfully, they are usually a small subset, even though they make a stink disproportionate (or even inversely proportional) to their importance.
Are you really suggesting that a young man with what may be a loaded weapon in his hand threaten to whip an older man who has a loaded weapon with him
Natural selection at work.
SgtLumpy
Member
I'm pretty sure the overwhelming majority of shooters who violate muzzle discipline are not aware that they did.
Your comments about "Just a young man" "2nd amendment rights" raises an eyebrow with me. Being "young" has nothing to do with anything. You have no special rights because you're young, nor do I because I'm old. And shooting, or carrying, because you're exercising your 2a rights is not a great reason to shoot (or carry). Shoot to enjoy shooting. Shoot to practice your target skills. Shoot for the sake of shooting, not to make a political point. Consider the possibility that YOU are/were the "bad apple" in this case (others?)
Is it "legal" at your range to case and uncase weapons at the back bench? It's not at any of the several hundred ranges I've shot at. Case and uncase at the bench, ALWAYS with the muzzle pointed downrange. Even to the point of as you open your case and see the muzzle pointing the wrong way, close the case, turn it around and THEN open it.
Clearly the guy thought you did SOMETHING wrong. It's not logical to assume that a total stranger, out of the blue, would yell at you for something he's making up.
Remove shoulder chip. Insert intelligence/safety module. Double check to be sure chip is removed. If you're truly "vibed" after an encounter, pack up and go home. Come back another day.
Stay relaxed. Send lead downrange. It's not a battle. It's not a political demonstration. It's pretty darn pure zen. ONLY thing that matters is that missing bit of paper downrange.
Sgt Lumpy
shouldazagged
Absent Comrade
You do know how to make a point effectively, Sarge.
Yep. Before I retired I worked nights and had days off in the middle of the week. Many times I went to the range and had the place to myself. I still practiced safe firearms handing even though no one was there to watch me. It's a good habit to practice.
Stuckless
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Raccoon Hunters Club out in Romulus.
As a new shooter and cpl holder, I THOUGHT I got the safety rules down, and definitely knew what I felt comfortable with. The 'Coon hunters club was where I figured out what everyone else was comfortable with.
Shooting idpa out there helped with my confidence and shooting, and also taught me how to tolerate the loudmouths (there's always one).
As a new shooter and cpl holder, I THOUGHT I got the safety rules down, and definitely knew what I felt comfortable with. The 'Coon hunters club was where I figured out what everyone else was comfortable with.
Shooting idpa out there helped with my confidence and shooting, and also taught me how to tolerate the loudmouths (there's always one).
REM 3200
US Veteran
This is the bottom line. Years ago I saw a young soldier killed by a careless act on a range. It will not happen again if I can prevent it. If your feelings (OP) get hurt, sorry 'bout that.
ChattanoogaPhil
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This don't sound all that complex of a situation to me.
You are convinced you are in the right... but even if you were not... Sorry bud, I didn't think I had. And then enjoy your time at the range. What else is there to do other than make sure you don't allow it to happen in the future?
What some total stranger thinks, says, or how he says it means nothing other than what you make of it. You were not aware of his human existence before that moment, and if he died today you would never know the difference. Let a stranger ruin your day because of his tone? C'mon... this is the type of thing that grade school girls fret over.
You are convinced you are in the right... but even if you were not... Sorry bud, I didn't think I had. And then enjoy your time at the range. What else is there to do other than make sure you don't allow it to happen in the future?
What some total stranger thinks, says, or how he says it means nothing other than what you make of it. You were not aware of his human existence before that moment, and if he died today you would never know the difference. Let a stranger ruin your day because of his tone? C'mon... this is the type of thing that grade school girls fret over.
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the ringo kid
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Ill tell you of the worst range behavior I ever witnessed. This was back about 1990, and I caught two kids probably only 20-21?/ who were placing live rounds on the range areas where you use to steady a rifle and such--and were placing their rifle right next to the cartridge and firing a shot at it. I overheard one saying how funny the sound was but didnt realize how dangerous it was to do that and the damned thing ricocheted the live cartridge back at them on that last show. I ran them off when I saw that and notified the Deputy who happened to be arriving because apparently those two were doing something they werent supposed to be doing. The Deputy asked me if I knew who they were and they were just getting into their jeep about to drive away. Needless to say, their Carbine was confiscated as well as any ammo, and lucky they were not taken to jail. It turned out the Deputy knew their fathers--one who was a fellow Deputy at the same office. He gave them a dressing down and said he would be contacting their fathers. I never saw those two at the range again.
LoadEmUp
Member
One thing I try to remember and abide by (not always successful of course, but I try) is: You can't control what other people do or say, but you can control your reaction to it.
I hope your future shooting experiences are more pleasant and you can concentrate on enjoying yourself.
I hope your future shooting experiences are more pleasant and you can concentrate on enjoying yourself.
zzzippper
Member
Since the guy didn't bother to teach you the proper way to handle the rifle how are you supposed to know what's right?
Different ranges have different rules. Some will only let you take a weapon to your lane/bench if it is in a case. If that is the rule mark the outside of your case so you always know which way the muzzle is pointing. Uncase it only when you know the muzzle is pointing down range.
The range I hope to use now requires guns to be uncased at your car and they must have an empty chamber indicator in place to show everyone that it is empty.
I say I "hope" to use this range because it has been closed indefinately all summer because a guy accidently shot himself in the leg and the safety rules are being re-written. As much of a jerk the guy was being he thought he was doing the right thing and safety rules exist for a reason.
Different ranges have different rules. Some will only let you take a weapon to your lane/bench if it is in a case. If that is the rule mark the outside of your case so you always know which way the muzzle is pointing. Uncase it only when you know the muzzle is pointing down range.
The range I hope to use now requires guns to be uncased at your car and they must have an empty chamber indicator in place to show everyone that it is empty.
I say I "hope" to use this range because it has been closed indefinately all summer because a guy accidently shot himself in the leg and the safety rules are being re-written. As much of a jerk the guy was being he thought he was doing the right thing and safety rules exist for a reason.
I rarely go to ranges or gun shops anymore and generally hunt alone.I can't tell you how many times Ive been swept by people who should know better and I really don't like what It does to my blood pressure.I figure if some one is oblivious enough to do that,the gun could also be loaded and they've got their finger in the guard.Ive seen several NDs and I don't want one heading towards me.
