Good news/Bad news

[cmj8591]

I think this, at least my, argument is more about what you SHOULD pay vs. what you are WILLING to pay. There is absolutely no way that you can justify to me the ethics of jacking up the price of ammo 250% just because someone is willing to pay it. You can argue legal definitions of gouging, profiteering and free market forces. You can argue that someone who didn't see the end of the world coming and stock up deserves to be taken advantage of, but in the end, charging 600 bucks for a case of 9mm when the real price should be half that is ethically challenged, to put it nicely. If your good with that, then get out your credit card.

 

[Warren Sear]

It is time to put on your big boy pants and deal with reality. Ammo and gun prices and availability are what they are. Pissing and moaning about the situation isn't going to help anything or anyone.

Buy or don't buy, but it is time to let it go.

 

[Jon651]

I think this, at least my, argument is more about what you SHOULD pay vs. what you are WILLING to pay. There is absolutely no way that you can justify to me the ethics of jacking up the price of ammo 250% just because someone is willing to pay it. You can argue legal definitions of gouging, profiteering and free market forces. You can argue that someone who didn't see the end of the world coming and stock up deserves to be taken advantage of, but in the end, charging 600 bucks for a case of 9mm when the real price should be half that is ethically challenged, to put it nicely. If your good with that, then get out your credit card.

Just from the standpoint of basic economics, the determination of profit margin is a calculation each seller has to make for himself. If you are not making enough profit to stay in business you have two choices:

1. Raise your prices to make more profit on fewer sales; or
2. Lower your prices and make less per sale but sell more.

At this point in time when the supply of ammo (including the raw materials to make it) is lean, a seller has no choice but to raise prices and make more profit on fewer sales. Sure he could lower his prices but he can't sell more than he can get because that avenue is closed to him.

Simple maths tell us that if a seller can only get 40% of his former supply then he has to sell it at 2.5x the original price in order to make the same profit (provided he is able to buy it at his original price). And right now, the 40% of former supply seems about right and the 250% in order to maintain margins is in line with the supply available.

 

[Skeet 028]

It is time to put on your big boy pants and deal with reality. Ammo and gun prices and availability are what they are. Pissing and moaning about the situation isn't going to help anything or anyone.

Buy or don't buy, but it is time to let it go.

This is exactly true. I sold the last of the 9mm I am gping to sell. I sold4 boxes for 40 each. The person buying them as adamant..He wanted them and I told him it was too much and I didn't want to sell 'em. Heck even at that price...right now I can hardly replace them....at least locally...unless I am very lucky and I'm not going looking. The real problem for some people is they can't or WON'T go look for their ammo. They would prefer to pay a ridiculous amount just so they have it. Let someone else do the hard work. I don't buy ammo on line and hardly ever in large amounts The last big purchase of 9mm was in March from Cabela's. Bought 3000 rounds as it was cheap ON SALE under 8 bucks.... and I don't load 9mm...I can...I just don't. Between what I have sold used given to family I'm down to just about 20 boxes...and two days ago I got a couple of boxes in a local store where I have never bought ammo. Many LGS are selling very high price ammo as the supply chain is so messed up they HAVE to pay inflated prices to get any...And don't forget after this "shortage" is over the old retail is going to be the new wholesale...it happened before!

 

[Dave Lively]

And don't forget after this "shortage" is over the old retail is going to be the new wholesale...it happened before!

Did it?

I dug out a November 1, 1991 copy of the Shotgun News I found while going through some boxes so old I didn't know what was in them. According to the inflation calculator at U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics inflation drove prices up 87% between November 1991 and November 2019. Listed below is actual price followed by the inflation adjusted price of various types of bulk ammo. Unless noted otherwise all prices are for a 1000 round case of ammo with a reloadable brass case.

Page 145 Atlanta Discount Ammo:
Hansen 9mm, 115 grain - $227(1991) or $423(2019)
Hansen ,223 SS-109 green tip - $307(1991) or $573(2019)
Hansen .223 55 grain FMJ - $199(1991) or $371(2019)

Page 168 K-MAX:
Norinco 9mm, 124 grain $146.50(1991) or $275(2019)
Winchester or PMC 9mm, 115 FMJ $168(1991) or $313(2019)
Norinco .223/5.56, 55 grain FMJ $126.5(1991) or $236(2019)
PMC .223/5.56 55 grain FMJ $174(1991) or $324(2019)

Page 172 Claflin Cartridge Company:
Norinco 9mm, 124 grain $135(1991) or $251(2019)
Norinco .223, 55 grain FMJ $118(1991) or $220(2019)

There were also ads for Berdan primed surplus 308 as low as $.15/round but those days are long gone.

For all you hear about ammo companies permanently raising prices every time there is a shortage I zero evidence of that happening. The only 1991 price that looked like a deal was the Norinco 223. At the time that had the same reputation as steel case ammo does today so some would claim its price should be compared to Wolf or the steel case ammo. But I always thought the Norinco 223 was good ammo for an even better price. My only complaint was the loaded it a little on the hot side.

I think most of the complaints about how expensive ammo is now are due to the way we all tend to remember the good and forget the bad as the decades pile up. The good old days were not always that good. I do miss the cheap surplus ammo but fresh, factory produced ammo was cheaper in 2019 than it ever was before.

 

[OldK22]

This conversation comes up every time there is a perceived shortage or disruption in the supply chain. We have been through it time and time again and I am sad to say "people never learn". The moaning and complaining about mark ups and price gouging is laughable. If the complainers had their way all the Registered Magnums should be selling for no more than they did when they were sold new. Gas should still be $.19 a gallon. Profit, appreciation, no way. The retailers in firearm and ammunition in todays market are struggling to stay in business. I can not imagine trying to be a LGS with the rent and payroll due and my shelves are empty and product is not available for me to replace stock sold. I was in a LGS yesterday that had plenty of ammo. Several dealers were in the store buying ammo to take back to their stores and complaining that the LGS store owner would not cut them a deal on ammo. As stated in numerous post above buy when you can and stack it deep. I was looking for a can of paint to touch up the kitchen cabinets this morning and ran across two ammo cans behind the paint cans. Yes I have had them awhile.

 

[fortyshooter]

Magtech and Blazer Brass 9mm at my LGS for 24.99 yesterday.

 

[fortyshooter]

Glad you don't have a 45 ACP to feed!
.45 ACP Ammo | .45 Auto Ammunition | Cheaper Than Dirt

and VERY glad I've been reloading for it!

 

[cmj8591]

It is time to put on your big boy pants and deal with reality. Ammo and gun prices and availability are what they are. Pissing and moaning about the situation isn't going to help anything or anyone.

Buy or don't buy, but it is time to let it go.

Geez...I'm really sorry that I wasted your time with my pissing and moaning! Of course the simplistic solution, much like your simplistic solution of buy/don't buy, would be don't read the thread if it bugs you!

 

[peterGun]

That's a big chunk of cash but those who are thinking prices are going back to what they were pre corona are in for a rude awakening.

If we see 30 cent 9mm I'll be real surprised.


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[tops]

Glad you don't have a 45 ACP to feed!
.45 ACP Ammo | .45 Auto Ammunition | Cheaper Than Dirt

and VERY glad I've been reloading for it!

I would buy the feed at another store. Larry

 

[Skeet 028]

Did it?

I dug out a November 1, 1991 copy of the Shotgun News I found while going through some boxes so old I didn't know what was in them. According to the inflation calculator at U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics inflation drove prices up 87% between November 1991 and November 2019.

Well before the last shortage primers cost me approx 12 dollars M...after they were 18 dollars yep inflation helped but the wholesale on primers pre pandemic was just a bit below 26 dollars in bulk. If you think you will see 8 dollar/box 9mm again... I have a bridge to sell ya but it is in NY. Powder prices were fair to middling too. But at this point instead of 4 US companies making primers we now have 3. Ammo also at this point in time. We enjoyed some of the best prices in a long time considering the inflation. As far as all the figures you quoted.. I am certainly glad your wages went that much higher than the listed inflation rates..mine did not. And with the governmental climate going forward I think you will see much higher prices if not new taxes on many items. I would not be surprised to see a VAT. I do hope what I think is waaayyy off base. But the good ol days have just passed, I think. And I hope I am wrong

 

[BigBill]

The last 9 mm FMJ Wolf I purchased was $7/50 box. The last 45 acp FMJ Wolf was $62/500 box. Since the wolf 45 acp ammo isn't berdan primed I might try reloading it. I'm not worried about my future of shooting it's my kids future in shooting.