Gold boxes?

fat tom

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When did Smith discontinue using them for the .357 Magnum? Was there a particular year,or simply when they ran out of them? :o
f.t.
 
Was there a particular year,or simply when they ran out of them?

I don't think any records exist on the subject. What we know or think we know is kind of conjecture and logic. You'll get a lot of hedging and uncertain terms used when we discuss it.

Basically, we know gold boxes came on the scene right after WWII. The K22s seem to be the earliest ones for a few reasons. First they were probably leading the way with "modern" production in things like the short action (K22 seconds had them first.) We also know that M&Ps retained the maroon box for the first couple of years after the war. From that point, maybe 1948 (OK, probably) there was a transition over to gold boxes.

Your question specifically targets 357s. Those weren't produced in numbers for a while. They were hot sellers. We also can track K22 gold boxes into the 1954 period when we know they changed over to the dull or black/blue boxes. We used to discuss this all the time here. Smithnut preferred to call them pastel, not black. His theory is they faded to black (might be right, too.) We know that when K22s got into the K200,000s, the black boxes appeared. I don't recall seeing any 357 black boxes. We also know that some of the slow moving models like the K32 retained the gold boxes into the 1960s.

To complicate matters more, the guns weren't always shipped in serial number order. The hot sellers were produced in greater numbers and its logical to assume those were the ones to run out of the stock of Gold boxes. When S&W reordered boxes, they didn't order gold ones once they changed to the other ones. By the model number changeover time, as they ran out of boxes the new ones were an even different style of blue.

S&W didn't keep good records, or at least Roy says they didn't as to the kind of box a gun was shipped in. He's often stated they were in the business of selling firearms, not leaving good tracks for collectors a half century away. What we do know is when we find a gun in a box, we need to pay special attention to indicators its wasn't original to the box, or maybe it was. Its about the only way we can learn at this late date.

It looks like the changeover was gradual and took place one model at a time. It also appears some lower number guns/frames were put in newer style boxes while some higher ones got homes in the old style. This could all be related to them not building/finishing guns in numeric order.
 
Basically, no one knows for sure and it gets more diluted as time goes by. With collectors placing guns in boxes and some folks adding end labels, the further we get into the future, the harder it will be to determine what was shipped a certain way and what was assembled.

As Dick stated, S&W manufactured guns in sequential order in serial number blocks, however, once they were placed in the vault or holding area, they were not retrieved or then shipped necessarily in order. The first gun to enter the vault might be serial number 123456 of a 500 gun run, however, the first gun shipped could be serial number 123956. Assuming that boxes and guns were not mated until shipping (and I don't know if this is reality) an earlier style box could have been used up on guns with higher serial numbers and therefore completely distorting the serial number/box style relationship.:eek:

It probably doesn't, but I hope this helps.
 
popular models, faster selling ones, they ran out of boxe that much sooner, the slow ones, ala, K-32 they never did sell them all ,stopped and had LOTS of boxes left over...so one can never tell, yes, they did overlap, and the factory used whatever boxes that had available at the time, to make their shipments, same went for 'service/repairs/returns',we've had some come back in maroon, hinged boxes, so go figure.......as well as every type of metal corners you can imagine as well, my guess, different vendors/suppliers??
we all know they cut back (cost) and reduced their printing costs, so same thing there.......time is money and now its ALL computer generated........besides, plastic cases cost "pennies" to make ( mold) in raw materials.............its the " stamping mold" that costly.......
 
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